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Canadian_Reaper

Can the Swedish (not Swiss) TD's be used offensively?

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Way back when sometime I chose to make some of my female crews Swedish (not Swiss) . As I'm a really smart person, this was before I ever tried any of the Swedish TD's.

Just tried some on Supertest (the T8 premium mostly) and while they seem great on defense, sniping from their utterly ridiculous camo, I got wrecked anytime I tried to take a more aggressive approach to using them. 

I totally understand (and applaud) the fire these things draw when spotted, but I'm wondering if anyone regularly uses them offensively, moving up, spotting for those E100s,M48's, and T100LT's  that understanably don't want to move up themselves. Or even just taking forward positions, rather than something half a map back.

Just realized with the new personal mission completion scheme I'm going to have an extra 4 female crew, before I assign a third to a line I'm never going to play, I'd like to know if these can be used somewhat offensively, or if they're pretty much camp and snipe until it's cleanup damage time.

Thanks!

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You can, but aggression is different for them. An aggressive play would be moving up to a crossfire position that could potentially be risky rather than going out swinging in close quarters. Constantly trying to find new (better) angles to work your awesome gun, camo and/or low silhouette is going to keep you busy in these tanks regardless so that's how aggressive you can be. Siege is tricky and obviously the longer range of an engagement the better, but sometimes there are better lanes to lock down or squisher big HP tanks to farm, so constantly working the tanks this way rather than just flat out camping and waiting for things to run into your crosshair is basically the alternative to the incredibly passive gameplay.

I only have experience in the Strv S1 which lacks the mobility, but I'd never go up front just because of the risk of dying so easily is too high compared to how useful I can be when I'm ahead of my team. Even these tier 8s are way better long range than regular T10s on long vision lanes so obviously staying back is the most reasonable thing to do, they are less productive than you are regarding shots. 

 

Teams are shit sometimes, what you can do is try to find alternate angles but it requires an insane amount of consideration in risk-reward to really prove worthwhile compared to camping. I personally redline in it like EU unicums did back in 2012, because it works best that way for me. But I still have decent games on maps like Himmels and Paris because you can always find lanes and firing lines at range where your gun/camo combo gives you a playable and productive option. This is really where the difference between the average redliner against someone using their head will start to show.

 

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In udes, you can be agressive if there aren't arty, and there's hills to work with.

In 103-0, you can be aggressive there are no HE shooters, arty, 122mm+ guns, or guns with HEAT as prem ammo in front of you.

in 103b, you can be agressive if there are no HE shooters, arty, or 152mm+ guns

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Depends on the map and the tanks the enemys are driving.

The D1-Spot on Serene Coast for example is porbably the best spot in the game for the Strv 103B since you can easily rush there at the start of the game and just farm the enemy with your retarded gundepression , upper hull and DPM as long as you peak only one guy at a time to avoid them overmatching your sidearmor.

As for the tier 9 Strv, you are going to have a lot harder time with your armor as most tanks you will face either have a 122mm gun or are able to fire HEAT as a gold round, in either case they will just autopen your front with every shot.

You can farm british tanks with the 120mm gun as they have APCR as standard though.

If you want to play aggressive in the UDES... Just don't, it is an equally satisfying experience as shooting yourself in the foot.

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The problem with being aggressive in them is that they are an instant target for anyone that sees their side if they get spotted.  I'll generally take a sketchy side shot at a swedish TD over any other shot because they are so rarely lit and they are pretty much impervious frontally to so many tanks.  If they get lit, they will be going dark and disappearing soon so you need to shoot while you can.  If you are closer to the front and get lit, a lot more tanks might have angles on your sides.

The idea of playing an aggressive bush up front on Prok or Mali sounds very appealing - right up until you get insta-gibbed.

I got all 5 swedish girls for christmas, and I added a 6th from a PM.  My Kran has an all swede crew, but my girl TD crew is stalled at tier 6 because I am so bad at sniping.

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16 hours ago, Fabunil said:

Depends on the map and the tanks the enemys are driving.

The D1-Spot on Serene Coast for example is porbably the best spot in the game for the Strv 103B since you can easily rush there at the start of the game and just farm the enemy with your retarded gundepression , upper hull and DPM as long as you peak only one guy at a time to avoid them overmatching your sidearmor.

As for the tier 9 Strv, you are going to have a lot harder time with your armor as most tanks you will face either have a 122mm gun or are able to fire HEAT as a gold round, in either case they will just autopen your front with every shot.

You can farm british tanks with the 120mm gun as they have APCR as standard though.

If you want to play aggressive in the UDES... Just don't, it is an equally satisfying experience as shooting yourself in the foot.

For udes, just find a hill, a bump, anything you can hide behind. Even the window in C3 on himmelsdorf is good enough. Set siege mode, wait for camo net to activate. Then you point your gun as low as possible to raise your rear end over the cover, while retaining your retarded 70.12% stationary camo. Even a 500 vr tank won't see you 150m away. After you fire, just turn off siege mode; due to the awkward mechanic of siege mode on a non-fixed gun, your rear instantly drop behind cover, giving your opponent no chance to return fire even if pre-aimed. You are invisible again by the time you reload, allow you to repeat it. Point blank doesn't work, but 120 - 150m without a bush is still pretty aggressive if you ask me.

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I'm starting to understand and get better at the Swedish TDs (at the UDES 30 atm). When I started out I was trying to play this like a sniping E25 (rather than a scout E25). Many times it was difficult, and still is difficult, to maintain that safe distance one needs in a pancake to not get spotted and hit in return.

The UDES is very much dependent on the team. Do not fall for the illusion that you can use the low profile to scout aggressively. It takes too long to respond to sudden threats, and it doesn't turn very well in cruise mode. It is a reactionary vehicle, especially since too many maps do not allow much freedom of movement.

http://wotreplays.eu/site/3837610#malinovka-thomchen114-udes_03

In this game I was doing the typical early sniping. My ping was a bit wonky, but good effective on target nonetheless. But when the hill advance stalled, I saw an opportunity to move up and did so. It took awhile to coax the O-Ni to come downhill and root out the remaining enemy tanks, but since I moved up ahead and setting myself up on overwatch guaranteed some lovely killshots.

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7 hours ago, Hally said:

For udes, just find a hill, a bump, anything you can hide behind. Even the window in C3 on himmelsdorf is good enough. Set siege mode, wait for camo net to activate. Then you point your gun as low as possible to raise your rear end over the cover, while retaining your retarded 70.12% stationary camo. Even a 500 vr tank won't see you 150m away. After you fire, just turn off siege mode; due to the awkward mechanic of siege mode on a non-fixed gun, your rear instantly drop behind cover, giving your opponent no chance to return fire even if pre-aimed. You are invisible again by the time you reload, allow you to repeat it. Point blank doesn't work, but 120 - 150m without a bush is still pretty aggressive if you ask me.

This only works if you have for the first shot you take and would never work like that in an actual game without a bush.

The second you roll back out from your cover back into position your stationary camo is completly irrelevant as you are moving (duh...) so the enemy will either spot you as soon as you drive out of cover, in which case your stationary camo is useless unless you want to sit in the open for 10 seconds waiting for the stationary camo and camo-net to kick in and for you to disappear, or you don't get spotted because you already had enough camo-on-the-move in the first place in which the extra camo from being stationary and having a camonet is completly irrelevant. (This is why camo-net is seen as a useless piece of equipment by many wotlabers myself included, it looks nice on paper but doesn't really work in practice).

The UDES gets a ~33% camo-on-the-.move when fully equiped and with a camo-crew so against a tank would spot you from a range of 350 meters if you played the way you described, not to mention you probably wouldn't even be able to spot him in return unless it is a heavy as the Udes is as blind as a bat.

 

In other words: The Udes is pretty much the bushwankiest TD in the game, playing it as anything else other than a bush wanker is an exercise in frustration.

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11 hours ago, Fabunil said:

This only works if you have for the first shot you take and would never work like that in an actual game without a bush.

The second you roll back out from your cover back into position your stationary camo is completly irrelevant as you are moving (duh...) so the enemy will either spot you as soon as you drive out of cover, in which case your stationary camo is useless unless you want to sit in the open for 10 seconds waiting for the stationary camo and camo-net to kick in and for you to disappear, or you don't get spotted because you already had enough camo-on-the-move in the first place in which the extra camo from being stationary and having a camonet is completly irrelevant. (This is why camo-net is seen as a useless piece of equipment by many wotlabers myself included, it looks nice on paper but doesn't really work in practice).

The UDES gets a ~33% camo-on-the-.move when fully equiped and with a camo-crew so against a tank would spot you from a range of 350 meters if you played the way you described, not to mention you probably wouldn't even be able to spot him in return unless it is a heavy as the Udes is as blind as a bat.

 

In other words: The Udes is pretty much the bushwankiest TD in the game, playing it as anything else other than a bush wanker is an exercise in frustration.

You don't move in the udes at all if abusing camo at close range; if you are crawling up like other IKEA tds, you are doing it wrong. UDES does not have a fixed gun, the gun pivot is on the rear end of the vehicle, while siege mode pivot is near the middle front. The two different pivots allows udes to depress the gun to raise the rear end, subsequently allowing the gun to be fired from a higher position. This allows udes to "peek" over cover with stationary camo and camonet active, without ever moving the hull. This trick is unique to UDES.

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14 hours ago, Hally said:

You don't move in the udes at all if abusing camo at close range; if you are crawling up like other IKEA tds, you are doing it wrong. UDES does not have a fixed gun, the gun pivot is on the rear end of the vehicle, while siege mode pivot is near the middle front. The two different pivots allows udes to depress the gun to raise the rear end, subsequently allowing the gun to be fired from a higher position. This allows udes to "peek" over cover with stationary camo and camonet active, without ever moving the hull. This trick is unique to UDES.

Would you mind to explain a little more? I find this very interesting as i never knew about this difference between the UDES and the STRVs. And doesnt the camonet work even when moving in seige? 

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12 hours ago, nabucodonsor said:

Would you mind to explain a little more? I find this very interesting as i never knew about this difference between the UDES and the STRVs. And doesnt the camonet work even when moving in seige? 

i think he is referring to the way that you can tilt the hull without losing camo, and the udes' ability to elevate its gun mean it can "get taller" and still fire is gun.

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