Tiger (P), how do I love thee? Let me count the ways...

[Fishrokk 19]

No Tiger (P) love thread?  Interesting...

 

To the counting:

1) "We nailed them!"

2) "They dinged us!"

 

 

It is what I call a 'two-step tank'.

Step 1: Apply front toward enemy.

Step 2: Wreck face.

 

I know, small sample size so this amounts to first impressions.  We'll see if I can't keep up this performance and improve upon it.

[Rexxie 10,536]

It's pretty good at stomping bad players, but because the gun is unimpressive and the armor riddled with holes, good players will make you a laughingstock. I'd rather give up my ability to beat on bads and T5s so easily (lets be honest stomping these players with any T7 heavy isnt that hard anyway) and get some advantages good players can't avoid. Like, say, 1500 HP, good gun handling, and great DPM.

 

*cough*TigerH*/cough*

[TeaTime 228]

The Tiger P used to be maybe better than the Tiger H because of the armour. Since then, the Tiger H has gotten some pretty serious buffs while this tank hasn't. There's just nothing important going for it now. Weak points are huge, DPM is low, speed is not fast, cannot hull down effectively. What else is there?

[Fishrokk 19]

It's pretty good at stomping bad players, but because the gun is unimpressive...

 

It could be that with my low battle count in it, I haven't run into any serious opposition yet.  It could also be that mostly I've run this tank platooned, and probably half of those have been 3x Tiger (P) platoons.

 

The Tiger P used to be maybe better than the Tiger H because of the armour. Since then, the Tiger H has gotten some pretty serious buffs while this tank hasn't. There's just nothing important going for it now. Weak points are huge, DPM is low, speed is not fast, cannot hull down effectively. What else is there?

 

Well, if the DPM is low and the gun is unimpressive on the Tiger (P), don't you kind of have to say mostly the same things about the Tiger H?  Darn, I meant to edit this before posting - I do understand that the Tiger H has a higher ROF.  And, damn, I forgot I'm not on the official forums!

 

And I think that not having to hull down in the first place is an advantage.  When the only option for outbound fire is full-frontal exposure, as it usually is in a city brawl, I'd much rather be in my Tiger (P) than either a Tiger H or my T29.  And that might change for me yet - you guys are both at a higher skill plane than I am.

 

That said, I drove the Tiger H before the buffs, so I don't have an accurate comparison between the current versions of the two Tiger variants.

[TeaTime 228]

That said, I drove the Tiger H before the buffs, so I don't have an accurate comparison between the current versions of the two Tiger variants.

 

You should give it a go. The new Tiger can just walk up to a tier 8 heavy, trade hp in his face, and come out looking like a champ.

[Expendable_Lad 734]

Yup, with depression, gun, hp and middling speed, Tiger H can really control a mid/long range engagement and then move in to bat cleanup.

[Servios 463]

It has too many weak spots.

1) Cupola

2) Turret cheeks

3) Mantlet

4) Headlights

5) Lower glacis

#1, 2, 3: make it useless to hulldown

#4: ensures angling is pointless

#5: hiding this makes them shoot #1-4

Bonus: lower glacis is the best place to be shot at. When shot anywhere else, important stuff like crew members and the gun will become damaged. Side shots critical the ammo rack too!

[Expendable_Lad 734]

It has too many weak spots.

1) Cupola

2) Turret cheeks

3) Mantlet

4) Headlights

5) Lower glacis

#1, 2, 3: make it useless to hulldown

#4: ensures angling is pointless

#5: hiding this makes them shoot #1-4

Bonus: lower glacis is the best place to be shot at. When shot anywhere else, important stuff like crew members and the gun will become damaged. Side shots critical the ammo rack too!

 

Plus the turret ring is relatively huge. just no places to confidently expose. 

[Fishrokk 19]

 

U Wot M8?  Tigger (>P) sux!

 

Understood.

 

If they buffed the Tiger (P) rate of fire to match the Tiger H, would that tip the balance between the two variants to the (P)?  Or would the Tiger H still be a better tank?

[TeaTime 228]

P would be arguably better then. I thought P was stronger back when it had a slightly lower ROF than the H, because of it's ability to fight on the front lines better and be more effective as an actual heavy. The gap in the guns is just too big now though.

[The Impaler King 15]

The Tiger P was the first tank I wanted in the game, mainly because "I wants tiger, hurr durr double armor = better tank" I got to it just after the buff to the Tiger H, and in hindsight felt like an idiot. After a ton of battles in it, I think it's limitations outweigh it's dubious strengths.

Rexxie is absolutely right, the dpm is low, the alpha doesn't scare anyone, and unless you can hide the headlight against a wall while you angle anyone with half a brain just shoots there. A slow, low alpha, low dpm tank with a poor armor profile? No thanks. A fight between a H and a P Tiger will usually end with the Tiger P driver back in his garage raging at Ferdinand Porsche, and the Tiger H driver driving off to go punch things in the face.

Just my two cents.

[Sidus_Preclarum 378]

I prefer to fight Tigers H than Tigers P. Mostly because, not having to aim, I usually don't let Tigers H use that DPM of theirs, while having to actually aim when engaging a Tiger P up close means you sometimes get exposed too long. Also, frontally engaging (but usually while staying undetected, of at leat from superior cover) a Tiger P with long range shots results in more bounces, and makes me waste more time.

 

But at the same time, I love my Tiger H, and I'm certain that if I ever play the P it would be a huge disappointment. P is probably more noob friendly, but I don't see it scaling with skill much.

[Fishrokk 19]

This just in: crappy tank still refusing to be crappy.

 

 

"The Tiger P was the first tank I wanted in the game, mainly because "I wants tiger, hurr durr double armor = better tank" I got to it just after the buff to the Tiger H, and in hindsight felt like an idiot. After a ton of battles in it, I think it's limitations outweigh it's dubious strengths.

Rexxie is absolutely right, the dpm is low, the alpha doesn't scare anyone, and unless you can hide the headlight against a wall while you angle anyone with half a brain just shoots there. A slow, low alpha, low dpm tank with a poor armor profile? No thanks. A fight between a H and a P Tiger will usually end with the Tiger P driver back in his garage raging at Ferdinand Porsche, and the Tiger H driver driving off to go punch things in the face.

Just my two cents."

 

 

Oddly, the tank I have killed most of with it?  The Tiger I, at six enemy tanks destroyed.

[no_name_cro 2,033]

I always thought it is OK tank. Sometimes people bounce on it for no reason. Might try it again, but I don't hope for much. Before it was good tank, my bro had 1,2k games in it. With new higher pen guns, better accuracy and what not, this tank is losing race.

[Nicook5 451]

Wtf I never posted here.  Let it be known I had a furious love affair with the tigerP, although it has now lost its fierceness.  Was my first tier 7.  I learned how to win at a ~55% up from 50-51% rate with it.  2nd most battles (a bit under 700) after the type59 for credit grinding reasons.  It's armor is better than people give credit, kindof like the super persh.  When I mostly played it it was straight up better than the Tiger H tho.

[Embiggener 26]

I liked it enough when it first came out that I bought permanent camo for it.  It downright wrecked face back in the day when you would see tier 10's in it, simply because any gun then in the game could bounce on it and RNG would suck shots into your 200mm plates.

 

The first accuracy buff hurt it a bit, then the proliferation of sprem ammo didn't help much either.  The L/71 ROF nerf hurt it a lot more - then when the Tiger H got an ROF buff without a corresponding increase for the Tiger P, it really just got left behind.

 

I still have one with a crew kicking around, but I don't see any point in driving it.

[Rexxie 10,536]

Yeah, having repurchased the Tiger H today cemented my opinion of the Tiger P. There's just too much there for the Tig P to compete with it.

 

Here's one example of how it performs - I'm at 150 HP and the last guy alive against three or four tanks in a T9 game, but I know it's likely an opposing T25/2 was going to come around behind me. There's a rock nearby, so I sidescrape that position and get my gun aimed in on where the T25/2 is likely to pop up. He shows up and bounces off my side armor, I quickly reverse and nail him before he can hide. He tries it over and over until he's nearly out of HP, and then gives up, hiding. Moments later, a Roomba with the 150 shows up to my side. He has trouble getting his gun on me due to his poor gun elevation, but eventually manages it - except he whiffs the shot. He frantically tries to get away from me during his reload, but I autoaim, peek out, and fire on him every 5.5 secs whilst still in sidescrape against the now-hiding T25/2. All my shots hit and pen. The Roomba is down to 100 HP by the time he gets into cover. Now the T25/2 grows some balls and pushes onto me. He's right next to my sidescrape cover, and will be rounding any second. I realize that my best chance is to throw off his shot by speeding around my cover before he knows whats up - I autoaim him, floor it, and get the shot off before he can react, killing him. The match ends some moments later due to a 13 90 on cap. I go from 1600 to 3,000 damaged dealt through in this engagement alone.

 

Now, let's look at this and see what would of happened in a Tiger P. First off, while sidescraping against the T25/2, I would of presented a much bigger target when returning fire due to the frontal turret mount, slightly slower reverse acceleration, and the curved 80mm shoulders. I also would of had to have given him more chances to shoot back because of my longer reload. Assuming I wasn't punished for this, I would of then needed to deal with the flanking roomba. Due to the Tig P's vastly inferior DPM and worse gun handling (both aimtime and bloom), I probably would of missed once and lost out on two more shots worth of damage due to my longer reload time, leaving the Roomba with 800 HP instead of 100. With 800 HP, it's likely the roomba would of just sat in the open until his reload was up and finished me. Lets assume that didn't happen for whatever reason - now I would of needed to jump in front of the T25/2. Because of the Tiger P's sluggish acceleration and top speed, he'd of gotten an extra ~half a second to react to me.

 

Alright, that was a bit of a wall of text, but I hope you get my point - the Tiger H offers so much finesse and overall capability over the Tiger P that I can't just imagine any tanker worth his salt preferring the other option.

[boxty 54]

I hated how slow the Tiger P was.  Swamp, Redshire, and Erlenberg was in heavy rotation at the time so most of the time I could win my flank but miss out on the cleanup damage.  I don't remember ever catching fire so I started running the 105 octane fuel to give it a little more engine power.  It worked out a little better and I finished the grind without ever catching fire.  And I vividly remember surprising the heck out of several medium tanks with my ability to keep my gun on their tank as they tried to circle jerk me.

[Fishrokk 19]

-snip- (Seriously, lots of text!)

 

Just haven't gotten off my butt and repurchased the Tiger I yet.  Still on my shopping list, though!

 

Meantime, the Tiger (P) is just rolling for me since I got it.  I get that it might not be the best tier 7 heavy (my repurchase of the T29 has been paying even better dividends than the Tiger (P)), but I can't argue with something that's working well.

[monjardin 998]

OMG! This tank is so shit. It actually makes me want the VK 30.01 (P) back.

I've had a run of tier 9 games with really bad teams. It's exasperating.

[jokobet 217]

Yh, Tiger P was a boring grind but I found the VK A to be worse. Fortunately, you can just sneak the VK A into strongholds. 

[monjardin 998]

I just rage sold this thing. I couldn't win in it: like worse-than-a-bot win rate. It's inferior to a Tiger H in EVERY way. Only idiots actually shoot that part on the front that has better armor. At least a Tiger H can side-scrape if need be since it doesn't have the angled paper shoulders.

Tiger (P), 20 battles, 35% WR, 1219 DPG

Tiger I, 128, battles, 64.06% WR, 1492 DPG

[boxty 54]

I just rage sold this thing. I couldn't win in it: like worse-than-a-bot win rate.

Really?  Were you grinding it from stock? I think you just had a run of bad luck/bad MM.

I'm sorry to say that if you didn't like the Tiger P, I don't think you'll like the VK45.02A.  It has more speed than the Tiger P, but otherwise it has nothing else going for it.  I'm so glad to be finished with it.

[woe2you 352]

I just rage sold this thing. I couldn't win in it: like worse-than-a-bot win rate. It's inferior to a Tiger H in EVERY way. Only idiots actually shoot that part on the front that has better armor. At least a Tiger H can side-scrape if need be since it doesn't have the angled paper shoulders.

Tiger (P), 20 battles, 35% WR, 1219 DPG

Tiger I, 128, battles, 64.06% WR, 1492 DPG

20 games isn't enough to even look at the win rate.

[monjardin 998]

20 games isn't enough to even look at the win rate.

True, but it's sure enough to get pissed off and not want to play a slow tank full of weak spots. Sure, I had A LOT of tier 9 games with bad teams. However, I don't like tanks that can't influence a match when bottom tier. The gap between the Tiger (P) and the T29, T20 or Comet is astronomical, and I'm not going to play it again. Hell, even the AMX M4 45 had gun depression and 330 alpha going for it.

With the Tiger (P), it's chai-snipe or bust when bottom tier. It's too slow and misshapen to limit exposure when spotted. So, all you can do is farm damage off of teammate from positions that your slowness makes you settle for. That's sucks and SHOULD be a detriment to winning in the long term.