ProfessorMunroe

VK100.01 - the new "Mini-Maus"?

73 posts in this topic

Picked this bad boy up as soon as I got home as I make my way towards the Maus (never though I'd say that).  I'm actually likin' it quite a bit and the armor has worked better than I expected. It can feel godlike in T8 games and is still serviceable in T10.  Anyone else liking this thing?

 

There are my stats thus far, all solo (but with liberal gold rounds).  There were 7 steel walls in those 24 games, including at least one at T10.

1z4v79h.png

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I know it's probably a trade secret, but where are the weak points on that thing? I've just been shooting lower glacias with moderate to high success. Is it like the tiger 2 where you can just punch through the upper plate if you're in a tier 10? And what about the cupola? Been bouncing off that a shit ton. Basically, frontally, where have you noticed you're getting penned?

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21 minutes ago, KenyanWarlord said:

I know it's probably a trade secret, but where are the weak points on that thing? I've just been shooting lower glacias with moderate to high success. Is it like the tiger 2 where you can just punch through the upper plate if you're in a tier 10? And what about the cupola? Been bouncing off that a shit ton. Basically, frontally, where have you noticed you're getting penned?

I haven't played it so I can't answer the last question, but the UFP is stronger than the flat parts of the front of a Type 5, so it should bounce most rounds sometimes. The LFP on this tank is almost as strong as the UFP on the Tiger II. The weakest surface of the cupola and the weakest surface of the cheeks have the same thickness at 230mm, so between those just take the easiest shot. 

Playing around on tanks.gg, it looks like it takes quite a bit of angling for the flat front of the cheeks to get much stronger, and as soon as they do you can just shoot further to the side for an easy pen. Avoid shooting the back half of the turret from the front unless it's extremely over-angled. The back half of the turret doesn't become an easier pen than the front half until the turret is facing almost perpendicular to you. 

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40 minutes ago, Tarski said:

I haven't played it so I can't answer the last question, but the UFP is stronger than the flat parts of the front of a Type 5, so it should bounce most rounds sometimes. The LFP on this tank is almost as strong as the UFP on the Tiger II. The weakest surface of the cupola and the weakest surface of the cheeks have the same thickness at 230mm, so between those just take the easiest shot. 

Playing around on tanks.gg, it looks like it takes quite a bit of angling for the flat front of the cheeks to get much stronger, and as soon as they do you can just shoot further to the side for an easy pen. Avoid shooting the back half of the turret from the front unless it's extremely over-angled. The back half of the turret doesn't become an easier pen than the front half until the turret is facing almost perpendicular to you. 

So really it's quite similar to the Maus? Just with a cupola.

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I'm struggling a lot with it, mainly because of the speed..

On open maps I'm forced to go into fail positions to get some damage (erlenberg castle from south), and I rarely end up top tier, so I'm always meeting types and Mauses (maüse, mice?) Who just load premium and rape me.

Atm I've only unlocked the tracks and the 128mm, I hope the engine changes something..

Can't wait for SHs to be on again to have some fun trolling tryhards..

As far as playstyle goes, it plays like the maus, angle, angle and angle again, tier 10s will autopen your lfp without any problem, so try to find something to hide it, cupola has a small 220 effective area, the rest is 260+..

It suffers a lot from arty, hull and turret roofs are weak af.

The stock 105 (top gun on the vk45.02a) has really good stats, .32 accuracy and sub 2s aim time, at the cost of alpha and pen (200vs220, 244vs260 for apcr, 320vs440 alpha)..

And it looks sexy af with those curves :kreygasm:

Overall it's a really good tank, given the style of that line (slooooooow, armoured bricks)

My stats in it suck dicks though, I'm not really used to slow tanks (I play mostly mediums and lights)

 

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59 minutes ago, WhatTheSkara said:

My stats in it suck dicks though, I'm not really used to slow tanks (I play mostly mediums and lights)

 

You're just bad at tonks :kappa:

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So I ground out the top gun, so my stats are trash in it right now, but the gun handling and 12 second reload really seems beefy.

The LFP and sides are actually weaker than I would have thought, but I suppose it "balances" the tank.

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Watching a KV-5 try to fight one of these was one of the saddest things i've ever seen. The KV-5 desperately needs some kind of rework.

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1 hour ago, hall0 said:

interesting when I played this tank on the testserver even a VK-A penned me regularly through my lfp and if WGs dmg panel is correct he used only AP. 

if you give the VK-A a (non-heavily-angled) shot on the LFP, that would make sense as it's about 180-190 eff armor.

 

7 hours ago, WhatTheSkara said:

I'm struggling a lot with it, mainly because of the speed..

Atm I've only unlocked the tracks and the 128mm, I hope the engine changes something..

I think you'll be disappointed.  Given it seemed fairly easy to get up to the 20kph limit with the stock engine on flat(ish) ground, all you're really getting from the engine upgrade is better hill climbing and acceleration up to 20kph.  Because of this, I didn't notice much of a difference in overall mobility.

 

4 hours ago, Joyrider216 said:

The LFP and sides are actually weaker than I would have thought, but I suppose it "balances" the tank.

I haven't had a problem with the sides. The LFP is weaker than I'd like. It good for trolling the D-25T clones, (some) same tier meds and lower tiers, but other than that, one definitely needs to keep it out of play.

 

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so far: KV4 >>> VK 100

the KV4 gets a way, way better gun and is 50% faster, with armor barely worse

a KV-4 shits on OHo peasants and can fight any tier 9 heavy head on, this VK 100 cant do that, 260 apcr is shitty gold ammo, and 220 AP is also not good (for a tank, with this kind of role)

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before patch 9.17.1 drops on Asia server i just gotta know: how do I kill one of these things? 

Not fight in one since i'm a looooooong way off from getting one

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1 hour ago, GehakteMolen said:

so far: KV4 >>> VK 100

the KV4 gets a way, way better gun and is 50% faster, with armor barely worse

a KV-4 shits on OHo peasants and can fight any tier 9 heavy head on, this VK 100 cant do that, 260 apcr is shitty gold ammo, and 220 AP is also not good (for a tank, with this kind of role)

 

I don't have a KV-4 so I tread carefully but, what??  

how do you figure it has a "way, way" better gun?  The gold round is better for sure but 260 is still solid and the only thing I've had real trouble penning with the VK gold is really the Type 5 and Maus, which is to be expected.  An extra 7 AP pen pen isn't much to talk about, while the VK has 120 (37.5%!) more alpha and 2 degrees more gun depression.  

KV-4 might have a 50% higher top speed but it also has horrendous terrain resist, whereas the VK's is on par with the Leopard 1.  So unless the KV-4 is gong downhill, I don't think you're going to feel it nearly as much as that would initially suggest.

I'd also pick a bone with the KV-4 armor being barely worse.  

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Yeah KV-4 armor is definitely worse. Sure its comparable when its on sidescrape position, but KV-4's armor is actually not even very good if its not angled which among with its super garbage traverse limits its pushing capabilities. And the fucking KV-4 turret is so fucking weak jesus.

I dont have VK 100 yet but i can already smell that its better than KV-4.

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8 hours ago, Tupinambis said:

Watching a KV-5 try to fight one of these was one of the saddest things i've ever seen. The KV-5 desperately needs some kind of rework.

On the account I am currently grinding the only prems are Kv5, Jtiger 8.8 and CDC. After this patch I can officially say FML untill i finish the grind. 

 

 

 

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14 hours ago, ProfessorMunroe said:

I don't have a KV-4 so I tread carefully but, what??  

how do you figure it has a "way, way" better gun?  The gold round is better for sure but 260 is still solid and the only thing I've had real trouble penning with the VK gold is really the Type 5 and Maus, which is to be expected.  An extra 7 AP pen pen isn't much to talk about, while the VK has 120 (37.5%!) more alpha and 2 degrees more gun depression.  

KV-4 might have a 50% higher top speed but it also has horrendous terrain resist, whereas the VK's is on par with the Leopard 1.  So unless the KV-4 is gong downhill, I don't think you're going to feel it nearly as much as that would initially suggest.

I'd also pick a bone with the KV-4 armor being barely worse.  

KV4 goes 30 km/h on flat ground, the mini-maus 20, thats a big difference, and while the KV4 might bleed more speed when turning, the minimaus starts with less speed already.

gunwise, the KV4 gets:

KV4_minimaus.png

Same dpm, less alpha, and everything else better, and most important, BS gold ammo vs poor gold ammo, 260 APCR for a tank like the minimaus is shit, KT, Lowe, KV4, tanks which often fight in the same situations all have vastly better gold rounds, my KV4 can engage any tier 9 heavy head on, and kill it, an Vk100 cant (sniping hatches vs blasting holes in UFP or turrets, thats the difference)

And while the alpha dmg is nice, and due to the rol often very usefull, the slow rld + bad acc + slower shells make is far wose at sniping

Armorwise the Maus has an equal weak lfp, an acual strong ufp (armor vs autobounce) and a better turret face, with a weakspot about as strong (KV4 hatch thing bounce < 200 pen an dgets penned > 220 same for minimaus more or less (the KV4 has stronger sides, but weaker front, yet tiny parts of spaced armor and so on)

Most important is side armor 130 or 100 + 100 for maus vs 150 for KV4, both get spaced armor (the KV4 a bigger zone, but the part of the maus with spaced armor is much stronger)

so when sidescraping, the maus relies very heavy on autobounce a KV4 angled 35 deg has 233 aff armor, an maus angled the same has 200 / 330 (330 near spaced armor) which means an maus cant angle so much, which in return means hes lfp is much harder to hide / more attractive

a KV4 is all about showing your side, so people will shot your soviet steel side armor (and not your front) in order to bai people in shooting this, you need to angle so far, it makes your side seem an easy target, a minimaus cant do the same...

ps: and in tier 10, the extra gold pen of the KV4 + autobounce sides are worth more as the alpha dmg of the minimaus

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On 2/24/2017 at 8:09 PM, GehakteMolen said:

so far: KV4 >>> VK 100

the KV4 gets a way, way better gun and is 50% faster, with armor barely worse

a KV-4 shits on OHo peasants and can fight any tier 9 heavy head on, this VK 100 cant do that, 260 apcr is shitty gold ammo, and 220 AP is also not good (for a tank, with this kind of role)

It is not 50% faster (I wish). There are times when the speed difference is hardly noticeable - since VK pick up speed very fast (my bro free-exp it to elite).

But the on KV-4 gun is far, far better, sure...but pubbies do not know that. The only thing they know is the alpha dmg, and they fear it. In KV-4 I was rushed all the time (sometimes it was actually good....if you had backup...sometimes was horrible). KV-4 is too slow to forece trading shots, so you end up trading 320 for more, unless you are defending a chokepoint. Attack was pain in the ass. VK is a much better offensive tank, KV way better at def.

Armor sort of depends. On KV-4 it is more reliable, while VK 100 gives you more crazy bounces, but some games you simply meet tanks with accurate guns that pen you with every shot.

Overall, I like VK better. And I was a die-hard KV-fan, even before the buff. 

Getting set by fore twice every third game (mostly by arty, but sometimes by a single pew-pew autoloader) is pain in the ass, as well as having a 170 mm effective LFP - you cant angle all the time, sometimes you get yoloed.

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11 hours ago, Felicius said:

It is not 50% faster (I wish). There are times when the speed difference is hardly noticeable - since VK pick up speed very fast (my bro free-exp it to elite).

But the on KV-4 gun is far, far better, sure...but pubbies do not know that. The only thing they know is the alpha dmg, and they fear it. In KV-4 I was rushed all the time (sometimes it was actually good....if you had backup...sometimes was horrible). KV-4 is too slow to forece trading shots, so you end up trading 320 for more, unless you are defending a chokepoint. Attack was pain in the ass. VK is a much better offensive tank, KV way better at def.

Armor sort of depends. On KV-4 it is more reliable, while VK 100 gives you more crazy bounces, but some games you simply meet tanks with accurate guns that pen you with every shot.

Overall, I like VK better. And I was a die-hard KV-fan, even before the buff. 

Getting set by fore twice every third game (mostly by arty, but sometimes by a single pew-pew autoloader) is pain in the ass, as well as having a 170 mm effective LFP - you cant angle all the time, sometimes you get yoloed.

well, its 30 vs 20 km/h, and both will drive ``full speed`` all the times, unless swamp or turning, even if KV4 drops 50% of its speed and only goes 15 km/h when turning, a VK wont go much faster

KV4 has afterall almost the same mobility as a KV5, a tank which is according to many ``suprising mobile``

KV4.png

(for terrain stats all that matters is the ratio between hard / medium and hard / soft, so VK has the best, KV5 the worst, KV5 gets the highest hp/ton, but has no stock engine (KV4 and VK both have 1000 stock 1200 elite, so both gain a bit here), in effect, its KV5 >/ KV4 > VK100, with not suchs big gaps,only on hard pavement straight line, then the top speed caps make the real difference

mobility and soft stats and the opinion of player about them are 80% bullshit and 20% cant read numbers :P, a KV4 and KV5 are almost equal fast, only difference is crew (most ppl put a 5e skill IS3 crew in KV5 and drive KV4 with a 75% tard crew) and top speed, i have a KV4 and KV5 with the same crew, and difference in mobility is minimal, both turn as a whale...

ps: see also 252 vs IS3, 252 = IS6 mobility, IS6 = slow slug compared to IS3, yet some ppl claim 252 is ``as fast as IS3``...

 

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27 minutes ago, GehakteMolen said:

well, its 30 vs 20 km/h, and both will drive ``full speed`` all the times, unless swamp or turning, even if KV4 drops 50% of its speed and only goes 15 km/h when turning, a VK wont go much faster

KV4 has afterall almost the same mobility as a KV5, a tank which is according to many ``suprising mobile``

KV4.png

(for terrain stats all that matters is the ratio between hard / medium and hard / soft, so VK has the best, KV5 the worst, KV5 gets the highest hp/ton, but has no stock engine (KV4 and VK both have 1000 stock 1200 elite, so both gain a bit here), in effect, its KV5 >/ KV4 > VK100, with not suchs big gaps,only on hard pavement straight line, then the top speed caps make the real difference

mobility and soft stats and the opinion of player about them are 80% bullshit and 20% cant read numbers :P, a KV4 and KV5 are almost equal fast, only difference is crew (most ppl put a 5e skill IS3 crew in KV5 and drive KV4 with a 75% tard crew) and top speed, i have a KV4 and KV5 with the same crew, and difference in mobility is minimal, both turn as a whale...

ps: see also 252 vs IS3, 252 = IS6 mobility, IS6 = slow slug compared to IS3, yet some ppl claim 252 is ``as fast as IS3``...

 

Gehakte, I value your opinions highly (you are one of the rare unicums that play super-heavies for good, not just generic med play), but you have proven yourself wrong.

VK has 62% better terrain resist on hard ground, and 68% on medium ground. If you drive valley on Lakeville, you deserve what you get in both, but even then, in VK you have 24% better terrain resist.

Meanwhile, VK has 88,6% as much HP/ton as KV-4, and when you add it to the terrain resist formula, you still get 55% better pasability on hard, and 60% on medium ground. I know the mobility in Wot does not function that easy, but this is basics.

KV is fucked over with soft stats, and it hardly goes "30 km/h all time". better to say that VK goes 18 km/h most of the time, and KV manages 25, only on hard terrain. Playing VK i have a feeling like driving a tractor - it is slow, but it gets to speed quickly and effortlessly. With KV i have a feeling like the tracks are sticking to the ground all the time. 

But KV gets slowed a lot for various reasons, while VK keeps the speed at level ground much better.

I have played KV-5 just a few times on friends acc, and was unimpressed by speed - your observation here stands correct.

Overall, deployment times for both will be similar (VK and KV), the results will be based on how far is the brawl, and are there any slopes...KV gains a lot from even a slight downslope, while VK not so (speed cap). On flat ground they are roughly the same (again, Kv will pick up speed eventually), VK has an advantage on medium terrain. On slight hills, KV gets slightly better unless medium terrain, where VK is better, but this is a snail race by then.

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56 minutes ago, Felicius said:

Gehakte, I value your opinions highly (you are one of the rare unicums that play super-heavies for good, not just generic med play), but you have proven yourself wrong.

VK has 62% better terrain resist on hard ground, and 68% on medium ground. If you drive valley on Lakeville, you deserve what you get in both, but even then, in VK you have 24% better terrain resist.

Meanwhile, VK has 88,6% as much HP/ton as KV-4, and when you add it to the terrain resist formula, you still get 55% better pasability on hard, and 60% on medium ground. I know the mobility in Wot does not function that easy, but this is basics.

KV is fucked over with soft stats, and it hardly goes "30 km/h all time". better to say that VK goes 18 km/h most of the time, and KV manages 25, only on hard terrain. Playing VK i have a feeling like driving a tractor - it is slow, but it gets to speed quickly and effortlessly. With KV i have a feeling like the tracks are sticking to the ground all the time. 

But KV gets slowed a lot for various reasons, while VK keeps the speed at level ground much better.

I have played KV-5 just a few times on friends acc, and was unimpressed by speed - your observation here stands correct.

Overall, deployment times for both will be similar (VK and KV), the results will be based on how far is the brawl, and are there any slopes...KV gains a lot from even a slight downslope, while VK not so (speed cap). On flat ground they are roughly the same (again, Kv will pick up speed eventually), VK has an advantage on medium terrain. On slight hills, KV gets slightly better unless medium terrain, where VK is better, but this is a snail race by then.

Oh, since we are both on EU server, we can just easy test this :P (i got a KV4 and Vk, all we need is new 75% crews and drive around a bit)

one thing the VK is clearly better as the KV4 is fighting on hilly terrain, say Serene coast water side, or hills on westfield, the better reverse speed + better gun depression + much better alpha dmg make the VK here (very) powerfull, while the KV4 will really strugle here

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I got this tank today, and so far it has been one big let-down. Side armor is really not that great, LFP is unreliable at best, and you also have that big gold-magnet cupola. It also attracts arty like crazy, and is just not fast enough to keep up with the fight if your team is too good.

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10 hours ago, Waemoth said:

I got this tank today, and so far it has been one big let-down. Side armor is really not that great, LFP is unreliable at best, and you also have that big gold-magnet cupola. It also attracts arty like crazy, and is just not fast enough to keep up with the fight if your team is too tgood.

I've had pretty good luck with the side armor. LFP is relatively weak but fairly easy to hide given it's only about 30% of the front. 

The speed has been frustrating for the reason you stated, but I knew it would be going in. I think the majority of my poor damage games are due to me never really getting to the fight. 

On the bright side, it's surprisingly responsive in getting up to speed in both forward and reverse, which helps with exposure time, and it climbs quite well (relative to it's size).

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43 minutes ago, ProfessorMunroe said:

I've had pretty good luck with the side armor. LFP is relatively weak but fairly easy to hide given it's only about 30% of the front. 

The speed has been frustrating for the reason you stated, but I knew it would be going in. I think the majority of my poor damage games are due to me never really getting to the fight. 

On the bright side, it's surprisingly responsive in getting up to speed in both forward and reverse, which helps with exposure time, and it climbs quite well (relative to it's size).

Well I've also had a combination of bad matchups, bad maps and bad RNG. This thing gets the ammorack damaged all the time, and the driver is suicidal too. The traverse speed with my shitty crew is bad enough for a T26E5 to circle you in reverse...

Also, is it just me or does this take ridiculously big damage from HE splashing the bottom? I had a 105mm M4A3E8 splash me for over 100 damage without hitting. Needless to say this is REALLY bad when arty is shootig at you; its far better that they get a direct hit in front or side than that they hit the ground in front of you. I think this might be a bug, and a nasty such.

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