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The hidden gem, Obj. 430 II

  

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  1. 1. Who's ze best?



100 posts in this topic

The armour while can be useful at times is different and less straightforward than E-50's (both pro and a con!), lacks the weight (raam!) and alpha of E-50. E-50 is the heavy medium.
T-54 is the moderately fast low medium with moderate armour, this one is just slightly less fast and slightly less turreted or depressed.
The fast mediums are fast.

 

This one is a curious, funny thing, but unsure if it shines at anything but being curiously funny and possibly a killer against pubbies. Really a fun machine to play, but not the one I would try to carry in. I like it a lot, more than Cent 7 or T-54 (both of which I considered keepers once), but less than E-50, leo A or Patton M46 - except sometimes when I want to be relaxed, that's when I fetch my 430 II out. It's not a bad tier 9 medium, there's just so many good ones... possibly with better pen.

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It's a really nice tank and very good at bullying. Probably not as strong as both M46 Patton or E50 but after the turret nerf of the T-54, I'd say the Object 430 II is at least as good.

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Replay

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Didn't realize I hadn't bought the engine.  Mounted it - tank is even guder.  

Too bad it is so fucking expensive to run.

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Im rezzing this post.

 

Im about 1/2 through my grind to obj 430 (no plan on buying it, for now. Just want to elite this bugger).

 

Do you guys avoid certain areas of the map, knowing you dont have the gun depression?

Do you feel handicapped or disadvantaged when playing this tank because of not being able to take early positions due to gun depression issues and/or the flatness + rear mounted turret?

What do you do to over come this?

 

I got used to only 180 degrees of gun arch and can play around it. Thats not the problem for me, its just... the tank just being so flat + being rear mounted, I find my brain scrambling on trying to figure out early positions where I could noreally get early damage in.

I end up trying to support my flank from the back by sniping a bit and moving up when my mediums push up. Do I play this like a Chinese medium? (Stay with the main group, up front hugging corners, derp on reload, flank around when the ground is flat and you see an opening)? What do you guys do early game?

I played and still play my Obj 416 like a mobile sniping platform (better camo than obj 430 ii), so im trying to even out my wn8 in this tank.

 

- thanks in advance!

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Obj 430 V II Is an unique medium...that forces you to make very unusual deployment, different both to the obj 416 (soft sniper, superb firepower) or T-54(true medium, but unreliable armor if concetrated)

For example, on Himmelsdorf you go tank alley...and block tier X heavies from advancing with the turret made of pure Stalinum.

Facehug things to death, do not try to circle...exept tanks like Maus.

You take engine damage instead of ammorack damage (T-54). And you burn often from engine fires, so no food...unless you want to run without medkit...

Sidescraping instead of ridge poking, facehug vs circle strafe...

Overall, i had same results regarding WR, but less dmg in Obj 430 V II. The tank is both more "flexible" and inflexible than T-54. You can play as a heavy if needed, and metagame changes are better to this tank than to T-54...since you have hulldown on flat ground in every city map...because your LFP is so small and easy to conceal

Played this tank after the VK4502B, and you have similar gameplay and positioning...you just can not advance until you have killed all the enemies in front of you. If you spam HEAT, even tier X heavies are getting hurt...and spam HE on you when they realize you are bouncing their gold ammo.

The speed, DPM, gun handling and accuracy allows you to kill any heavy that finds himself in front of you, and you dug in. 

You need to learn places where you can fake gun depression by reversing your ass on slight slopes.

Use the stock gun as the best one. But research the "top" gun, so when playing the T-54 later you need only to free exp the turret and have the playable tank...i went that way.

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Bumperino because I'm falling in love with this tank as I play it more.

As already stated it's bouncy as fuck due to pubbies having little experience with shooting at it. Quite mobile and the tried and tested stock gun which is basically a rebadged D-10T2S works well if willing to apply liberal HEAT when required.

Although personally I find it either has epic games or very mediocre ones, it's still very enjoyable to play when you adequately compensate for the terrible gun depression and rear turret.

Sadly I only have it on my NA alt that I rarely play, not sure I'm willing to redo the grind on my SEA account.

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You have epic games or bad ones because:

1. Armor is worse overall. In perfect spot it is stronger than 54, but even tier 7 can bonefire you (and will) if you don't or can't hide lfp. 54 bullies tier 8, tier 9 pen it very often.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

2. Module dmg. You have less hitpoints where you will still be effective in fight, but better armor usage. 54 will have penetrations all over, while allmost allours will be at lfp...so after 3x320 you are toasted, 54 has just repaired ammo rack.

 

 

3. HD nerf is real. Turret is no longer blessed by hand of Stalin.

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Say that to my car, haha. HD nerf was the hand of serb. E5 gets better tumor, 430 v2 worse? Sure.

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ez ace, tier 10 match on Shitfried Line...

too bad i derped too much at the end and got clipped by arta pidar, but still a decent game

(first kill was on CDC who stared the whole time at me without doing absolutely anything while i farmed all his 1400 hp, i guess that's what you get for playing at 6 AM :minglee:)

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The tank is not better than the e50/m46, very few people even play it, its expensive to run so it does not need a nerf. Having such great armor, t-54's gun (ZUBK4 <3 ) and track repair speed is balanced by 4° depression and rear mounted turret with limited turret rotation wich most players cant get used to (I never ever had problems with turret rotation cause the hull+ turret rotation can bring your gun around 180° in a second anyway). I myself have a wierd rear turret fetish so its no wonder this is my apsolute favourite tank. 

About the depression, why would you need anything more than 4° when you are gonna spend most of the time brawling with heavies - facehugging their lower plates cause you're that small.

I personally am so used to obj430ii's rear mounted turret that I sometimes find tier10 RU meds awkward :doge:

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6 hours ago, Jug0sLovEn said:

The tank is not better than the e50/m46, very few people even play it, its expensive to run so it does not need a nerf. Having such great armor, t-54's gun (ZUBK4 <3 ) and track repair speed is balanced by 4° depression and rear mounted turret with limited turret rotation wich most players cant get used to (I never ever had problems with turret rotation cause the hull+ turret rotation can bring your gun around 180° in a second anyway). I myself have a wierd rear turret fetish so its no wonder this is my apsolute favourite tank. 

About the depression, why would you need anything more than 4° when you are gonna spend most of the time brawling with heavies - facehugging their lower plates cause you're that small.

I personally am so used to obj430ii's rear mounted turret that I sometimes find tier10 RU meds awkward :doge:

I find the 430 awkward because I can't bully people any more.

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12 hours ago, GehakteMolen said:

I got a spare ru med crew, so will buy this one back with cristmas sales, last time it was mixed feelings :P

Imagine 2 in a platoon bullying an e100 ;) ... 

6 hours ago, lavawing said:

I find the 430 awkward because I can't bully people any more.

:kjugh:

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20 minutes ago, Hally said:

430 is awkward because a t-54 can do everything relevant it does and more. The only good part is lack of stock grind.

So not true! t-54 turret is literally shit, I pen it with AP while driving an FCM, good luck penning 430's turret with anything under 260/270 pen. T-54 cant sidescrape like obj 430ii cause of turret placement and it does not matter if you sidescrape or not t-54 turret will be sticking out for everyone to pen it.

Also those small things like brutaly fast track repair time of 430ii, lower profile and module/crew damage actually makes a difference.

Sure, 430ii cant peak over hills, has even less depression but its balanced out in other areas. They  (T-54 // Obj. 430 II)  are 2 totaly different tanks and if you expect another t-54 clone then ofc it will feal awkward. 2 different tanks - 2 different playstyles.

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3 minutes ago, Jug0sLovEn said:

So not true! t-54 turret is literally shit, I pen it with AP while driving an FCM, good luck penning 430's turret with anything under 260/270 pen. T-54 cant sidescrape like obj 430ii cause of turret placement and it does not matter if you sidescrape or not t-54 turret will be sticking out for everyone to pen it.

Also those small things like brutaly fast track repair time of 430ii, lower profile and module/crew damage actually makes a difference.

Sure, 430ii cant peak over hills, has even less depression but its balanced out in other areas. They  (T-54 // Obj. 430 II)  are 2 totaly different tanks and if you expect another t-54 clone then ofc it will feal awkward. 2 different tanks - 2 different playstyles.

Agreed. For starters, the v 2 is a facehugging god. It's better than the the T-54 and even the 430 in this regard. Once you stick your hull into their faces, unless they have 250 pen they have literally no chance of penning you. It also has a much tougher UFP part of which can bounce BL10s: this synergises well with the turret. I'd even argue that the v2 is a better heavy than the T10: unlike the latter you have no turret weakspots and you can angle the armour.

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There are not enough positions and situations to make good use of that turret armor to make up for the loss of flexibility due to rear turret with limited traverse and depression. Unlike the 416, you don't have an insane dpm advantage over your peers to make up for these shortcommings. Limiting exposure time with positioning and terrain abuse with the T-54 still get the job done; but you can do so in far more positions.

Fast track repair time doesn't do all that much in practice for a tank with limited traverse; it's kit or die most of the time. If you can get away without using a kit, you are probably going to get away with 1s longer repair time anyways. It is an advantage in niche situations, but not common enough to make up for the limited traverse.

I also disagree about the module damage. 430 II suffers badly when that potato E-100 throw a HE in your turret face, thanks to that frontal engine deck. This is a problem that hurts all rear turreted tanks. Large caliber HE to the turret face often wrecks your engine/fuel tank and give you fires. God help you if that shot goes low and actually plunges into your engine deck. For the 430II, it happens alarmingly more often than a taller tank like VKB due to height.

The ufp is not really better than the T-54; thanks to being so short, everyone shoots down into it, negating some of that slope. Thanks to turret positioning, you cannot russian wedge the hull effectively. The ufp is comparable to T-54 at best; better in some situations, worse in others. I have no trouble going right through with 246mm pen guns.

While the 430II can sit there trading shots with heavies from a sidescraping position; it rarely works out well thanks to the abundance of arty/183s, and many large caliber tanks carrying HE. On NA at least, if you bounce 2 - 3 shots, expect your opponents to throw HE at you. 430 II is pretty bad at eating HE shells.

430II is a niche tank. It is very strong if allowed to enter it's niche. The problem is.. that niche just doesn't happen often enough to make it a good tank compared to the T-54.

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12 hours ago, Hally said:

430II is a niche tank. It is very strong if allowed to enter it's niche. The problem is.. that niche just doesn't happen often enough to make it a good tank compared to the T-54.

I played almost 2k battles in both of them and Im telling you, you are wrong. Im sure now that either you havent played obj 430ii or you just play it like your everyday t-54/type59 clone.

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The 430 II is just glorious, much better for carrying games than T-54 if you ask me. Any decent player will just HEAT through the T-54 turret any time of the day, won't happen with the 430 II though.
It can also go hulldown in a lot of places cause it's a pancake and it can sidescrape damn well aswell.

It's just so fucking good.

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So I sold this little beast after I ground out the 430 (which then proceeded to never actually buy), but bought it back recently on a whim. 

This thing is definitely competitive with the E-50 for best T9 tank. The gun aim is much worse, but it has better DPM than the 105mm, plus comes with 330 heat. The poor AP round is only apparent if you are stingy and choose to not spam heat, but otherwise is functional for blasting through low armor tanks.

Armor is by far the biggest strength of this tank. If you can manage to hide the lower plate on anything (given how small it is, this is ez), it gives you such a large advantage in being able to out brawl any tank.

Mobility is excellent, with enough traverse to be able to circle most slower heavies and TDs without concern, and enough top speed to get to early farm positions quickly.

Camo wise it is insane. I think it has the smallest size of any higher tier medium tank, with the best base camo rating to compliment it (I may be wrong, I'm just assuming here). Crossing the south Gap on mountain pass next to a batchat, he got lit and shot at while I was dark the whole time. 

If people want I can try and upload some interesting games that showcase it.

 

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Yeah, upload some games please.  I was playing it on the CT and feeling like I wasn't using it to its strengths.  I'd almost decided to just stick with my Obj. 416 and not get the 430 II.  

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