NIborGER

Caernarvon, Conqueror and Super Conqueror on supertest

170 posts in this topic

In a way its a logical progression from the lower tier heavies.  When they said a 'nasty gun' and similar to Foch - my first thought was super conq with the 183mm . . . 

:gaytroll:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
53 minutes ago, nabucodonsor said:

Is3 still is a better platform with better armor (and turret dispersion) plus Caer turret should be pennable for all >200 mm pen guns. Plus you have a Defender that hits for 440. While it looks good it should not replace these 2 tanks due to the shit mobility and poor alpha which still means poor poking potential and low HE dmg. Also less mobility means it will be more prone to be it by arty strikes. 

Anyway i find it retarded that it gets more alpha and dpm than any lt or medium (bar -3 and ravioli) .

It's gonna be British Tiger - ultra DPM, bad hull armor and turret that may bounce.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

i'd wager it'd probably be necessary to pick up the Caern (again) if one intends to acquire the Chieftain, if and when it comes.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
11 minutes ago, MacusFlash said:

It's gonna be British Tiger - ultra DPM, bad hull armor and turret that may bounce.

I would call a turret with 254mm front and a 270mm mantlet something that may bounce stuff. Furthermore it might not been clear but caernarvon gets a own turret and loses the AX one.

rcZZgKx9v2E.jpg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hah! Called it. Now about getting the 20 pounder onto the Black Prince :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Black Prince could get the 32 Pounder too. There was a proposal for that.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Holy shit that Caernarvon buff.

2.8k baseDPM is more than the fucking FV215B(current highest DPM-heavy ignoring the T57 and Type5 for obvious reasons), that think went from turd-of-all-turds to 2nd best tier 8 tank (Bullshit-252 is still stronger because lol retardproof IS-7 armor is more usefull on citymaps, but with the buffed turretarmor and 10° of gundepression this thing is going to shit on any tier 8 and a lot of tier 9 tanks)

Meanwhile the Tiger 2 is crying in the corner, weeping itself to sleep...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, Fabunil said:

Holy shit that Caernarvon buff.

2.8k baseDPM is more than the fucking FV215B(current highest DPM-heavy ignoring the T57 and Type5 for obvious reasons), that think went from turd-of-all-turds to 2nd best tier 8 tank (Bullshit-252 is still stronger because lol retardproof IS-7 armor is more usefull on citymaps, but with the buffed turretarmor and 10° of gundepression this thing is going to shit on any tier 8 and a lot of tier 9 tanks)

Meanwhile the Tiger 2 is crying in the corner, weeping itself to sleep...

You've forgotten about the T32.

We all have. :feelsbad:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, ZXrage said:

You've forgotten about the T32.

We all have. :feelsbad:

Is that one of the many shitty tier 2/3 Russian Lights?

Who plays on those tiers anyway.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
19 minutes ago, ZXrage said:

You've forgotten about the T32.

We all have. :feelsbad:

No it's WG. They wait until a tank is powercreeped into oblivion like the Caern or Foch 155 and then buff it to ridiculous levels. Give WG a year and t32 will have pershing mobility, t110e5 armor an t57 gun.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Crap basket. I want the FV 215b as a "premium" but in order to get it I have to grind all the shitty tanks first. God have mercy when I die my way through this Churchill and unbuffed Caernarvon shit. :/

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, hall0 said:

Crap basket. I want the FV 215b as a "premium" but in order to get it I have to grind all the shitty tanks first. God have mercy when I die my way through this Churchill and unbuffed Caernarvon shit. :/

If you ever want to want to make the grind feel better, go play the Churchill gun carrier from stock.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
11 hours ago, NIborGER said:

We’ve come to the decision of revising this branch’s top vehicles. While the tanks aren’t bad

That's a joke right?

 

9 hours ago, hazzgar said:

I really wonder if the Caern dpm will stay

I doubt it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10 hours ago, hazzgar said:

I really wonder if the Caern dpm will stay

that'd be silly. it'd be like if WG buffed some obsolete or obscure WW2 superheavy tanks to make it trump post-WW2 MBTs.

oh wait

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yeah, it's funny.. If you want the 215B as a premiums before it's too late you have to grind all the tanks before their buffs... :gachi:

 

WG wins...

 

Lol at Caer DPM.. It's gonna have the highest DPM of all T8.. More than the ISU-130, AT15 and T28.. what a joke. WAY more than the 416. :jebaited:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I actually liked the Caern, color me weird. The alpha was weak but as long as you could hide the LP the armor package was much better than a Cent, and the mobility was not that bad (at least before Cent speed buff). These new buffs make an OK tank a really good tank for Tier 8, The tier 9 and 10 seem underwhelming though. Tier 9 Conq does not need a DPM nerf. Tier 10 Super Conq. needs a bit more mobility and lower turret rotation bloom.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Ahhhh I remember when I started the british masochist line when they said they will replace 215b with chieftain.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

To get technical regarding the effectiveness of the spaced armour it's a 5.75" (14.6cm) spacers according to the document, plus the then another likely 14-25mm. At the angle, it works out to be about 32cm travelled.

So ~15% penetration loss for the UFP before subtraction of armour penetrated for HEAT for the UFP on level ground straight. 330 HEAT effectively becomes <280mm, against a 152mm plate at 60 degrees and another ~20mm armour at 60 atop that. 420 HEAT becomes 357mm, which is getting pretty close to the ~340 LOS of the hull. Turret is going to be all but immune to heat frontally (and then only in extremely small areas). And to give you an idea, one of the "weakspots" in that scenario is the turret ring which is base 300mm thick before any sort of angling (a low roll of 330 HEAT is 247.5mm). Too high or low, which is a slight difference, and it will hit spaced armour. Hull down enough to hide the turret ring (which is possible) and the area which is penetrable shrinks. Get some depression going in that hull down position, and the cupola (assuming it is not already autobounce) is virtually hidden.

I think this may be a contender for strongest turret honestly. Maybe not all around, but certainly frontally.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
17 hours ago, ThomChen114 said:

For the longest time the Caernarvon has had lower alpha than many tier 8 MTs and even some LTs, since it had the 20-pdr gun (83mm), when most other tanks have 90mm and higher tanks, even some MTs at tier 7 have higher alpha

that would be nice, if they werent planning on buffing so many other tank's turrets along the way.

You cant have both in my book and if has not had it before it does not mean now it should be so high. My problem is not with the Caer only but with how WG balanced the whole tier 8 meta. You have tanks with 240 alpha having similar dpm than an is3 like the panther 2 or indien pz, but not having the same hp and armour. It's stupid. 240 is nothing compared to 390, considering 400 is still competitive at tier x.

Then again the tank might be balanced due to how slow it will be and being just another one trick pony with better dpm (t32), with  poor alpha......

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, General_6 said:

I actually liked the Caern, color me weird. The alpha was weak but as long as you could hide the LP the armor package was much better than a Cent, and the mobility was not that bad (at least before Cent speed buff). These new buffs make an OK tank a really good tank for Tier 8, The tier 9 and 10 seem underwhelming though. Tier 9 Conq does not need a DPM nerf. Tier 10 Super Conq. needs a bit more mobility and lower turret rotation bloom.

I actually didn't mind the whole branch from tier 5 onward. :kappa:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Doubt the Cearnarvon DPM changes will stay but the general idea makes sense, even with 280 alpha that is way smaller alpha than other tier 8 heavies which are all 320 - 440, so having much more DPM than them should have been the case all along. They'll probably tone it down to like 2.3 -2.4k base which would still be very nice.

Just don't see why the tier 9 Conqueror needs touching at all, it's a good, balanced and interesting tank.  

Super Conqueror looks a bit meh to me, seems to becoming a bit bland and like other tanks really, I hope we get the Chieftain as the alternative tier 10 heavy. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, tajj7 said:

Doubt the Cearnarvon DPM changes will stay but the general idea makes sense, even with 280 alpha that is way smaller alpha than other tier 8 heavies which are all 320 - 440, so having much more DPM than them should have been the case all along. They'll probably tone it down to like 2.3 -2.4k base which would still be very nice.

Just don't see why the tier 9 Conqueror needs touching at all, it's a good, balanced and interesting tank.  

Super Conqueror looks a bit meh to me, seems to becoming a bit bland and like other tanks really, I hope we get the Chieftain as the alternative tier 10 heavy. 

Pretty much this. A high DPM is no guarantee that you can offset the high alpha other tanks get. For example, people praise the ability of the Black Prince to perma-track someone, which is

A) Not true for all tanks, but also ignores repair kits, repair skills, food, ventilation and, someone certainly fits it, repair tools.

B) The penetration is not high enough to track and damage a given target a lot of the time.

C) The 17 Pounder doesn't even have enough module damage to guarantee a tracking shot most of the time.

D) Even if you manage to track and damage a, say, IS, you still need three shots to have the same "effective" alpha, so even one bounce, miss or non-damage shot, sets you already back by a noteable margin.

E) The Black Prince doesn't even have good DPM. Within the tier, only the Tiger P (which is a complete garbage-heap in every concievable way) and the T29 mounting the 105 are outpaced by the BP's 17 Pounder. I seriously do not get the notion, why people think the Black Prince is a DPM-machine, just because it has a high RoF, which is worth jack shit due to all the drawbacks coming with it, but I rant and I digress.

F) The exposure-time to do the same a 390-alpha heavy does, is more than three times as long, which opens up tons of chances to counter-damage the Black Prince by teammates.

Most of these points are true for almost every low-alpha high-DPM tank in the game. The advantage of say 100-200 DPM is simply not enough to offset the disadvantages you gain from the low alpha that comes with it. Have a look at the Tiger I. It works, simply and argueably solely because it does have a sizeable DPM-advantage (and actually decent mobility) and, honestly, the lower the alpha, the more DPM needs to be there to compensate. With a 280-alpha Caern, I would expect a DPM not lower than ~2200-2300, which is what the Tiger I gets one tier lower.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Madner Kami said:

BP is trash

You didn't mention the terrible bloom

0.19 on turret traverse :PogChamp:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

0.19 bloom? WTF??

mfw type 5 heavy derp gun has almost as good turret bloom, wtf WG

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
35 minutes ago, leggasiini said:

0.19 bloom? WTF??

mfw type 5 heavy derp gun has almost as good turret bloom, wtf WG

Mfw type5 is also more mobile :MingLee:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.