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About Tanager

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    At the head of the Potato Parade

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  1. Tanager

    China - meds or lights?

    BC 12t - early damage? I'm not looking for early damage in a tier 8 autoloader that sees tier 10s, especially not one with 170 base pen. 132 has 189 base pen - it's basically the same gun as the T-44, for all intents and purposes, albeit with lower APCR pen, but I rarely have to break out the premium in it, since I'm almost never shooting at the front of anything. With my crew + food, I get .34 or .35 dispersion, which is just fine. Compare the terrain resistance - the chinese lights are basically hovercraft, so they don't suffer as much from that lower power-to-weight (and it's not *that* much lower, they're still plenty mobile, not sluggish wannabe-meds like the blackdog). If you want to be a scout at tier 8, my personal choice is the t92 (which you for some reason failed to mention ), b/c that's got 400m base VR, spaceship camo, fantastic power-to-weight AND low terrain resistance, and...1215 mps APCR for its stock ammo. If you want to deal damage, I'd take the 132 any day over any other tier 8 save the blackdog, and while the blackdog is better at destroying lower tiers and other scouts, it has horrible shell velocity and is sluggish as hell, and the 132 deals with being bottom tier overall better, IMHO. Back to the OP - IMHO, the tier 7 and tier 8 scouts are a lot of fun to play. IF you like scouts. But noone is ever going to claim that any tier 9/10 scout beyond the T49 or maybe the 13 90 is really worth keeping, so if you're going to grind the entire line, just get past the mid tiers and grind Chinese heavies, which are pretty universally considered strong tanks at the upper tiers (9 and 10).
  2. Tanager

    China - meds or lights?

    I guess it's a matter of taste. The 132 has the best gun in tier, rivalled only by the blackdog (and I only mentioned tech tree scouts, I'll concede that the 13 57 and type 62 just make life difficult for 131, although the 131 is still solid). The 12t is...meh, IMHO. It has to rely on pure scouting until late game, it has real trouble dealing damage in the current meta other than during mop-up. LTTB is a toss-up - you have great mobility, worse camo, troll armor, but worse firepower. Blackdog has horrible camo but a really nice gun, which helps out. Probably the best counter-scout in tier. ELC even relies entirely too much on teammates, since it also struggles to inflict any damage on its own.
  3. Tanager

    China - meds or lights?

    The only drawback to the wz131 is that it's in the same tier as the 13 75 and t71 DA, both of which are complete facewreckers. The wz 132 is as good as or better than any other tech tree tier 8 scout IMHO, but for the gimped VR.
  4. Tanager

    China - meds or lights?

    Ummm...the Chinese scout line has the best guns at tier for tiers 7 and 8. They are not underarmed. The mobility is quite good as well. Not sure what you're thinking of @lavawing, but armament and mobility are not shortcomings of the line up through tier 8. Beyond that the guns turn into potato launchers. I loved both the 131 and the 132. The 59-16 used to be somewhat unique and really fun to play with spaceship camo and the autoloader, but without that, it's just a grind, nothing particularly good or unique about it. The 131 and 132 both have very powerful guns relative to tier - roughly equivalent to a standard medium gun at the same tier. The 131's gun is quite accurate, the 132's sufficiently so, but it's not a laser. The real shortcoming of the chinese tech tree lights is view range. The type 62 has 390, but the 131 has...370??? They got hit hard during TheGreatScoutNerfing, I believe. Hell, even the type 64 has 390 meters of base VR. (I will say that the prem lights are absofreakinglutely worth picking up.) If you can grind a great crew and are willing to run food, the Chinese lights are IMHO very solid tanks, and you can still play vision games at tier 7 (which has great MM as well). Since you brought it up, though, why not grind the Chinese heavies? The IS-2 can be a bit painful, and I absolutely loathed the 110, but the JuanQuattro is a good tank (although I suck in it), and the JuanCinco is considered one of the best in tier (I have yet to play it, personally). The 1-5 even picks up a full 7 degrees of gun depression. If you're going to sit around tiers 7 and 8, play the scouts IMHO. If you're looking to play tier 9 (or 10), grind the heavies and deal with the lower tiers as best you can on the way there.
  5. Tanager

    Elimination: Tier 9 - 2018

    So the RU 251 disappeared between this post: and this one: It had 17 points at the time - I'm fine with not adding it back, b/c we all know it isn't going to survive, just wanted to point out that we need to be kinda careful in copy/pasting.
  6. Tanager

    Elimination: Tier 9 - 2018

    I've played the hell out of it since they buffed it. And yeah, I even enjoy it - when I play it, I accept that my role is to be a combination meatshield-cum-claymore. Boring? I could see some saying that, although I don't find it boring. I like winning, losing is boring, and I can pull a consistent 58% in the doom turtle, which is well above my average. So yeah, I like it. I play all of my tier 9 TDs, honestly.
  7. Tanager

    Elimination: Tier 9 - 2018

    Did the RU 251 get eliminated already, and I missed it?
  8. Tanager

    Elimination: Tier 9 - 2018

    I never expected the thread to be anything more than subjective. It's a parlor game used to canvass the views of a group of players ranging from slightly above average (me, e.g.) up to genuine unica, and I'm totally okay with that - if you aggregate the views of enough reasonably good players who are willing to put some thought into their responses, I think you'll wind up with an acceptable consensus. I'd further assert that said consensus can be used by players like myself as a sufficiently accurate barometer of tank quality that you can at least pick out the utter garbage and know what's just not worth even attempting to play, given a choice. I'm good with that. Every one of these elimination threads has seen a similar debate about, "what does good mean" - I'm personally totally okay with it being in the eye of the beholder. Many of the better players have stated and well-known playstyles, or they're willing to qualify their answers with enough thoughtful rationale that you can tell, "well, would it be good for *me*?" within a not-extreme margin of error. All IMHO, of course, but that applies to the entire thread, too. (edit) I also enjoy threads like this. It's good to stimulate some actual discussion, and when I was a forum newbie, threads like this were what grabbed me most, so if this pulls in a few new posters who wonder why they've bothered to show up, that's a pretty good bonus.
  9. Tanager

    Elimination: Tier 9 - 2018

    I'm kinda amazed that JT got downvoted so early in the thread. T-10: 28 T-54: 26 AMX M4 51: 24 T49: 24 WZ-111 1-4: 24 Conqueror: 23 Type 4 Heavy: 22 E50: 21 E75: 21 + 1 = 22 Just so comfy, always felt like I was capable of influencing the battle for the benefit of my team. And I love the 128mm gun. AMX 30: 21 T30: 20 T95: 21 M46 Patton: 21 B-C 25t AP: 21 Skoda T50: 21 Leopard PTA: 20 Object 704: 20 Object 263: 20 WT Auf Pz. IV: 20 Object 430: 20 ST-I: 20 Tortoise: 20 AMX 13 90: 20 Mauschen: 20 STRV 103-0: 20 50TP: 20 Standard B: 20 Centurion 7/1: 19 T-54 LW: 17 Object 257: 17 WZ-132A: 17 WZ-120: 17 Object 705: 17 Jagdtiger: 17 T54E1: 15 Conway: 14 Foch: 14 WZ-111G FT: 14 VK 4502 (B): 12 - 3 = 9 Another "looks decent on paper, not good in actual gameplay" tank. I would play the M103 a thousand times over this. Type 61: 11. Emil II: 8 AMX 50 120: 8 M103: 5
  10. Tanager

    The P.43 Bis, 240 alpha ? Yes please !

    One game in, it seems to be decent brawler when top tier, the 140 pen is plenty for tier 6 as well. BUT...holy crap this mobility batman. Granted, I'm running a stock engine and upgraded tracks only, but still...I literally got outrun by an M6 on level ground. That 50 kph top speed is utter BS so far. Does it improve at all with the upgraded engines?
  11. Tanager

    Elimination: Tier 9 - 2018

    Being too lazy to read back, am I right in thinking that we reset the base score from 30 to 20? T-10: 27 AMX M4 51: 24 T49: 24 T-54: 24 + 1 = 25 The ultimate terrorizer of lower tiers, and there no maps in which you cannot find a way to make yourself useful. City map? Hull down/sidescrape while blasting HEAT if necessary. Better mobility than the tanks that come after it, to boot. Conqueror: 23 WZ-111 1-4: 23 Type 4 Heavy: 22 E50: 21 E75: 21 AMX 30: 21 T30: 20 T95: 21 M46 Patton: 21 B-C 25t AP: 21 Skoda T50: 21 Leopard PTA: 20 Object 704: 20 Object 263: 20 WT Auf Pz. IV: 20 Object 430: 20 ST-I: 20 Tortoise: 20 AMX 13 90: 20 Mauschen: 20 STRV 103-0: 20 50TP: 20 Standard B: 20 Centurion 7/1: 19 T-54 LW: 17 Object 257: 17 WZ-132A: 17 WZ-120: 17 Object 705: 17 Jagdtiger: 17 Conway: 17 VK4502B: 17 - 3 = 14 You want arty magnets? I'll give you your damned arty magnet. Evasive maneuvers in this mean the crew gets out and runs away. T54E1: 15 Foch: 14 Type 61: 14 WZ-111G FT: 14 Emil II: 11 AMX 50 120: 8 M103: 5
  12. Leaving aside the meta, I'm mostly just not good enough for tier 10, outside of a few bricks (e100, jpe100). I can do okay in those, but the gameplay for those is pretty brainless. I really don't play tier 10s much right now.
  13. This is a nice little tank. BUT...IMHO you really need to free XP the tracks and at least the second engine to make it playable. It's just so ungodly sluggish stock. After the upgrades it isn't anyone's idea of a burner, but at least you can outrace a Matilda. I'd recommend free XP'ing up to the second gun as well. At that point it becomes not only playable but actually rather enjoyable. The overall package is pretty decent, the gun is unquestionably the high point. I'm not winning much, but I'm managing about 500 dpg, which for me in a tier 4 is not bad at all. But for a couple of utter stinkers early on I'd be averaging about 600. This thing can pump it out nicely.
  14. Gawd am I glad I've been stockpiling free XP...
  15. Tanager

    P.43 ter: it ain't too shabby

    That isn't consistently true - the T20 and T-34-1 both have similar alpha (240 and 250 respectively) but have much better shell velocities, and of course the T20 can dial up that glorious prem round for a significant boost to shell velocity when sniping. The P.43 ter has easily the lowest velocity of the tech tree tier 7s.