ZXrage

Supertest: Obj. 277 (Tier X after T-10)

124 posts in this topic

They've just given up on making even the remotest fucking sense. It feels as if everyone who had actually a grasp on what was going on, left for other projects and WoT is stuck with the interns who joined last week. I really, really miss the SerBian times of the game.

At least the Bobject isn't king of the hill anymore, I guess. *sighs* Just... Urgh. This has become so exhausting. Heavy tanks ain't heavy enough? Uparmor them. Tanks can't deal with heavy tanks anymore? Introduce more powerful bullshit to counter. Tanks can't deal with the bullshit counter anymore? Introduce superprammo. What's next? Uparmoring the superheavies again? Arty rebuffing?

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This pen is just so unjustified. I could understand it if the gun handling would be trash with bad accuracy. But it has great gun stats with best in class acc for a heavy. If it has to be good why not just give it 340mm like all the other Heat shooter but APCR. Probably still too good but at least I could understand where the number is coming from. 

The armor of this beast is also very good. Turret has only one cupola and it is small and well armored. So you will have a hard time penning it. 

Sides do have the the Russian Blackhole just above the tracks. This stripe of spaced armor eats pretty much everything. Funny tho, there is a small strip of penable armor just above the spaced. 

Upper front plate does seem to have two armor thicknesses. Next to the connection point between ufp and lfp my pen indicator changes from green to orange. 

Beside. The ufp angle seems kind of funny. When the enemy 277 is above you just a bit it becomes autobounce for AP and APCR. Not saying this is something special, but I rly noticed this fighting against it. 

Oh yeah I almost forgot. The mobility is not just comparable to the 5A it is actually better. 

So far this thing only gets balanced by the 5.5deg gun depression. 

 

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3 hours ago, hall0 said:

This pen is just so unjustified. I could understand it if the gun handling would be trash with bad accuracy. But it has great gun stats with best in class acc for a heavy. If it has to be good why not just give it 340mm like all the other Heat shooter but APCR. Probably still too good but at least I could understand where the number is coming from. 

The armor of this beast is also very good. Turret has only one cupola and it is small and well armored. So you will have a hard time penning it. 

Sides do have the the Russian Blackhole just above the tracks. This stripe of spaced armor eats pretty much everything. Funny tho, there is a small strip of penable armor just above the spaced. 

Upper front plate does seem to have two armor thicknesses. Next to the connection point between ufp and lfp my pen indicator changes from green to orange. 

Beside. The ufp angle seems kind of funny. When the enemy 277 is above you just a bit it becomes autobounce for AP and APCR. Not saying this is something special, but I rly noticed this fighting against it. 

Oh yeah I almost forgot. The mobility is not just comparable to the 5A it is actually better. 

So far this thing only gets balanced by the 5.5deg gun depression. 

 

It's weird cuz from the stats you'd think this thing would be about as mobile as an IS-7, and the IS-7 is slower than the 5A in pretty much all situations except going downhill. I wonder if they tinkered with the terrain resistances before they dropped it onto the test, otherwise this is inexplicable.

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Funnily enough even Quickybaby is basically saying that off the bat it will be OP because of the gun handling and the amazing gold round penetration. It's not too often that he flat-out declares a tank is likely to be OP before it hits live as he tends to be 'conservative' in his opinion.

Frankly, this would be the first OP tier-10 that I could get straight away as I have 224k xp saved up on my T10 so wouldn't mind being able to try one out straight away lol. It does seem a bit ridiculous when you consider it. Nerf its gold round and it's still a very good tank.

One question: can it sidescrape? Given it has the semi-rounded lower plate and doesn't seem to have much of a pike nose, it seems like it might be able to do so reasonably well?

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Had 100k XP saved up on t10 and used it for free XP by mistake. Had to start again, only at 50k now

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350 APCR is just wrong. This is something I would understand for IS-7 or other bad gun handling heavies.

P.S. I stopped playing after Obj WTF ver. 4.

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The fucking APCR shell needs to get fixed by turning it into 340 pen HEAT. That alone would make it a lot more balanced. The gun is still ridiculous, but the issue is that it has an amazing gun and good mobility with fairly good armor. Worse than the IS-7, but better than the 5A. Nerfing the accuracy or handling too much turns it even more into a 5A clone. Instead, just keep trashing on the (hull) armor until the tank becomes balanced.

I honestly wouldnt mind if it had the sameish hull armor as the T-10, as the gun is just so good.  Armor nerfs also makes it more different from the IS-7, so there is that.

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it would be fine (broken APCR round aside) if it was basically just the T-10 on tier 10, i.e the same turret/hull armour effectiveness (you could flatten out the pike so you could angle it) then the improved gun, handling, DPM, alpha etc. would make sense and it would be clearly weaker to the other Russian heavies (hell it would be weaker armour wise to a 430U).

But you are again getting too much of a good package, bouncy hull armour, very good turret armour, amazing gun with everything you need, handling, DPM, alpha, high pen and even decent accuracy. 

Have the gun and the mobility, bin the armour off so it's the weakest armoured tier 10 heavy pretty much, then you'd have a balanced tank. (and obviously nerf that prem round)

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On the plus side it isn't too far removed from the 5a given it has some pluses and minuses. I don't think we're talking 268.4 / 430u on this one.

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When the 257 got into the game I had just unlocked all the modules on the T-10 so I got the 257 in his elite config but rightly without any XP towards the IS-7. Since i found my crew in the 257 i started slowly grinding the IS-7. What a waste of time (should be my middle name actually) that was. Thank god the T-10 is very nice to play

Or do I forget the 277 since is a very similar gameplay to the 5A and I will eventually end up with two very similar tanks?

As Ezz just said it doesen't seem to completely overshadow the 5A being just flat out better version of it.

 

277 has:
- 15 mm more silver pen and 10 mm more gold pen
- .35 base accuracy compared to .39 (.32 vs .36 with equip and skills)

5A has:
- 7° of depression compared to 5.5°
- marginal better dpm, so little it's almost not even worth metioning

 

Id' take the 277, it's not like 5° of depression ever stopped the T-10 from being pefectly (more than) playable. Is mobility mosty the same? Is 277's armor really much better than 5A?
I didn't mention that 277 gold has 1.800 m/s shell velocity so it's nice for tracking moving targets but 5A has HEAT so no pen loss. Does this balance out the 10mm more gold pen? At which distance the two shells level out pen wise?

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277 hull looks like it actually bounces things. I struggle to bounce consistently in the 5A. 

 

Also APCR>HEAT.

Especially 1800m/s APCR.

 

If anything there are more +'s on the 277's side as it is now. 

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20 minutes ago, MagicalFlyingFox said:

If anything there are more +'s on the 277's side as it is now. 

To be fair it has more -'s than the 268.4 vs ... well... most meds, heavies and TDs.

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34 minutes ago, Ezz said:

To be fair it has more -'s than the 268.4 vs ... well... most meds, heavies and TDs.

268v4 is still more broken (even after nerfs) since even total noobs perform super good in it. This will require you to be at least green to overperform massively. 

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It's the only saving grace of this tank, it's got a lower plate most tier 9s and 10s will pen with ease and it's pretty big, so it's not some weakspot free rolling bunker like the v4

It's more 430U levels of OP IMO, just far too good in too many areas that obsoletes other tanks. 

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7 minutes ago, tajj7 said:

It's the only saving grace of this tank, it's got a lower plate most tier 9s and 10s will pen with ease and it's pretty big, so it's not some weakspot free rolling bunker like the v4

It's more 430U levels of OP IMO, just far too good in too many areas that obsoletes other tanks. 

It's worse than the 430U though because it can do more plus the prem shell gives you too big of an advantage. It's one of those tanks I will never try to 3 mark since that will require pure gold spam. 

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2 minutes ago, hazzgar said:

It's worse than the 430U though because it can do more plus the prem shell gives you too big of an advantage. It's one of those tanks I will never try to 3 mark since that will require pure gold spam. 

I'd reckon it's about the same, at least you can pen this in the turret, 430U has 300 plus cupolas.

Plus 430U has amazing camo for no apparent reason, higher than a Bat Chat. The only real weakness as a complete all rounder does everything well tank the 430U has is the crappy accuracy. 

The only real weakness this thing has is the gun depression and crap camo as a heavy, pretty much every other role, including sniping this thing will be able to do pretty much as well as any other tank specialised in those roles. 

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51 minutes ago, tajj7 said:

I'd reckon it's about the same, at least you can pen this in the turret, 430U has 300 plus cupolas.

Plus 430U has amazing camo for no apparent reason, higher than a Bat Chat. The only real weakness as a complete all rounder does everything well tank the 430U has is the crappy accuracy. 

The only real weakness this thing has is the gun depression and crap camo as a heavy, pretty much every other role, including sniping this thing will be able to do pretty much as well as any other tank specialised in those roles. 

430U has worse accuracy, worse alpha, worse prem round in both shell speed, type and pen, 200 less hp, worse power to weight (ok better resistances but this will be faster on hard ground) and more turret bloom (better move bloom but turret bloom is the thing that matters most) 

 

but overal because of the acc + super fast shells this gets another role where 430U sucks. It can snipe. 430U cannot. 

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24 minutes ago, hazzgar said:

430U has worse accuracy, worse alpha, worse prem round in both shell speed, type and pen, 200 less hp, worse power to weight (ok better resistances but this will be faster on hard ground) and more turret bloom (better move bloom but turret bloom is the thing that matters most) 

 

but overal because of the acc + super fast shells this gets another role where 430U sucks. It can snipe. 430U cannot. 

With food bia and vents you can lower the accuracy of 430U to .35. Which is more than enough for sniping. 

277 has horrible camo rating which limits your ability to snipe really heavily. I believe it was around 9% with camo skill+camo paint in 277. 

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5 minutes ago, Katoleras said:

With food bia and vents you can lower the accuracy of 430U to .35. Which is more than enough for sniping. 

277 has horrible camo rating which limits your ability to snipe really heavily. I believe it was around 9% with camo skill+camo paint in 277. 

277 can hit weakspots at range, 430U can't. 277 can shoot targets on the move, 430U is much worse at it. Also camo is useful but not in those late game situations when the enemy knows where you are and he is very cautuious so you have narrow options for shooting him. Late game 277 will be better. Not only it can hit scouts that try to relocate but also it has the pen to dig out many hull down tanks. All 430U has for late game is good camo which is important but only on some maps and vs morons.

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43 minutes ago, hazzgar said:

430U has worse accuracy, worse alpha, worse prem round in both shell speed, type and pen, 200 less hp, worse power to weight (ok better resistances but this will be faster on hard ground) and more turret bloom (better move bloom but turret bloom is the thing that matters most) 

 

but overal because of the acc + super fast shells this gets another role where 430U sucks. It can snipe. 430U cannot. 

The camo, agility, turret armour etc. are all advantages to the 430U. The 430 is able to snipe, it's just not great at it, but that is it's one single weakness.

Basically the 430U obsoletes pretty much all medium tanks currently.

And this thing is going to obsolete all heavy tanks currently. 

That is why I said they are similar, both this and 430U are E5 levels of all round tank but on steroids. In that they are basically good to excellent in almost every single way. 

But I don't see this being more OP than the 430U. 

 

 

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30 minutes ago, tajj7 said:

The camo, agility, turret armour etc. are all advantages to the 430U. The 430 is able to snipe, it's just not great at it, but that is it's one single weakness.

Basically the 430U obsoletes pretty much all medium tanks currently.

And this thing is going to obsolete all heavy tanks currently. 

That is why I said they are similar, both this and 430U are E5 levels of all round tank but on steroids. In that they are basically good to excellent in almost every single way. 

But I don't see this being more OP than the 430U. 

 

 

Yeah but the turret armor is strong on both. Yeah the 277 has a weakspot but it's tiny and a bit back. I wouldn't see it as more op than 430U if it had a normal prem round. But 1800m/s 350mm pen is what makes it better. Pen e3 superstructure. Pen angled tanks more reliably. This is huge. 

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I have watched a couple of videos that did not actually feature this tank, and everybody was setting these on fire frontally a LOT, like Dez set 3 on fire in one game.  If it burns like chinese fireworks - that could definitely balance it a bit.  Probably not 1800 m/s worth of balance, but a start.

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