Dakado24

Lost control over WN8

23 posts in this topic

The control over the WN8 is lost, everyone is now using his own values and are ignoring the "official" now we can call them "pseudo-official" it was wrong move by you guys that started in the period when someone made a very bad joke of doubling and tripling values for E50 a Patton at this point you basically lost control over your own product. Please dont take it as a flame or something, I am just trying to point the things as they currently are.

 

Currently the most spread expected values that are used are those from XVM, also, they are updating their expected values online based on current results which is something that was not solved in WN8 for years, as they have obviously quite large base of samples to count it from I think its quite reliable source.

 

I am hosting my own stat-page (http://lab-vole.cz) using WN8 so I am trying to find a solution to the current situation. As Wotlabs, XVM, Wotzilla, Wotnumbers and many other stat pages have already converted to the XVM expected values I would like to ask about wotlabs and somewhat official statement from you guys, if you will continue on v30 or you will eventually convert to XVM values ?

 

 

Dakado out.

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Lost? The XVM team took over the development and maintenance of the expected values. It has been discussed on this forum by the old and new team. There have been news posts about it... It's fine to be out of the loop, but don't spread false information.

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This train has left the station a long time ago.

The powers at wotlabs concluded that WN8 is inherently and irredeemingly borked and that a lot of work on expected values is really not worth the while in the light of the recent massive rebalances of so many tanks.

So they set out to create WN9 and they actually succeded - at first. But then too many people complained about how different WN9 was from WN8 (and how many people that relentlessy played the tanks that fit their playstyle got punished in WN9 for doing that). And then WN9 was, step by step, made back into WN8 again. And then everyone stopped caring and even introduced silly expected values to prove some points.

And after some months XVM devs stepped in and asked about the whole process, abandoning the drive to create their own rating system.

So, all is well. WN8 rating and expected values are determined by largely following the guidelines initially laid out by a dedicated dev team. Whats not to like?

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@Never is mostly checked out. He's in charge of the website for wotlabs. He might or might not convert to feeding from XVM, but that isn't up to the WN8 "team". 

Control wasn't lost, but when the XVM team asked if they could be the official source, what remains of a development "team" said "go ahead". It doesn't matter too much though, because if you comb through my posts in this subforum you can find all the reasons why WN8 isn't particularly valid (mostly sitting on top of WG's intentionally bad database). Just use PR and their monthly PR, they pay for it, and its as good as anything else. 

You seem like you really care about WN8. While that is flattering, you probably shouldn't care much, if at all. It was a great leap forward at its time of release 4 years ago, and we maintained it reasonably well, but it simply doesn't apply anymore. It certainly salted the XVM team when @kitten decided to triple the E50 values for a patch, and we baited in some real butthurt padders in that time. Given that by then metric was invalid due to WG's (intentionally) shitty record keeping...I must say, as a co-creator of WN8, who cares? My hope was that everyone would move on, and either adopt the WN9 methodology laid out on this website, or move to using PR and recent PR. But it seems people really like WN8....for reasons unknown. 

Anyways, hopefully this amounts to a semi official statement. XVM guys can keep it alive easily, as WN8 was never a product, just an open source method of computing relative tank contributions. Its perfectly well documented in the wiki and seyrich and co. understand it perfectly and have my blessing. 

(hope you can help make WN8 die by taking your site down and promoting PR!)

Cheers!

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2 hours ago, Dakado24 said:

it was wrong move by you guys that started in the period when someone made a very bad joke of doubling and tripling values for E50 a Patton at this point you basically lost control over your own product. Please dont take it as a flame or something, I am just trying to point the things as they currently are.

I think the E50/Patton joke was perhaps the single best use of WN8 ever devised.  Its no more or less viable (or valuable) than any other made up rating system for epeen measurement of pixel clicking ability. 

I am not affiliated with wotlabs in any way, I don't write code, and I'm bad at memes - thus my official statement is pretty unofficial.

(edited to tone down saltiness over EU players griefing about WN8 . . . )

 

Edited by Archaic_One
grab a shovel

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1 hour ago, Dakado24 said:

they are updating their expected values online based on current results which is something that was not solved in WN8 for years, as they have obviously quite large base of samples to count it from I think its quite reliable source.

I find the wider perception of daily expected value changes somehow being "more reliable" interesting.  The extremely minor daily fluctuations don't mean much in the first place and the minor variance they introduce ensure an even less reliable tool; as there is an ever changing baseline.  In fact the daily XVM team expected value tables will be even more vulnerable to variance due to tank rentals, on-tracks, tank retirements, and other promotions.  So now every player gets to influence/determine the expected value table just by playing...

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There are 2 stats that matter to determine your ability: WR and DPG/ assisted over a certain amount of games. Anything else is a waste of time.

1 minute ago, nabucodonsor said:

There are 2 stats that matter to determine your ability: WR and DPG/ assisted over a certain amount of games. Anything else is a waste of time.

 

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Recent PR? How to into xvm?  Anyone have a config? 

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14 hours ago, flare_phoenix said:

Hello its me ur adz

There are not enough upvotes in the universe for you, so I quoted this so everybody can like it twice.

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Someone make a nice looking stat Sig that uses PR and looks as well presented as wotlabs and I’ll use it. 

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Sorry, just trying to catch up with things.. what's PR? The Personal Rating as shown in-game?

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6 hours ago, monjardin said:

Is monthly PR in the official API?

No.

 

4 hours ago, sundanceHelix said:

what's PR? The Personal Rating...?

Yes.

 

10 hours ago, bolagnaise said:

uses PR

PR is useless - WG always finds a way to screw their ratings hard. In the case of PR it's team (iirc) battles that boost PR like mad and have nothing to do with any skill except the skill to get invited into a good team.

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39 minutes ago, Jaegaer said:

 

PR is useless - WG always finds a way to screw their ratings hard. In the case of PR it's team (iirc) battles that boost PR like mad and have nothing to do with any skill except the skill to get invited into a good team.

Isn't it great that team battles are nonexistent in ASIA

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Pretty sure some people only played it when it first came out. It was supposed to be like WGL, then they changed WGL to tier 10 the season after they brought out team battles

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On 11.12.2017 at 7:11 PM, dualmaster333 said:

Changing the E50 expected values......that update was GLORIOUS

It sure brought us more traffic ergo money for Never. You know what they say, both kinds of publicity is good for business:trump:

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1 hour ago, SaintLaurentius said:

It sure brought us more traffic ergo money for Never. You know what they say, both kinds of publicity is good for business:trump:

Never had checked out well before that, that was all @Kitten :-D

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