monjardin

What’s Ahead for World of Tanks

109 posts in this topic

12 hours ago, GehakteMolen said:

only when skill scaling tier looks like this:

Skill_wot.png

Wg will stop buffing heavys / nerfing the rest, mark my words...

I mean that's exactly how things are now, TDS are shit, heavys are playable (or broken if you take the E5 into account), and meds are the best, and a retard will do much better in a heavy than in anything else. So ? They should let things as is. With the tier X lights, and this retarded new MM they're proposing, expect tier IV levels of vision at tier X, so in any non city map, you have to  depend 100% on the average mouth breather in a LT that tends to be alive for ~1.5 mins per match (and WG said that in the actual corridor meta people get killed by invis tanks, i can't even begin to image the piece of shit that high tiers will be after nerfing every single good tank in the game + forcing arty + removing vision), yay, or mount binocs + food + 4 skill crew and stay still, SO MUCH FUN.

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Maybe I can play lights in toon then without everyone raging at me...

If only light tanks get vision, then the meta will just shift, some shitty padders will drop to their actual green levels again, and the rest will adapt. 

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22 hours ago, Stridsvagn 74 said:

It currently is, but I did some testing of the total balance pass coming out in February (early model) (you can see a version in Russian streams) and its damn good. The main problem wont be the game or developers (modelers moving to russia but balance is staying at OE), it will be population. Population is at a point where its a death spiral caused by itself, and it will need both Steam and major streamers to kickstart it. The game itself will have exceptionally fair power scaling, for one, and the removal of overhead arty... so there is that. 

 

Seriously. Post Balance 2.0 AW will be better than wot, especially with how wot is going downhill. The problem is that it could be / probably will be too late.

I've not played the balance 2.0 stuff yet, but I am still in a position to know Stuff™ that average joe does not.    This lines up pretty well with my thoughts of the situation.  Especially after considering the extra info, the only real reason to play WoT over AW at that point beyond population in my eyes is if you like WW2 more than modern stuff.  Needless to say, I've been quite happy with what's planned to happen and most of my complaints are being addressed.

AW population is a huge issue on NA and I believe still an issue for EU currently, but the RU side of things is still there to keep the game alive for now.  If this balance 2.0 works out and players come back, I'll be a happy man.  Only tank-related news that could make me be happier is if War Thunder was taken away from Gaijin and given to competent developers and such instead.

 

11 hours ago, hall0 said:

Muricans get some beefed up Sheridan

15542009_1726375007690035_78869160683524

 

That's the first pilot model of the XM551, so a prototype Sheridan.  The boxy shape is just from floatation stuff, so the tank itself is actually not as fat as it looks.  The tank it armored with aluminum and the box shape comes from foam covered with sheet metal, so I'll be interested in seeing how WG models that armor.  It also was only powered with a 285 horsepower engine, so something would need to be done there as well.

Uyg7uXT.png

 

11 hours ago, Waemoth said:

It looks mostly like the hull of the Raketenjagdpanzer, but with a slightly raised enginedeck.

That's because the Raketenjagdpanzer was built on an HS-30 chassis

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59 minutes ago, TheMostComfortableTanker said:

That's because the Raketenjagdpanzer was built on an HS-30 chassis

Just pointing out that it looks more like the Raketenjagdpanzer than the HS-30.

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1 hour ago, WorldConqueror said:

I wonder what'll happen to premium lights like the Type 62 and Blackdog.

Trier 9 prem like Wows? 

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All I remember from sandbox was NATO tanks were utter garbage and died to hover wedges in droves, bouncing side turret shots on heavy tanks from 250 meters cause 'too far', and getting up and walking away from my keyboard while perma-stunned.  You can nerf accuracy OR you can nerf pen, but if you nerf BOTH it becomes 'World of Knife Fighting' and I'm outta here.  

Make HE great again :serb:

I'm not going to be that asshole that comes to wotlabs and cries about 'historical realtank' BS, but there is a reason the notion of TDs and heavy tanks died out to medium tanks in the 1950s.  An accurate gun on a mobile platform >>>> armor and boomsticks.

Fuck arty, WG implemented a broken mechanic early on to solve a problem that never really came to fruition.  Now they are stuck with trying to figure out how to keep it relevant while justifying the ability to shoot tanks that can't shoot back with huge bullets from space.  Just give the players back their XP and get rid of sky cancer.  There are actually a lot fewer dedicated sky-pigs than you think.  

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46 minutes ago, Archaic_One said:

All I remember from sandbox was NATO tanks were utter garbage and died to hover wedges in droves, bouncing side turret shots on heavy tanks from 250 meters cause 'too far', and getting up and walking away from my keyboard while perma-stunned.  You can nerf accuracy OR you can nerf pen, but if you nerf BOTH it becomes 'World of Knife Fighting' and I'm outta here.  

Make HE great again :serb:

I'm not going to be that asshole that comes to wotlabs and cries about 'historical realtank' BS, but there is a reason the notion of TDs and heavy tanks died out to medium tanks in the 1950s.  An accurate gun on a mobile platform >>>> armor and boomsticks.

Fuck arty, WG implemented a broken mechanic early on to solve a problem that never really came to fruition.  Now they are stuck with trying to figure out how to keep it relevant while justifying the ability to shoot tanks that can't shoot back with huge bullets from space.  Just give the players back their XP and get rid of sky cancer.  There are actually a lot fewer dedicated sky-pigs than you think.  

What?

Best tier 10 meds where:

  • Wz-121
  • STB
  • E50m

M48 and leopard where also good, Amx-30 was trash (but got mega buffed close before the end)

meanwhile, T62 was utter trash and Obj 140 was ``ok`` (at best)

seriously: new #1 tank (if sandbox had gone live) would have been either STB or Wz-121, not ``ru wedges`` or fucking jack of all shit heavys like E5 or Fv 215b

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I don't know what data WG has that suggests that removal of arty would cause droves of players to leave. I've played more arty than a lot of people on this forum, and I'd not shed a single tear if it were removed. I have a buddy that's truly bad at this game, and he curses arty even more than I do. He can never get it to hit, and he can't figure out how to stay safe. As if I weren't already convinced that WG pulls things out their asses on the regular, this "mass exodus" idea is bogus. 

If people like arty THAT MUCH, why doesn't WG invest in the general stupidity of the populace and invent a game about squishing bugs?

 

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13 hours ago, TheMostComfortableTanker said:

I've not played the balance 2.0 stuff yet, but I am still in a position to know Stuff™ that average joe does not.    This lines up pretty well with my thoughts of the situation.  Especially after considering the extra info, the only real reason to play WoT over AW at that point beyond population in my eyes is if you like WW2 more than modern stuff.  Needless to say, I've been quite happy with what's planned to happen and most of my complaints are being addressed.

The interesting news today of 5v5 PvP on smaller maps segmented from the larger ones (up to the new 1.8x1.8 one) is also interesting, because 3v3 or 5v5 with platooning disabled could be sustainable on NA. I mean, NA PvE runs well and requires 5 players, 6 should not be an issue. 

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@GehakteMolen

I was not actually considering the E-50M as a NATO tank, it was definitely very good. 

Realizing how much better than me you are is an apples to oranges comparison - you must have played a different SB than me.   I once bounced/missed 6 (SIX!) fully aimed shots from a stationary hull down M48 at several oncoming 140/62s crossing an open field.  They then arrived at our location with their DPM and delivered excellent customer service to our unarmored NATO 'support tanks' and slaughtered us like goats.  With accuracy and pen nerfs, trading shots at distance was a no-go for unarmored support tanks.

On another occasion, I was part of a group of mediums that fought for and won the island on mines, we then had side shots on the Maus/E100s on the hill.  Could not pen shit with APCR or HEAT.  Winning that flank was useless to us because our Tier X tanks could not pen super heavies from the side at distance of ~300m.  The HEAT nerf was brutal in the SB.

If I was better, I'm sure I probably could have gotten more out of the SB, but I will never ever be a guy that plays slow ponderous tanks.  I like the sniappy US medium play style and it suffers a lot in the SB iteration of the game.  

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8 hours ago, Archaic_One said:

Make HE great again :serb:

I'm not going to be that asshole that comes to wotlabs and cries about 'historical realtank' BS, but there is a reason the notion of TDs and heavy tanks died out to medium tanks in the 1950s.  An accurate gun on a mobile platform >>>> armor and boomsticks.

While TDs have always sucked and were at all times stopgaps built from inferior chassis to fit bigger guns, I'd argue that the reason heavy tanks died out was because (1) they were too expensive, and (2) HEAT, and (3) the realisation that making your tank tiny and not getting hit made for better protection than creating a bloated carcasse on tracks.

However you put it, it was not because armour and boomsticks became irrelevant, quite the opposite, tanks have always been about armour and boomsticks, and machines like the Chieftain and the T-64 were no worse armoured than earlier heavy tanks while mounting, if nothing else, even bigger guns. And actually, most 'modern' tanks outside of a few Japanese, Korean, and Russian oddballs, in terms of weight at least, are well into what is historically heavy tank category. What makes them MBTs is that they are both accurate and mobile, and heavily armed and armoured. Even though the concept might not have existed at the time of their design, tanks like the IS-7 and 113 (had it even existed) would come very close to MBTs if a bit on the heavy side, that is.

How do I explain the Leopard 1 and the STB-1, then? Well, when the designers of those vehicles realised they couldn't keep up with the armour race, they resigned to creating something that could take out other tanks effectively. Which makes them closer in nature to TDs then actual tanks, that can, you know, tank things.

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15 hours ago, lavawing said:

While TDs have always sucked and were at all times stopgaps built from inferior chassis to fit bigger guns, I'd argue that the reason heavy tanks died out was because (1) they were too expensive, and (2) HEAT, and (3) the realisation that making your tank tiny and not getting hit made for better protection than creating a bloated carcasse on tracks.

However you put it, it was not because armour and boomsticks became irrelevant, quite the opposite, tanks have always been about armour and boomsticks, and machines like the Chieftain and the T-64 were no worse armoured than earlier heavy tanks while mounting, if nothing else, even bigger guns. And actually, most 'modern' tanks outside of a few Japanese, Korean, and Russian oddballs, in terms of weight at least, are well into what is historically heavy tank category. What makes them MBTs is that they are both accurate and mobile, and heavily armed and armoured. Even though the concept might not have existed at the time of their design, tanks like the IS-7 and 113 (had it even existed) would come very close to MBTs if a bit on the heavy side, that is.

How do I explain the Leopard 1 and the STB-1, then? Well, when the designers of those vehicles realised they couldn't keep up with the armour race, they resigned to creating something that could take out other tanks effectively. Which makes them closer in nature to TDs then actual tanks, that can, you know, tank things.

Its even simpler, for the cost of 1 IS7 you had like 4 T54`s, and when you are planning for a nuclear war in parallel to normal fighting, your T54 will do better as 1 IS7 (and the heavier, the more complex a machine becomes, unless you want sacrifice reliability)

at the same time HEAT made large caliber guns obsolete + there is only so much power a gun can handle, even modern guns are only around as ``powerfull`` as the 128mm mounted on the JT (in terms of MJoule / KE)

And ofc also lots of bias, the ``amazing centurion`` was in both size, weight and armor a Panther (and also slower) only later models where better armored and better armed, same Conq and M103 where as big and heavy as a King Tiger, while beiing as slow, if not slower...

mandatory Panther superiorty:

(and why hp/ton is a lie, not only in wot, but also RL...)

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The arty limit is pointless, it just means we'll have less arty free games and more 3 arty games. 3 arty games are already cancer, 4/5 are so rare it's not going to change much. 

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On 12/18/2016 at 0:07 AM, Stridsvagn 74 said:

Seriously. Post Balance 2.0 AW will be better than wot, especially with how wot is going downhill. The problem is that it could be / probably will be too late.

You never get a second chance at a first impression. I have some premium content for AW, but will likely never be back. 

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3 hours ago, tajj7 said:

The arty limit is pointless, it just means we'll have less arty free games and more 3 arty games. 3 arty games are already cancer, 4/5 are so rare it's not going to change much. 

The arty limit is not pointless, it's one more tiny little thing that Wargaming can point to and claim that they are working to fix arty. It helps them distract the playerbase from the fact that the basic gameplay mechanics that makes arty shit are still 100% here five years later. 

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1 hour ago, dualmaster333 said:

The arty limit is not pointless, it's one more tiny little thing that Wargaming can point to and claim that they are working to fix arty. It helps them distract the playerbase from the fact that the basic gameplay mechanics that makes arty shit are still 100% here five years later. 

Distract them? I kinda believe that most players are clueless of how this game works. Just try to casual chat with any player in random or think about all those who on Steppes encounter dont go to def base for whatever reason. Arty is shit but there will still be people who defend it thinking it is a good idea since i prevents players from being in good positions. Arty is here to stop better players. And they know it. It is like rng, HE based tanks, high alpha (which strangely defines one "special type of tank class" wink wink) helping players to compansate their inability and adding the slot machine addiction effect.

At the same time they know that many bad players like play big game brawl and big tanks so it explains the buffs to heavies and nerf to tds. Which now gives us a game with a map rotation of arty "safe" maps (corridors/city) or arty fest maps aka shit maps.

As we all know arty removal would be the best option for this game if then it would be followed by a proper map rework, rng adjustment, rebalancement of HE tanks ecc. Sure you might lose some of the playerbase but you will gain, if things go and are done well, a bigger playerbase. 

But to do so it will require guts, a thing that many companies dont have plus they have a business that already works and grants a profitable income. Also all the changes they have to make require investement (altough sandbox seemed to hint their desire towards a change) without knowing exacly what or how they can do. 

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On 12/19/2016 at 9:23 AM, WorldConqueror said:

I wonder what'll happen to premium lights like the Type 62 and Blackdog.

Type 62 should be fine since the Chinese lights aren't moving tiers.

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The best nerf to arty they could make is removing xvm and enemy names. 

 

They don't need to ban xvm, just remove all players names info from ennemy team. Good players get shit on less. Average and baddy enjoy more of their arty love. Everybody is happy until they do something more drastic.

 

Even arty players wouldn't be mad about the change. No need to reimburse theirs arty lines. 

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6 hours ago, DHP said:

The best nerf to arty they could make is removing xvm and enemy names. 

 

They don't need to ban xvm, just remove all players names info from ennemy team. Good players get shit on less. Average and baddy enjoy more of their arty love. Everybody is happy until they do something more drastic.

 

Even arty players wouldn't be mad about the change. No need to reimburse theirs arty lines. 

This is just so fundamentally untrue. Good players don't get hit by arty because they have better stats, they get hit because they are in the good spots trying to control the front. 

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4 minutes ago, zyl said:

This is just so fundamentally untrue. Good players don't get hit by arty because they have better stats, they get hit because they are in the good spots trying to control the front. 

So why an ally in X tier tank is arty safe while I'm screwed up in VIII?

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34 minutes ago, MacusFlash said:

So why an ally in X tier tank is arty safe while I'm screwed up in VIII?

Kinda broken English, but I think you are asking why a tier 8 would get hit over a tier 10? Then answer is probably that you are trying to bait shots and get control of a situation, while the tier 10 is waiting for you to do all the work so he can farm the damage.

I will forever maintain that it is correlation, not causation, that lends to unicums being artied. Great example: I saw a good player in a destroyer go to the middle in Fisherman's Bay. Arty picked him to shoot at. Was it because he was the better stat player, or because destroyers are less agile than the mediums that were around him, and he was ridge poking in a straight line getting shots?

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26 minutes ago, zyl said:

Kinda broken English, but I think you are asking why a tier 8 would get hit over a tier 10? Then answer is probably that you are trying to bait shots and get control of a situation, while the tier 10 is waiting for you to do all the work so he can farm the damage.

I will forever maintain that it is correlation, not causation, that lends to unicums being artied. Great example: I saw a good player in a destroyer go to the middle in Fisherman's Bay. Arty picked him to shoot at. Was it because he was the better stat player, or because destroyers are less agile than the mediums that were around him, and he was ridge poking in a straight line getting shots?

its not, its 100% xvm hunt, when im top tie ri get bombed, when om bottom tier i get bombed, when im a paper medium i get shot, when im heavy i get shot.

Arty sometimes prefers to try and splash kill my IS3 behind a rock as kill the IS7 in the open, same seeing an arty with 1k dmg and 3 shots, all 3 at me, is not strange.

Anyone not full dark purple has no idea how hard arty targets xvm (imo test server >>>> normal server in terms of gameplay even with 4 arty every game i get killed by arty far, far less...)

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38 minutes ago, zyl said:

Kinda broken English, but I think you are asking why a tier 8 would get hit over a tier 10? Then answer is probably that you are trying to bait shots and get control of a situation, while the tier 10 is waiting for you to do all the work so he can farm the damage.

I will forever maintain that it is correlation, not causation, that lends to unicums being artied. Great example: I saw a good player in a destroyer go to the middle in Fisherman's Bay. Arty picked him to shoot at. Was it because he was the better stat player, or because destroyers are less agile than the mediums that were around him, and he was ridge poking in a straight line getting shots?

http://wotreplays.eu/site/3171802?secret=b32cfdbc897958fea2e0355e01f45dbf 

Arty shooting at me instead of FV. 

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