leggasiini

Carrier thread

92 posts in this topic

To be of a opposite opinion, I'm finding myself loving and appreciating CVs out of all the classes. This is coming from someone who finds ABSOLUTELY no enjoyment in playing SPGs. SPGs in WoT amounts to spectator mode in multiplayer games for any WoWs player looking for reference.

I play RTS casually which means everything but campaign mode is too hard to figure out. The campaign modes to some extent, revolves around gawking at shit and getting immersed by the world about which appeases me in games, particularly city builders.

So put 2 + 2 together and WoWs CV gameplay CAN be enjoyable if you're the right type of person for it.

It's a breath of fresh air not being limited by the confines of the 1-life S&D mindset. I've played 19k battles in W.o.T so I damn as well need it.  Now instead of doing limited-scope grunt work and praying teammates can tug the rope along side, I can at least be flexible with potency by the numbers (3 squads with Hosho atm) while being extremely flexible in the mobility department (airplanes are faster than ships no doubt.

Plus you have to admit, the cinematic SHIFT view puts you in a satori when you can get a break from the managable micromanaging and you see the entire scope of the battle unfold. 

Lastly, I'm a fan of teamwork. CVs don't really need to depend on other ships aside from the bare necessity of going to the slaughter zones. CVs however can help their friends in a array of ways. I could easily scout that DD's for that BB on 5 kills. I can actually save that CA "SOS'ing" and keep that lucky/skill streak continue. I can "stack escort" my JP fighters with another CVs JP fighters and go to town on Langley/Bogues. It's just so gratifying and dynamic doing those things in team games.

Beyond that, I can't comment further as I'm still in my modest Hosho and overall inexperienced. I hope this experience keeps up for me later on. Even if it does get tiring, it's lightly taxing enough to put play a audio book or radio and enjoy the sights. Only experience will tell.

 

 

 

 

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I definitely enjoy playing carriers leagues more than I did arty.

 

And yes, the dynamic traits of the class do help with that.

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I tried the langley. It's a shitty little turdbucket and I hate it. You basically rely on your team not being fucking stupid and let through all the DDs. Fuck this thing.

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I couldn't wait to sell the langley... and the Bogue right after it. The independence was such a breath of fresh air when you finally have enough mobility to keep up with the fleet. Seriously though the entire USN CV line is such a turd until you get to tier 9/10. 

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I solely started carriers again to meet the 150 plane kill requirements for the mission that required it. I have never been comfortable with aggressive play styles in RTS games, I prefer the turtle style - which is useless for WoWs.  I played the required missions, using the Langley and the Bogue, and while I might someday finish the grind to the Independence, I probably won't unless a mission requirement forces me to use a tier 6 CV.  Of course I am an older "dad" player, with those reduced reflexes and unfocused concentration that is the evidence of being a bad CV player .  The idea of having to coordinate more than 3 squadrons seems overwhelming to me -  especially while trying to alt strafe with fighters while then manually dropping torps and bombs.

On the flip side, my 18 year old is incredible at Carriers compared to me, he is on top of everything that is going on and enjoys the chaos of being an opportunistic CV player.  I think that CV's attract a different type of player to the game, one that can potentially expand the user base when balanced properly into the other part of the game.

I reject the comparison that some people make between arty and CV's, there is simply no relationship between lining up a shot every 30-45 seconds and controlling multiple objects towards multiple objectives while balancing aiding teammates by spotting hidden enemies.  It  will be nice when the damage done by squadrons is balanced out with global AA values so that CV's are a complimentary part of the game, not just an afterthought or a dominator of battles.

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Recently started playing carriers. I have a two questions:

  • What do you guys normally do with a strike loadout? The Houshou has 1 fighter squadron and 2 torpedo squadrons. Should I have my fighters hang around/scout the area I plan to torp, or should I see what the enemy CV is doing and try to stop his bombers if they're going for my ship?
  • How does strafing work? Should you try to line it up so that they spend as much time as possible in the area of effect? Does the squadron speed up during the attack or slow down after it?

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1 hour ago, ThePowerOfLove said:

Recently started playing carriers. I have a two questions:

  • What do you guys normally do with a strike loadout? The Houshou has 1 fighter squadron and 2 torpedo squadrons. Should I have my fighters hang around/scout the area I plan to torp, or should I see what the enemy CV is doing and try to stop his bombers if they're going for my ship?
  • How does strafing work? Should you try to line it up so that they spend as much time as possible in the area of effect? Does the squadron speed up during the attack or slow down after it?

Playing IJN vs USN is basically cat and mouse.

You have no chance of winning against USN fighters but most langely players are brain dead so what you can do is show your fighter to him and he will come chasing your fighter. All you have to do now is send that fighter to one side of map and his fighter will still be pursuing yours, while you bomb the other side with your TBs.

At tier 4 you dont really need to scout torps since most of them are pretty short range. Do your best to scout the DDs though, but make sure you dont get caught by the USN fighters, you only have 4 fighters in reserve and once you lose 2 squads your TBs are pretty much screwed.

 

I normally advocate against strafing since its a noob trap but yesterday's patch buffed strafing (6x damage to 10x) for some stupid reason and now its basically an eraser. The way you should aim with strafe is that while your fighters go down the rectangle, at some point the enemy planes should be 1-4 planes lengths in front of them. Strafing used to increase the speed of the planes but I think they changed it so that now your planes slow down a little when the begin the strafe, then they go at normal speed for the duration of the run.

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1 hour ago, _Zergling said:

I normally advocate against strafing since its a noob trap but yesterday's patch buffed strafing (6x damage to 10x) for some stupid reason and now its basically an eraser. The way you should aim with strafe is that while your fighters go down the rectangle, at some point the enemy planes should be 1-4 planes lengths in front of them. Strafing used to increase the speed of the planes but I think they changed it so that now your planes slow down a little when the begin the strafe, then they go at normal speed for the duration of the run.

I think the amount of ammo used in a strafe has gone up dramatically compared to the previous versions performance.  You used to get two strafes per fighter group ( hard limit ) and still have ammo left over for regular engagement.  Now your fighter group is almost at WINCHESTER ammo after 1 strafe, so it is much more of a penalty if you miss your strafe attempt - which seems like a wise idea as far as balance goes.

I can see you are pretty incredible at CV's, so I feel you will know this answer; Are fighters stuck once they are engaged with enemy fighters?  It seems that once they are engaged, you can not pull them off to target a nearby enemy bomber squadron.  If so, it would be useful to glue up an enemies fighters with your own, to give your bombers an unimpeded strike at local ships ( at least until your fighters get killed off).  Since I only play a few CV matches every now and then ( all low tier and mostly PVE ) I don't have enough experience to see if this was an anomaly or a design choice.

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4 hours ago, ThePowerOfLove said:
  • What do you guys normally do with a strike loadout? The Houshou has 1 fighter squadron and 2 torpedo squadrons. Should I have my fighters hang around/scout the area I plan to torp, or should I see what the enemy CV is doing and try to stop his bombers if they're going for my ship?

I normally run Balanced Load out for flexibility... basically any load out that gives me the maximum number of bombers with at least 1 fighter squadron. Especially at low tiers where aircraft speed are slow relative to the size of the map, I'd use Fighters and DBs to scout, first concentrating on the middle and scouting out the initial deployment/direction of the main fleet. Then if the enemy aircraft haven't been spotted by then, check the map edges for a CV strike. Once you work out where the enemy fighters are (which there aren't that many of them at low tiers) you can send your TBs where they are not and you should be able to drop TB long before their fighters can intercept you. This is why scouting IMO is key to playing CV successfully. As to how to use your fighter tactically,I typically have this list of priority:

1) Take out fighters/catapult fighters that are keeping you from doing a normal DB or TB drop

2) Take out TB

3) Take out DB

4) Hit fighter squadrons only if you really have to otherwise just jockey for position to keep them away from important areas on the map. 

1 hour ago, BiggieD61 said:

I can see you are pretty incredible at CV's, so I feel you will know this answer; Are fighters stuck once they are engaged with enemy fighters?  It seems that once they are engaged, you can not pull them off to target a nearby enemy bomber squadron.  If so, it would be useful to glue up an enemies fighters with your own, to give your bombers an unimpeded strike at local ships ( at least until your fighters get killed off).  Since I only play a few CV matches every now and then ( all low tier and mostly PVE ) I don't have enough experience to see if this was an anomaly or a design choice.

Yes once the fighters are engaged they are pinned down, at least until one of them runs out of ammo (at least from what I've observed), and yes using your fighters to pin down the enemy fighters is primarily how I use them. This lets you run balance load out on USN CV up to the Lexington, and it's my opinion that it's the best of the 3 loadouts. I'm still testing things out on the Lexington but I feel that the 1/1/1 load out nerf on the Lexington made this no longer viable. You are simply out number too much against the majority of the loadouts for at Tier 8... Or i'm just bitter because I got ~5 games in my Lex before they took away one of my fighter squadrons. 

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On 3/10/2016 at 2:03 PM, OnboardG1 said:

The new strike load out is pretty disgusting with all those supercharged 1000lb bomb armed DBs.

I just hate losing having the flexibility of a fighter-scout. I've tested both DB and TBs and although DB does a lot more damage now than it does before I don't think it makes up for the loss of TBs; the striking power of (1/1/1) on the Lexington is still better than Anti-air build (2/0/2). I suppose I should try out a full strike loadout. I just hate the randomness of DB where in one perfect drop you can get 1/6 hits sometimes and 4/6 at another time... it is just not as reliable as TBs. 

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Been liking CV play so far.  INteresting and strategic and much more interesting than playing arty.  Now have Independence, but the glacial speed of Bogue and Langley made you DD fodder, especially with unaware teams.

Hate to say it, but I prefer the fighter loadouts lately. Keep one DB squad, but then know I can crush any airborn opposition that comes my way. I know, as Onboard put so well, that taking that loadout is basically a "the best I can do is nullify other carriers and do only token damage", but having played on so many teams with poor air cover where my Jap CCs or BBs just get caught and litup by multiple torpedo squadrons, I wanted to be that guy that annihilated the enemy air so my team could play their parts.

Had a few 50+ plane kill games in my Bogue. 

Do people ever manually aim DBs on DDs?  That seems really tough. I manually aim both torps and bombs against just about everything else. 

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36 minutes ago, Expendable_Lad said:

Been liking CV play so far.  INteresting and strategic and much more interesting than playing arty.  Now have Independence, but the glacial speed of Bogue and Langley made you DD fodder, especially with unaware teams.

Hate to say it, but I prefer the fighter loadouts lately. Keep one DB squad, but then know I can crush any airborn opposition that comes my way. I know, as Onboard put so well, that taking that loadout is basically a "the best I can do is nullify other carriers and do only token damage", but having played on so many teams with poor air cover where my Jap CCs or BBs just get caught and litup by multiple torpedo squadrons, I wanted to be that guy that annihilated the enemy air so my team could play their parts.

Had a few 50+ plane kill games in my Bogue. 

Do people ever manually aim DBs on DDs?  That seems really tough. I manually aim both torps and bombs against just about everything else. 

I don't usually manually aim DB on DD unless they're stationary or not turning.  Like you I manually aim everything else, except for when I'm about to die.  If you have planes in route to a target and it looks like you're gonna die before they get there, quickly auto target them and they will complete the attack.  It's surprising how many hits still get on auto aim.

As for fighter loadout to protect fleet.  I find that if a BB is too stupid to dodge most of the torps, then he likely isn't worth saving and you would have done more damage than him if you had a strike loadout.  Also, it's really shitty, boring, gameplay to do AA load.

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1 hour ago, Expendable_Lad said:

Do people ever manually aim DBs on DDs?  That seems really tough. I manually aim both torps and bombs against just about everything else. 

Occasionally if the DD isn't paying attention, which happens more often than you'd think. IJN Manual drop also have a tighter pattern so if you are good at predicting where they'll be, you'll be able to hit them with at least one bomb for sure. If they are actively dodging, then forget about it. 

31 minutes ago, engineered said:

As for fighter loadout to protect fleet.  I find that if a BB is too stupid to dodge most of the torps, then he likely isn't worth saving and you would have done more damage than him if you had a strike loadout.  Also, it's really shitty, boring, gameplay to do AA load.

Exactly my thought. 

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Good advice y'all.  

The reason I went with fighter loadout on Bogue (only have 1 game on ranger) is that a balanced loadout didn't exist, so either no fighters or 2. Expect that will change wince I can get one of each on Ranger to make for some more adaptable gameplay. So this is my first chance to get used to strictly balanced loadout.  I'll make the most of it. 

As for too stupid to dodge, with two full torp squads with a somewhat compentant CV controller incoming and in a long BB, manually aiming at correct targets, I can usually make it out taking 2 torps, I don't know how I could do much better than that. 

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5 minutes ago, Expendable_Lad said:

As for too stupid to dodge, with two full torp squads with a somewhat compentant CV controller incoming and in a long BB, manually aiming at correct targets, I can usually make it out taking 2 torps, I don't know how I could do much better than that. 

Right, against a good CV player it's going to be hard to do much better than that.  Sadly too many BBs don't react, react too late, turn the wrong way, etc. and end up taking the majority of the torps.

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1 minute ago, engineered said:

Right, against a good CV player it's going to be hard to do much better than that.  Sadly too many BBs don't react, react too late, turn the wrong way, etc. and end up taking the majority of the torps.

I mean sinking 4/5 or 5/5 torps into a slow BB as he curls into your spread that you launched slightly coming back into his path is the friggin best. Hard to imagine what is going through the heads of some of these guys, or maybe they are completely tunneled out in their sniper mode. 

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If a cv uses hammer and anvil drop tactics a BB is helpless. Even DDs will get hit. So if 2 CVs work together and BB is dead unless there are lots of covering CAs around.

 

Hammer and Anvil tactics are 1 TB squadron drops Torps off of one of a ships bow forcing a turn into the drop. Then all the others TBs drop their Torps off the opposite side of the ship. This equals 1 crippled or sunk BB. Nothing a BB can do if this is well executed.

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I find hammer and anvil drops isn't necessary against BBs and it's just more efficient to either double stack the drop or stagger the drop (which has a similar effect as hammer and anvil due to slow rudder shift). I do use it against nimble CAs and DDs though... but DDs can sometimes still slip through this kind of drops making DDs a very high risk/reward targets for CV drivers. 

 

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Watched some of Flamu's CV replays/live cast, and holy balls. Dude puts a lot of thought into what he does with them. I frankly dont have the multi-tasking ability to play them successfully it seems, but yeah the only RNG I saw in his replays is the # of planes shot down while on a run

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yep.  they have a fairly high skill cap, especially high tier IJN ones (arguably the highest one in the game IMO).

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On 29 June 2016 at 7:09 PM, TheMarine0341 said:

Watched some of Flamu's CV replays/live cast, and holy balls. Dude puts a lot of thought into what he does with them. I frankly dont have the multi-tasking ability to play them successfully it seems, but yeah the only RNG I saw in his replays is the # of planes shot down while on a run

There are four or five world class CV players I know (Flamu is one, strangers123 is another) who phenomenally good at this. I'm decent at CVs but nowhere in their league. Check out Farazelleth too.

 

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On ‎6‎/‎29‎/‎2016 at 2:09 PM, TheMarine0341 said:

Watched some of Flamu's CV replays/live cast, and holy balls. Dude puts a lot of thought into what he does with them. I frankly dont have the multi-tasking ability to play them successfully it seems, but yeah the only RNG I saw in his replays is the # of planes shot down while on a run

Lols ... me too I'm a two fingered typist barely coordinated enough to tie my shoes or feed myself let alone multitask CAGs and run CVs .... lucky I can run a DD or a BB.  Tried the CV's and said NOPE!

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