Itchi

O-I: Derp 2.0 - The Derpening

198 posts in this topic

1 hour ago, leggasiini said:

>I dont have the top gun yet

Thats the issue.

O-I's armor isnt godlike considering the MM and gold spam, but its still there to completely shit on tier 4-5 and some 6s who refuse to fire gold. Thing is, derp does the same trick as the KV-2 does. It has slightly worse reload (irrelevant tbh) and a bit worse HE pen, but better handling and accuracy so the derp isnt even worse. Its much bigger (tho KV-2 is already big) and slightly slower but in return the worst trait of the KV-2, the abysmal view range, is completely fixed.

So all in all its almost as good as the KV-2... and then it gets immunity against anything with sub 160mm gold pen. Thats why the tank is still dumb as hell; its just not even close as good as it used to be. All the earlier comments were posted when the MM was better and when it still had 150mm ass armor, hence. 10cm O-I is actually bad now, whereas the tank used to be OP even with that gun like 2.5 years ago.

Just play it like KV-2 with some extras in some situations.

Ah, so I should be playing it more timidly - a second line tank?  Fair enough.  I had been trying to use the armor to bully tanks, give a diamond angle to them and try to bounce some shit.

I suspect people just shoot my turret though. :/

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The upper hull directly behind the two little turrets and the two little turrets themselves are weak, especially to the 2 key.  Angling the tank doesn't really make the platform much better and makes the little turrets weaker by giving the enemy a flat side. 

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1 hour ago, Hellsfog said:

The upper hull directly behind the two little turrets and the two little turrets themselves are weak, especially to the 2 key.  Angling the tank doesn't really make the platform much better and makes the little turrets weaker by giving the enemy a flat side. 

Ugh.  Let me ask this then: is this line any fun to play, or is it just a mess of awkwardness until I hit Tier 9?  Because so far the thing doesn't just seem slow, it seems downright awkward, the armor would be good on a weaker tank but seems mostly pennable given its slow speed, and I don't even wanna tell you how many matches I get penned by 75% of the shots that hit me, get to fire once, it misses, and I die with a 0 damage match.

If the O-Ni and O-Ho are this awkward, it's hard for me to imagine putting up with it long enough to get a Type 4.

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22 minutes ago, FlorbFnarb said:

Ugh.  Let me ask this then: is this line any fun to play, or is it just a mess of awkwardness until I hit Tier 9?  Because so far the thing doesn't just seem slow, it seems downright awkward, the armor would be good on a weaker tank but seems mostly pennable given its slow speed, and I don't even wanna tell you how many matches I get penned by 75% of the shots that hit me, get to fire once, it misses, and I die with a 0 damage match.

If the O-Ni and O-Ho are this awkward, it's hard for me to imagine putting up with it long enough to get a Type 4.

It's a tier 6. I don't think it's realistic to expect any tank in that tier to be immune to premium ammo. That having been said, bully when top tier, support when mid or low tier.  The lfp is strong and most pubbies will shoot at it rather than the platform. Enjoy the substantial giggle factor of the derp.  

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1 hour ago, Hellsfog said:

It's a tier 6. I don't think it's realistic to expect any tank in that tier to be immune to premium ammo. That having been said, bully when top tier, support when mid or low tier.  The lfp is strong and most pubbies will shoot at it rather than the platform. Enjoy the substantial giggle factor of the derp.  

It's not just premium ammo that I'm getting penned by though, to be honest; I've had Hellcats repeatedly pen my front end with AP,  although again I have to assume they just shot my turret.

I've tried bullying, but unfortunately in this thing I have a tendency to find a KV-2 around every corner.  KV-2s tend to be meat on the table for any other tank I drive in that tier because of that giant bobblehead turret with the flat sides, but of course the O-I isn't gonna be able to avoid getting kaboomed.

Looking forward to the derp.

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1 hour ago, FlorbFnarb said:

It's not just premium ammo that I'm getting penned by though, to be honest; I've had Hellcats repeatedly pen my front end with AP,  although again I have to assume they just shot my turret.

I've tried bullying, but unfortunately in this thing I have a tendency to find a KV-2 around every corner.  KV-2s tend to be meat on the table for any other tank I drive in that tier because of that giant bobblehead turret with the flat sides, but of course the O-I isn't gonna be able to avoid getting kaboomed.

Looking forward to the derp.

Jap heavies have flat armour weak to  high pen, and kind of crappy AP guns. They only really get good when you get the derps since you then can afford to snap a lot of mid range targets and aim for tracks - limiting exposure - and making your armour effectively better.

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55 minutes ago, lavawing said:

Jap heavies have flat armour weak to  high pen, and kind of crappy AP guns. They only really get good when you get the derps since you then can afford to snap a lot of mid range targets and aim for tracks - limiting exposure - and making your armour effectively better.

Makes sense.

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The OI is essentially the ultimate manifestation of WG's new design goals. Stupidly strong traits and ludicrously poor weaknesses to the point of being impossible to defeat in situation A and useless in situation B with the influence of player skill minimized. The armor is the gimmick that renders some enemies useless against it while the terrible mobility and massive size are what keeps it from being competitive. Grind it and get rid of it.

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6 hours ago, Jesse_the_Scout said:

The OI is essentially the ultimate manifestation of WG's new design goals. Stupidly strong traits and ludicrously poor weaknesses to the point of being impossible to defeat in situation A and useless in situation B with the influence of player skill minimized. The armor is the gimmick that renders some enemies useless against it while the terrible mobility and massive size are what keeps it from being competitive. Grind it and get rid of it.

Ok...but then doesn’t that apply to the entire line?  Does that mean the entire line is pointless, and not much fun?

I had heard blapping people in the things was fun, at least at Tiers 9 and 10.  Are none of them particularly fun?

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The original O-1exp was a riot, and a great crew trainer.  Mine trained 3 crews to the first few skills.  They nerfed it and I sold it.  

The Type 5 is fun for shitting on Bobjects, Badgers, Super Conquerors and those fucking Swede wedges.  Before the HD bushes were introduced optics were a real giggle.  Type5 scout - best scout.  It is not as much fun now.

 One more Nerf and I'll dump it and move it's 5.5 skill crew into a power-creeped medium.

The rest of the line blows. 

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1 hour ago, j_galt said:

The original O-1exp was a riot, and a great crew trainer.  Mine trained 3 crews to the first few skills.  They nerfed it and I sold it.  

The Type 5 is fun for shitting on Bobjects, Badgers, Super Conquerors and those fucking Swede wedges.  Before the HD bushes were introduced optics were a real giggle.  Type5 scout - best scout.  It is not as much fun now.

 One more Nerf and I'll dump it and move it's 5.5 skill crew into a power-creeped medium.

The rest of the line blows. 

Man.  Now I’m debating whether to bother with the line at all.

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5 hours ago, FlorbFnarb said:

Man.  Now I’m debating whether to bother with the line at all. 

Yeah, I told you it was fun one night when we were platooned, but I did not consider when and how I had ground ("grinded" is an appalling hack of a word) the line. 

As I remember, I initially didn't bother to finish the line  because the higher tiers were slow and no fun.   When the Type 5 got the big derp I decided to finish the line specifically to shit on IS-7's and Mice. As I remember I made pretty liberal use free XP to do it.

Once WG finds the way to ruin the Type 5 I will be left with a real problem.  Where in the Japanese line do i put a 5.5 skill crew?  The WZ 131? Or just spend mucho gold to move it to another country?

RU Meds will always be the the safe choice for fun and payback for grinds.

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45 minutes ago, j_galt said:

Yeah, I told you it was fun one night when we were platooned, but I did not consider when and how I had ground ("grinded" is an appalling hack of a word) the line. 

As I remember, I initially didn't bother to finish the line  because the higher tiers were slow and no fun.   When the Type 5 got the big derp I decided to finish the line specifically to shit on IS-7's and Mice. As I remember I made pretty liberal use free XP to do it.

Once WG finds the way to ruin the Type 5 I will be left with a real problem.  Where in the Japanese line do i put a 5.5 skill crew?  The WZ 131? Or just spend mucho gold to move it to another country?

RU Meds will always be the the safe choice for fun and payback for grinds.

Yeah, I'm starting to get buyer's remorse over the O-I.  I really like tanks that can bully other tanks with armor, even if they pay for it with mobility - the KV-1 was always a good example - but now I'm wondering if the O-I can really do that...or much of anything until the Type 5.  I'm not really up for a line of un-fun tanks just to get to a Tier 10, even if the Tier 10 is fun.

As for RU meds, I'm grinding toward a T-54.  Also an E-50 eventually, although I have to suffer through the Panther II first.

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O-Ni is a much more comfortable machine because its a fair bit quicker (compared to an O-I) and the tits are symmetrical and are directly in front so you can reliably put your gun down besides them.

 

The O-Ho has asymmetrical tits which makes it near impossible to point your gun down on the left hand side. If you want to remain angled and point your gun down, do it on the right hand side. Its clunky as fuck if you need gun depression. 

 

Also, why derp guns are bad for the game:

shot_461.jpg

Not featured in screencap: Conq hit for 514 with HE. 

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My God I'm starting to loathe this tank worse than any tank I've ever hated before.  Out of the 5 matches I've played tonight, only one match had any significant number of shots bouncing off my armor.  In one match 1 of 4 shots bounced off my armor, in the other 3 it was literally zero bounces.  Not one.

Also, I got the derp after the second match, and overall I've had 3 zero-damage matches.  One was the first win of the night, naturally.

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As soon as I start bitching about how useless the thing is, it does this for me:

19dMkGt.jpg

Of course, 1300 of that came from one-shotting a T-34-3 by ammoracking him.

 

 

 

I can't hit a StuG at 100m with a fully-aimed shot, but I can snipe tanks across the Westfield valley.

Image result for downey rolling eyes

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2 hours ago, FlorbFnarb said:

My God I'm starting to loathe this tank worse than any tank I've ever hated before.  Out of the 5 matches I've played tonight, only one match had any significant number of shots bouncing off my armor.  In one match 1 of 4 shots bounced off my armor, in the other 3 it was literally zero bounces.  Not one.

Also, I got the derp after the second match, and overall I've had 3 zero-damage matches.  One was the first win of the night, naturally.

Don't rely on the armour, you're not a T-150, just use it to force favourable trades and you're golden/ also food + BIA help immensely on every Jap heavy

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3 hours ago, FlorbFnarb said:

I can't hit a StuG at 100m with a fully-aimed shot, but I can snipe tanks across the Westfield valley.

I underlined your mistake.

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12 hours ago, lavawing said:

Don't rely on the armour, you're not a T-150, just use it to force favourable trades and you're golden/ also food + BIA help immensely on every Jap heavy

Working on that.  Crew is still shit.  Haven't tried food yet though.  I probably should; the thing does seem to make credits well, even spamming HEAT.

11 hours ago, Madner Kami said:

I underlined your mistake.

lol

Aiming is for scrubs?

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I recommend not to use HEAT, its pointless IMO

The pen is too shitty for a gun like that. AP has worse pen yea but with normalization it isnt that much worse, and anything HEAT can pen, AP can as well. Not to mention the best thing about AP is overmatch ability, which the HEAT lacks. You can overmatch 49mm armor and below, which is huge for its tier. Tanks like T-34-85 and Cromwell are autopen for AP pmuch since sides get overmatched and front is weak when not angled. Not to mention AP is much cheaper

It can be better than AP for some niche targets, but thats about it. O-Ho's much faster reload and better handling means that HEAT is slightly more useful there than on O-I, but even then AP is superior. I dont remember ever loading HEAT with O-I lul. 

You should spam HE most of the time, tho. Both AP and HEAT are basically gamble. I load AP only when top tier.

Shitty crew may contribute as well. You dont need good crew, but not having full repairs and SS sucks ass for the O-I. You want at least those.

Food obviously helps. It can burn but not too often. Fuel tanks are on the upper-side-rear section (how you even call that lul).

Also you really shouldnt rely on your armor. Just dont. Its there as an extra if anything, really. Play it like KV-2 that has extra armor as bonus to shit on tanks with sub 160 pen.

EDIT: Saw your crew, and I can see it being contributor to yiur results lul. You WANT to have repairs first. Significantly more useful than any of the other skills you picked and should be number one priority with any armored heavy, especially a tank like O-I. Obviously you want sixth sense on commander, but I vastly recommend to retrain everyone else to get repairs. Its worth it. And when one of the loaders gets too 100%, get safe storage. Jap heavies have severe ammorack issues. Lastly, situational awareness doesnt stack, so you having two of them on two radiomen is literally a waste.

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31 minutes ago, leggasiini said:

Shitty crew may contribute as well. You dont need good crew, but not having full repairs and SS sucks ass for the O-I. You want at least those.

Food obviously helps. It can burn but not too often. Fuel tanks are on the upper-side-rear section (how you even call that lul).

Also you really shouldnt rely on your armor. Just dont. Its there as an extra if anything, really. Play it like KV-2 that has extra armor as bonus to shit on tanks with sub 160 pen.

EDIT: Saw your crew, and I can see it being contributor to yiur results lul. You WANT to have repairs first. Significantly more useful than any of the other skills you picked and should be number one priority with any armored heavy, especially a tank like O-I. Obviously you want sixth sense on commander, but I vastly recommend to retrain everyone else to get repairs. Its worth it. And when one of the loaders gets too 100%, get safe storage. Jap heavies have severe ammorack issues. Lastly, situational awareness doesnt stack, so you having two of them on two radiomen is literally a waste.

Agreed on firing AP/HEAT, but IMO SS and repairs get less important the higher the tier you get. The vision game is pretty much dead at t9/10, plus most engagements become 2-300m corridor gold fiestas. Instead, for a baddish crew, I'd rather maximise gun handling and comfort, i.e. smooth ride/snapshot, BIA, etc, etc, etc.

I played through the whole line till the Type 4 without ever having sixth sense. There were less than 10 games where I felt it made a difference. You can pretty much assume you're always spotted so long as you're within the viewrange circle of enemy tanks, and it's not like the jeavies are even remotely good at sniping.

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45 minutes ago, lavawing said:

Agreed on firing AP/HEAT, but IMO SS and repairs get less important the higher the tier you get. The vision game is pretty much dead at t9/10, plus most engagements become 2-300m corridor gold fiestas. Instead, for a baddish crew, I'd rather maximise gun handling and comfort, i.e. smooth ride/snapshot, BIA, etc, etc, etc.

I played through the whole line till the Type 4 without ever having sixth sense. There were less than 10 games where I felt it made a difference. You can pretty much assume you're always spotted so long as you're within the viewrange circle of enemy tanks, and it's not like the jeavies are even remotely good at sniping.

Maybe sixth sense isnt as important (Id still take it personally), but I still think repairs are way more useful than extremely marginal gun handling improvements. Jap heavies actually have pretty good bloom, but long aim time and awful base accuracy. Gun handling skills doesnt boost aim time and accuracy, so they are even less useful.

Repairs are important on all tiers. Like, without repairs, risk of getting permatracked is way higher. Also, just imagine all the games with more than one arty: imagine burning your repair kit, and then getting bombed by arties and tracked. +10 sec repair time with stun, so much fun. You could even get permatracked by arties, thats even worse. 

With good repair crew you dont have to necessarily burn your repair kit right away, since it takes only 5-6 sec to repair instead of +10 seconds, so you can save it in case you get tracked in worse situation few seconds later.

Repairs are not gonna make your tank massively better... but think about it: How often do you miss a shot just because you didnt have those super marginal improvements of handling skills? And better yet, how often you actually get screwed ovee because of it? I personally dont feel even any difference by boosting turning and turret traverse bloom by less than 0.01, so I take those skills only after repairs and BiA.

I still heavily recommend repairs. In fact, IMO repairs are better st higher tiers, not less useful. Its so much easier to destroy tracks with one shell at higher tiers than at lower tiers, not to mention people are way more likely to actually track you, and arties having bigger splash contributes, too (sure low-midtier arties have better RoF, but they most likely need to directly hit to track you). I would take BiA right when you hit 2nd skill, if you really dont care about SS, though (I still recommend it).

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Repairs is always important. 6th sense is still useful to know where tanks are in more open maps. 


Repairs is extremely important when arty tracks you in the open. It means you don't need to use your repair kit on your tracks after you poke because that's what you do a lot of because you can. 

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