kaneaaa

Does wg manipulate the mm in ways other than they admit to?

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I was just wondering this. Sometimes, for example I get the impression when they release a new premium tank they try and programme the mm so that said new premium tank appears once per game to advertise its release to players. Was just wondering if people noticed ways in which the mm was working which wg haven't been clear about. 

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If they were able to do something like that, every patch would stop breaking a bazillion things.

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1 hour ago, kaneaaa said:

I was just wondering this. Sometimes, for example I get the impression when they release a new premium tank they try and programme the mm so that said new premium tank appears once per game to advertise its release to players. Was just wondering if people noticed ways in which the mm was working which wg haven't been clear about. 

You mean beside the "preferential" MM for baddies?

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1 hour ago, kaneaaa said:

I was just wondering this. Sometimes, for example I get the impression when they release a new premium tank they try and programme the mm so that said new premium tank appears once per game to advertise its release to players. Was just wondering if people noticed ways in which the mm was working which wg haven't been clear about. 

Confirmation bias.  New premium appears.  Lots of players blow $$$ on it and play it like meth-addicted hamsters for a few days.  The pubbies who didn't buy it rage about how it's OP.  Pubbie sees the sudden surge in appearances of a tank never seen before, pubbie assumes it's because WG is manipulating MM, b/c said pubbie interprets any change in how MM manifests as examples of the great WG MM-fixing conspiracy.

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Quote

Better chances of getting ranked at the top of the list for Platoon players:

Initially, their chances of playing at the top were reduced to avoid upsetting scenarios with Platoons singlehandedly deciding the battle outcome. In direct response to community feedback, we’re raising them slightly so that you and your Platoon mates can fight at higher tiers once in a while. This won’t cause any drastic changes to the state of Random Battles, but offers a more varied experience to Platoon players.

Quote

Equal chances of getting ranked in the top/middle/bottom of the list for different vehicle classes:

You might have noticed that heavy and medium tanks would end up in single-level battles way too often, while arty and TDs tended to get ±2 and ±1 setups. We tweaked the matchmaker, evening out the odd for all vehicle classes.

Patch 9.20.1. notes. Draw your own conclusions.

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@Errants can't say much about the platoon thing. but the TDs and shit thing could of just been a slight glitch or peculiarity with the MM system. While learning coding I've had several things happen where everything works, but something kinda weird happens for some reason, exactly like how the MM would just unintentionally put TDs and arty lower down. 

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1 hour ago, Assassin7 said:

@Errants can't say much about the platoon thing. but the TDs and shit thing could of just been a slight glitch or peculiarity with the MM system. While learning coding I've had several things happen where everything works, but something kinda weird happens for some reason, exactly like how the MM would just unintentionally put TDs and arty lower down. 

Don't quite know why I was tagged, but glad for it. Decent thread.

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59 minutes ago, Errants said:

Don't quite know why I was tagged, but glad for it. Decent thread.

oh wat. I thought jesse was you for some reason lol. thought it was your avatar xD

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Did someone just read about activision's match making patent?

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7 hours ago, kaneaaa said:

I was just wondering this. Sometimes, for example I get the impression when they release a new premium tank they try and programme the mm so that said new premium tank appears once per game to advertise its release to players. Was just wondering if people noticed ways in which the mm was working which wg haven't been clear about. 

And even if they do I wouldn’t blame them. They live of sales.

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I'm convinced. Every time I break out a heavy MM's like, "Three arty for you!"

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14 hours ago, kaneaaa said:

Sometimes, for example I get the impression when they release a new premium tank they try and programme the mm so that said new premium tank appears once per game to advertise its release to players.

because a lot of people buy that new tank and want to play it?

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9 hours ago, Nightlords said:

Did someone just read about activision's match making patent?

Even patents are just patents... wargaming has a bunch of those about matchmaking as well.

I have not seen any evidence that the MM behaves different than the rules given by wargaming. Especially now with the stricter templates and rules, it behaves very well.

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1 hour ago, Epic said:

it behaves very well.

Well . . . it working as intended maybe, but 'behaves very well' might be a stretch.  Much like an exhausted caffeine addled toddler - it is predictable, but not well behaved.

:minidoge:

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5 hours ago, Archaic_One said:

Well . . . it working as intended maybe, but 'behaves very well' might be a stretch.  Much like an exhausted caffeine addled toddler - it is predictable, but not well behaved.

:minidoge:

it does creates matches fairly quickly and uses the predefined MM presets, so i'd say it behaves decently enough.

You're still going to eat shit in tier 8 tho :doge:

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14 hours ago, crapcannon said:

I'm convinced. Every time I break out a heavy MM's like, "Three arty for you!"

And every time you load up a light/med with kill arty missions.. artyless matches ^.^

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17 hours ago, Nightlords said:

Did someone just read about activision's match making patent?

I did and this was actually the first thing what came into my mind after reading "manipulate mm". 

For those who don't what we are talking about. This video gives you the informations. 

In WoT term this would mean. You buy for example a STRV S1 and you will get a lot sniper friendly maps. So you use the full potential of your new toy and can own others. 

But there is even more in the younger past. It started on twitter when one game developer asked others about their little secrets so the players feel better. 

Just some quotes:

Quote

Assassin's Creed and Doom value the last bit of health as more hit points than the rest of it to encourage a feeling of *JUST* surviving.

Quote

In Bioshock if you would have taken your last pt of dmg you instead were invuln for abt 1-2 sec so you get more "barely survived" moments.

Especially this Bioshock tweet is interesting. There is a myth in the German forum section in WoT called "Rettungswurf" or in English saving throw. I have no idea how this came up, maybe because of some misinterpretation of this wiki article, but it basically goes like this. If you are one-shot the enemy will get a very low pen roll so he will bounce or his accuracy RNG roll will be very bad and he will likely miss. Result you survive a bit longer and you can feel good about yourself. 

I have no idea if this is true or not, but since there is so much what can be done in the background it is interesting non the less. 

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10 hours ago, hall0 said:

Especially this Bioshock tweet is interesting. There is a myth in the German forum section in WoT called "Rettungswurf" or in English saving throw. I have no idea how this came up, maybe because of some misinterpretation of this wiki article, but it basically goes like this. If you are one-shot the enemy will get a very low pen roll so he will bounce or his accuracy RNG roll will be very bad and he will likely miss. Result you survive a bit longer and you can feel good about yourself. 

I have no idea if this is true or not, but since there is so much what can be done in the background it is interesting non the less. 

That is just confirmation bias. However WG mentioned it as a reason to keep the RNG at 25%, to create those moments for players to feel good, think Overlord_Prime mentioned this on stream after his recent visit to Minsk.

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I'm a native Russian speaker and so I watch probably just as many Russian WoT streamers as I do English ones. Among many Russian streamers and just really good players in general, there's a belief that WG has special RNG for the bad players, like those with 47% WR and below. For example it allows them to hit more shots without fully aiming (aka snapshots), bounce more enemy shells and live longer while being a one-shot. These players are usually referred to as “Kislyi’s agents”.

It’s interesting and kind of crazy just how prevalent this belief seems to be on the RU server.

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1 hour ago, DirtyACE7 said:

I'm a native Russian speaker and so I watch probably just as many Russian WoT streamers as I do English ones. Among many Russian streamers and just really good players in general, there's a belief that WG has special RNG for the bad players, like those with 47% WR and below. For example it allows them to hit more shots without fully aiming (aka snapshots), bounce more enemy shells and live longer while being a one-shot. These players are usually referred to as “Kislyi’s agents”.

It’s interesting and kind of crazy just how prevalent this belief seems to be on the RU server.

Vodka isn't the best for your brain

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2 hours ago, DirtyACE7 said:

I'm a native Russian speaker and so I watch probably just as many Russian WoT streamers as I do English ones. Among many Russian streamers and just really good players in general, there's a belief that WG has special RNG for the bad players, like those with 47% WR and below. For example it allows them to hit more shots without fully aiming (aka snapshots), bounce more enemy shells and live longer while being a one-shot. These players are usually referred to as “Kislyi’s agents”.

It’s interesting and kind of crazy just how prevalent this belief seems to be on the RU server.

Word.

I definitely agree.

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I personally dont think WG messes in-match with the RNG or so, what they do / tested i think is:

Add bots, use old, unused accounts and let those play as bots, this has 3 advantages:

  1. it makes the playercount seem higher,
  2. bots can play the tanks needed for mm,
  3. if both teams have bots, the winchance will be closer to 50%, which is nerf for unicums and buff for retards.

Long ago, they even tested bots (on wot-news, the most played tanks where 4 tanks named: Panzer_IV_AI, M4_AI etc, with millions of games and almost no users), perhaps it was ``just testing for pve`` perhaps it was testing for bots.

ps: even very simple bots already win ~50% and achive yellow / light green wn8, just by driving pre defined patterns and using auto-aim...

Give good players the biggest morons as top tier

This one is also easy to do, since the the top 3 tanks can be switched most of the time effortless by the mm. MM weight and suchs are the same, so when the game is ``made`` and rdy to be launched, the mm can simply put the the bot top tier on the unicum side, this will either:

  • give the bot an extra win (he gets carried by the unicum)
  • the unicum a defeat (also good)

Since the effect can only apply if one side has a unicum and the other doesnt AND when the unicum is not top tier, it wont be that visible, the reason i think its still there is simple:

  • How many easy wins do unicums (playing on a unicum account!!) still get?

From beta till ``reworked mm`` it was: 25% if default win, 25% is default defeat and 50% can be won/lost, leading to 75% winratio as ceilling, unless using special platoons and suchs (2x HEAT-54 + E75, 3x IS6 etc) but nowadays? i sometimes play a whole evening, and not a single game is a ``easy win``, if i dont pull (far) above my own weight we would have lost, even in platoon, and almost every game is a close win, yet the defeats are half the time total roflstomps...

I care too much for my stats to simply bot for a few hunderd games to see how good / bad it goes, but i bet i wouldnt even win 35% if i would afk... 

(and this has been going on for months, my winratio (and those of some others i know) tanked hard since new mm, despite less arty bobs, sure grinding bad tanks also doesnt help, but the difference is remarkable (and ppl who use fake accounts and suchs seem to do even better as before...))

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I've always felt that WG has a "Saving Throw" for your last hit any time it could possibly kill you or not based on the weapons damage range.  Just WAY to many times I hit a guy and get a low roll leaving him with <10 HP.  And that is in addition to whatever shit they do to make a LTTB bounce a shell from a JPE.

link for RPG noobs https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saving_throw

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22 minutes ago, NightmareMk9 said:

I've always felt that WG has a "Saving Throw" for your last hit any time it could possibly kill you or not based on the weapons damage range.  Just WAY to many times I hit a guy and get a low roll leaving him with <10 HP.  And that is in addition to whatever shit they do to make a LTTB bounce a shell from a JPE.

link for RPG noobs https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saving_throw

I hear "low roll agony" all the time from clan mates (and some streamers) when they leave a tank with 20 and under HP.  I am fairly sure most could not rattle off the min/max range of the particular gun they are using in the heat of the moment (otherwise it would be predictive "watch me low roll this") so I suggest its part confirmation bias and part habit.

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