TheTrojanWarrior

How do you be aggressive in world of tanks and prevent panicking when you're in a troublesome situation?

30 posts in this topic

It seems when ever I try to be aggressive in this game, there is almost always an FV 4005, Jagdpanzer E 100, or auto loader waiting around the corner just ready to punish me  for a single move of aggression. It feels like being aggressive is punishing me more than being passive. This kind of punishing that happens, leaves a mark for the rest of the day playing tanks and nearly forces paranoia and hardcore passiveness on my part. 

How can I prevent this? What can I do to stop taking a metric ass ton of damage the moment I try to push? 

 

Another question is on I experience often. I play a lot of mediums and I find to many situations like two other mediums rushing me, a T110E4 rounds the corner, or I get a punishment that leaves me  on 100 hp in the first 3-4 minutes of the battle. These situations cause me to panic and do shit like missing shots or rushing into a really bad position to try and get cover.

Do you guys also deal with this? If you do how do you get rid of the panic feeling?

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I think you confused being agressive with being the first tank to push enemy tanks already in the defensive positions. Generaly speaking you want to be agressive as early as possible to get FREE shots/spots on the enemy tanks before they come into their position. For example. If you come first to Mali windmill area, enemy will have to bleed alot of hp to even try contesting it on the even ground with you. What you shouldnt do (most of the time) is be the first tank to push if youre in a stalemate situation on a flank. Your hp is worth more then your teammates hp because your teammates like losses 56% of the games he play. It might be better to maybe slow grind them if you have a micropositioning advantage or even change the flank completly and engage again where you have an advantage. Sure there are situations where you have to be the first one pushing but those are rare imo.

Second question reminds me of something @Kolni said a while ago so maybe he can explain it better. Short version is that being able to pull of 1v3 is cool and makes for a fun replay but not getting in anything that isnt 1v1 is better and makes for more consistant win rate/dpg/insertyourownstatofchoice.

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Hmm.

I think what your problem is, you arent checking the team compositions properly, and aren't learning where big TDs like that habitually set up.

 

The best advice I can give you, is to check the team compositions im the countdown, or even on the loading screen, take note of which tanks they have, and take a a guess as to where you might expect them to deploy. You also should take constant notes of where you see TDs and such set up and where they generally position themselves, not just the enemy TDs, but your own TDs. Then you can learn, for each map, where TDs habitually position themselves from both spawns, and you can figure out which positions you can use that are safe from those angles.

Gradually, you'll find yourself able to loom at the team list, notice that hey, they have a Grille 15 on their team, expect them to set up in this position, so if I plan on heading to that flank, I should make sure I play in a way thats safe from that angle. 

It takes a lot of practice and a lot of trial and error, but you'll eventually get there.

 

On your second point, if you find yourself losing all your health early game, you're probably being too agressive early on. Its often better to find a forward, safe position, and feel the enemy out, let a few tanks get spotted, figure out where your team is going and where their team is spotted, and minimise risk to yourself before you commit. In this way, there will be less surprises when you do try and push. You'll see that that TD was previously spotted in that position, so you need to be weary of it. Along with this, in conjunction with the previous point, you will find yourself slowly being able to see whats spotted, what hasn't been spotted, and take a guess as to where those unspotted tanks may be. 

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Have a good motivating playlist, or sing to yourself to calm your nerves.

I personally queue the BeeGees "Staying Alive" when things get hairy. 

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I have similar problems, I tend to overextend at the start of the game way too often, or I just don't pay closer attention to team comps.

It happened to me several times that I went really aggressive for example on Arctic region, I started from south with my med and pushed along water through East, seeing my team heavies are slowly following. But instead of continuing, they stopped short in the second line and just camped there and I got immediately crushed by the enemy push while my team just watched from the back and unsurprisingly got rolled later and we lost.

I can have good games sometimes, but I have problem that I just too often autopilot to known good starting position without examining what my team really does and then dying with almost no damage.

I kinda hate that you need to be really fresh, focused and relaxed for having great game sessions. Way too often I'm just too worn out from work so I do one stupid mistake after another, as I'm mentally tired. 

I know I should stop playing in this state but hey, it is hard when you looking forward to get home and you WANT to play the game, get your daily multipliers or missions or whatever.. but you just can't help it from playing badly.

 

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8 hours ago, ThomChen114 said:

I personally queue the BeeGees "Staying Alive" when things get hairy. 

I swear, I didn't read your comment before titling this.

Describes the OP's question quite well, actually. Stayed somewhat defensive, as in I tried to never trade 1 for 1. But, I was taking every opportunistic shot I could while never allowing myself to be full exposed and isolated to multiple enemies

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10 hours ago, Assassin7 said:

Hmm.

I think what your problem is, you arent checking the team compositions properly, and aren't learning where big TDs like that habitually set up.

 

The best advice I can give you, is to check the team compositions im the countdown, or even on the loading screen, take note of which tanks they have, and take a a guess as to where you might expect them to deploy. You also should take constant notes of where you see TDs and such set up and where they generally position themselves, not just the enemy TDs, but your own TDs. Then you can learn, for each map, where TDs habitually position themselves from both spawns, and you can figure out which positions you can use that are safe from those angles.

Gradually, you'll find yourself able to loom at the team list, notice that hey, they have a Grille 15 on their team, expect them to set up in this position, so if I plan on heading to that flank, I should make sure I play in a way thats safe from that angle. 

It takes a lot of practice and a lot of trial and error, but you'll eventually get there.

 

On your second point, if you find yourself losing all your health early game, you're probably being too agressive early on. Its often better to find a forward, safe position, and feel the enemy out, let a few tanks get spotted, figure out where your team is going and where their team is spotted, and minimise risk to yourself before you commit. In this way, there will be less surprises when you do try and push. You'll see that that TD was previously spotted in that position, so you need to be weary of it. Along with this, in conjunction with the previous point, you will find yourself slowly being able to see whats spotted, what hasn't been spotted, and take a guess as to where those unspotted tanks may be. 

How many battles of doing this would you say it would take for someone to get really good at on the spot knowing where the enemy team may be?

 

10 hours ago, Gr1nch_1 said:

I think you confused being agressive with being the first tank to push enemy tanks already in the defensive positions. Generaly speaking you want to be agressive as early as possible to get FREE shots/spots on the enemy tanks before they come into their position. For example. If you come first to Mali windmill area, enemy will have to bleed alot of hp to even try contesting it on the even ground with you. What you shouldnt do (most of the time) is be the first tank to push if youre in a stalemate situation on a flank. Your hp is worth more then your teammates hp because your teammates like losses 56% of the games he play. It might be better to maybe slow grind them if you have a micropositioning advantage or even change the flank completly and engage again where you have an advantage. Sure there are situations where you have to be the first one pushing but those are rare imo.

Second question reminds me of something @Kolni said a while ago so maybe he can explain it better. Short version is that being able to pull of 1v3 is cool and makes for a fun replay but not getting in anything that isnt 1v1 is better and makes for more consistant win rate/dpg/insertyourownstatofchoice.

Is there a map positioning site that will show me how to get those early shots in or is this more of just an experienced based thing?

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1 minute ago, TheTrojanWarrior said:

How many battles of doing this would you say it would take for someone to get really good at on the spot knowing where the enemy team may be?

 

Is there a map positioning site that will show me how to get those early shots in or is this more of just an experienced based thing?

There are 'Heat Maps' which will show where most of the action takes place. Then, use your experience you gain with playing the game to realize which angles feed into those spots, and where are the biggest and thickest booshes.

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Another question that I forgot to ask in the main question. How can I improve my 'aiming', I generally have an issue where as I take the shot my hand on the mouse button will move the mouse down.

 Is there a place where these heat maps are so I can learn about positioning? @TheMarine0341

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13 hours ago, TheTrojanWarrior said:

It seems when ever I try to be aggressive in this game, there is almost always an FV 4005, Jagdpanzer E 100, or auto loader waiting around the corner just ready to punish me  for a single move of aggression. It feels like being aggressive is punishing me more than being passive. This kind of punishing that happens, leaves a mark for the rest of the day playing tanks and nearly forces paranoia and hardcore passiveness on my part. 

How can I prevent this? What can I do to stop taking a metric ass ton of damage the moment I try to push? 

 

Another question is on I experience often. I play a lot of mediums and I find to many situations like two other mediums rushing me, a T110E4 rounds the corner, or I get a punishment that leaves me  on 100 hp in the first 3-4 minutes of the battle. These situations cause me to panic and do shit like missing shots or rushing into a really bad position to try and get cover.

Do you guys also deal with this? If you do how do you get rid of the panic feeling?

Play something Russian, preferably something whose name begins with 'IS' or 'Obj'

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59 minutes ago, TheTrojanWarrior said:

Another question that I forgot to ask in the main question. How can I improve my 'aiming', I generally have an issue where as I take the shot my hand on the mouse button will move the mouse down.

 Is there a place where these heat maps are so I can learn about positioning? @TheMarine0341

http://www.vbaddict.net/heatmaps/

 

I personally like to watch @BigCheese256's youtube channel when it comes to aiming: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCOyXOlpFQB2W2orgaSFoubA

Look at how he uses 3rd person to minimize exposure, and to get quicker snap shots. When I first came across his content, it blew me away from a pure mechanical stand point

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4 minutes ago, TheMarine0341 said:

http://www.vbaddict.net/heatmaps/

 

I personally like to watch @BigCheese256's youtube channel when it comes to aiming: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCOyXOlpFQB2W2orgaSFoubA

Look at how he uses 3rd person to minimize exposure, and to get quicker snap shots. When I first came across his content, it blew me away from a pure mechanical stand point

Wow those heat maps look like they can help a lot with what you said about conflict areas! thank you.

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Famous Kolni post #2525253454545

Read team comps thoroughly - When there's a lot of big guns, which is fairly common on T10, you have to adjust to it. Pushing up gets riskier because you can get punished harder, even when there's only 1 or 2 of them they can still blap you if you play into them. This is something you need to learn to circumvent it and prevent it from happening at all. So how do you do it? 

  • Put yourself in their shoes. Where would you go? Where would you be based on this information that your team is giving and the info the enemy team is? Or are they windowlicking braindead mongoloids that won't ever move? Common camping spots should be considered, and that they could have moved up and what the maps allow for. On a map like Tundra for example there's very few places a TD can sit on and have tanks running into their shots. Those places are best left alone until you gain advantages elsewhere until the point where it basically doesn't matter if you get caught by it or take a hit. On a map like Ruinberg however where the big alpha TDs have an easier time not camping and actually playing the city puts you in a trickier situation, especially from the south where you're naturally disadvantaged on the field so playing city is the better option. Now you need to time reloads, not poke on corners you don't have vision on and constantly keep your micromanagement up to still deal out damage since it's a riskier angle. Even worse is that you're basically running against the clock due to the field being won sooner or later, so until you can time these things and put yourself in a situation that would counter yours and prevent it from happening you're going to get caught by these things. This is much easier on lane maps than open ones due to vision control. 

 

  • Follow up on information. Have they been spotted anywhere? How is that area looking in terms of winning/losing? Have they pushed up, stayed or perhaps relocated entirely? What's their mobility? How far can they have gone? Where should they be now? - These are all questions you should be asking and answering to deduce what the possibilities are. This basically goes for any tank, but keeping track of the really big guns is the easiest and also the most important since one poke can cost you everything. Keep track of the minimap constantly, treat the enemy team as a wave rather than single tanks and you can control it better. When the information is simply not enough you have to start taking more procautions. Avoid checking corners that nobody's checked. A trick to this I picked up from MOBA games is that treat all areas you have absolutely no vision of that anything can be happening there, the enemy team can do anything on areas you don't see. This is how people get blown up by five tanks pre-aiming a corner. Same rule applies to big guns. Don't check areas you don't have vision of, and if you must then figure out a route and way so you can stay as safe as possible. This means little exposure and cover to get into after doing it, just in case. 

 

  • Execution. Get good at fighting them. They have a huge alpha but also a huge reload, a lot of people won't rush shots and others will. Use both to your advantage. Give shots that can't pen, or just poke very quickly so they have to rush their shot if they want to hit it (play the odds pmuch). You'll notice that a russian medium can sink 3 shots into a TD still waiting for a good shot he can pen, it happens frequently. TDs hate missing shots over everything else, but not penning them is the same. Force them into bad-bad decision. On reload they're XP pinatas. 15 seconds is more than enough to get a positive trade out of it. 

For aiming, check your grip. If your mouse goes downwards while pressing your grip is probably poor. Your palm should block the mouse from doing any free movements combined with thumb and pinky. Palm should be on the surface you have your mouse on, and the actual grip is whatever's comfortable really. I run a claw grip. 

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Straik is posting videos on Youtube almost daily right now.  His ability to keep his gun hot in a central location while avoiding taking any damage is pretty impressive.

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Also, you can try quick peeking with just your turret, especially on ridges and stuff. That way you will most likely spot them(and they you) when you get back into cover safely. If you can track them while quickly spotting them even better.

There is a difference between early game aggressiveness and mid-late. Early usually if you are in a fast tank you can get to choke points/spot them before you spot them. While during the later, tds and such can set up position to pre-aim, so they are more likely to hit and pen you. When you push mid-late game use terrain and limit the line of firing you are exposed to as little as possible i.e. avoid being cross fired by the enemy, and as much avoid going to areas which haven't been cleared of enemy position and keep an eye out for where enemy tanks were last spotted or even if unspotted. Xvm can help with both of this if you still need time or can't keep track (last spotted location + enemy currently spotted/initially lit and unspotted/unspotted till so far).

 

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@TheTrojanWarrior for how long it takes, it probably depends how observant you are, and how long it takes you to remember those positions and retain the information for every map. For me I remember grasping it pretty quickly, learning where everyone always goes. 

Expect to make mistakes, expect to get killed because you didnt expect a tank there. The best thing about that though is then you've learned "okay, theres a TD that sets up there, ill be careful of that position in the future" 

Ill be honest, I could even compile a list of all the maps and mark locations that TDs are most likely to set up in for every map, I could do it for the old maps, but not the new 1.0 maps as I've played like 20 pub battles in 1.0, if that lol. 

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Also a huge tip on map positioning: twitch. Watch where good players go in a certain situation and see why they get out of it. Its basicly a shortcut to playing each map, each spawn 100 times to get a hold of meta.

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On 4/12/2018 at 11:30 AM, TheTrojanWarrior said:

It seems when ever I try to be aggressive in this game, there is almost always an FV 4005, Jagdpanzer E 100, or auto loader waiting around the corner just ready to punish me  for a single move of aggression. It feels like being aggressive is punishing me more than being passive. This kind of punishing that happens, leaves a mark for the rest of the day playing tanks and nearly forces paranoia and hardcore passiveness on my part. 

How can I prevent this? What can I do to stop taking a metric ass ton of damage the moment I try to push? 

 

Another question is on I experience often. I play a lot of mediums and I find to many situations like two other mediums rushing me, a T110E4 rounds the corner, or I get a punishment that leaves me  on 100 hp in the first 3-4 minutes of the battle. These situations cause me to panic and do shit like missing shots or rushing into a really bad position to try and get cover.

Do you guys also deal with this? If you do how do you get rid of the panic feeling?

Also, what tanks do you play? If you run meds or squishy heavies you're going to have to avoid damage by applying some amount of foresight by not taking shots, as opposed to forcing a bounce by twitch which is something you can do in some heavier tanks, e.g. the E5 or 268 v4. In other words, as you probably already know, you need far less situation awareness in heavies, and this applies to surviving unexpected engagements also.

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20 hours ago, TheMarine0341 said:

I swear, I didn't read your comment before titling this.

Describes the OP's question quite well, actually. Stayed somewhat defensive, as in I tried to never trade 1 for 1. But, I was taking every opportunistic shot I could while never allowing myself to be full exposed and isolated to multiple enemies

TBH I think you let a couple of teammates die unnecessary because you was to passive.

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39 minutes ago, Lowlife555 said:

TBH I think you let a couple of teammates die unnecessary because you was to passive.

Possibly near the end, but that allowed me to stay alive with the HP I needed to win. Id rather sacrifice others in a pub so that I can still win it, than put my tank on the line and possibly lose. Competition and platooning allow communication, so we're able to focus and support. Pubbies wont/cant make the plays your friends would

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9 hours ago, lavawing said:

Also, what tanks do you play? If you run meds or squishy heavies you're going to have to avoid damage by applying some amount of foresight by not taking shots, as opposed to forcing a bounce by twitch which is something you can do in some heavier tanks, e.g. the E5 or 268 v4. In other words, as you probably already know, you need far less situation awareness in heavies, and this applies to surviving unexpected engagements also.

I play my mediums mostly. Fast mediums like the T62a (I'm god awful in it, for the life of me I can win in this tanks), OBJ 140, and AMX 30B.

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Yeah I pretty much tend to have the same problems as the OP. As per others' suggestions I've been trying to focus on picking always the flank where we have an advantage since just having more bobs around you increases your chance of survival—trying to heroically defend against an overwhelming force on the other flank will just get you killed with 2-3 shots of damage and piss you off royally, while trying to lead a push is much more likely to result in breakthrough and victory or at least a tough but satisfying fight. If just 1-2 other tanks from your team go for hill on Tundra, and you go with them, you'll probably just get yoloed instantly and die so it's better to try and salvage something elsewhere even though the hill is such an important position.

Also I think it's good to avoid becoming salty, people can do ridiculous things in game but getting angry over it will just put you on tilt and also make you more prone on blaming things always on the team even when maybe you were out of position. In any team game there will be people who screw things up for themselves and by extension the team, and WoT is no exception—and even if it was really their ignorance that lost you a battle, it's not the end of the world, nothing will happen and you can ride into the next battle, get a new lineup and push for victory.

And I 100% second the part about using 3rd person mode for shooting—it does seem to be the way at snapping shots with minimal exposure and I'm disastrous at it (as well as shooting in general).

On 4/12/2018 at 4:48 PM, TheMarine0341 said:

I swear, I didn't read your comment before titling this.

Describes the OP's question quite well, actually. Stayed somewhat defensive, as in I tried to never trade 1 for 1. But, I was taking every opportunistic shot I could while never allowing myself to be full exposed and isolated to multiple enemies

Old, but gold:

 

 

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Wow this is more difficult than I thought it would be O_O. I never new how much thought could have to be put into this game and into strategy. seeing as I'm terrible at strategy games, this may take a while. 

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