Deus__Ex__Machina

Object 268 V4 Supertest Nerfs

46 posts in this topic

37 minutes ago, Vesirott said:

I don't see a reason to create such whine and drama about this tank.

I'd like to take this tool, give him a tea-spoon and then pit him in an arena against a fully plated knight on a plated horse. Once he manages to defeat said knight with the spoon, he can go back to his job as he may have learned a valueable lesson. If not, he gets a soup-spoon, but has to face a horse archer this time around.

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15 hours ago, Madner Kami said:

I'd like to take this tool, give him a tea-spoon and then pit him in an arena against a fully plated knight on a plated horse. Once he manages to defeat said knight with the spoon, he can go back to his job as he may have learned a valueable lesson. If not, he gets a soup-spoon, but has to face a horse archer this time around.

He will just flank the knight. Murazors signature move.

Gg ez

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I mean people in the balancing department are not idiots despite how we feel about their work. These are at least somewhat intelligent people who are able to put on their own clothes and get to work and log on to a computer etc. How is it possible to communicate such utter garbage with a serious face? Like I said, I do not believe they are stupid so they must be acting stupid. Does it make us the idiots for listening and reacting to their obvious trolling/lies?

For Murazor specifically: IF you game has corridor maps, then you balance your tanks around corridor maps, not some "perfect game" type of game state. IF/when you resolve the map problem, then you rebalance your tanks around the new environment. How fucking hard is it to understand this simple truth? Now I'm like 95% sure they are just fucking with us...

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On 5/14/2018 at 5:19 PM, tajj7 said:

Nowhere near enough, what the tank is doing now, basically yoloing around in people's faces, blapping them with 650 alpha and them bouncing on it, it will be able to do after these changes.

Armour nerf doesn't change a lot, you might get 60% chance to pen on the cupola now with tier 10 guns, so people who don't spam premium at it might pen 1 more shot out of 10 than they do now.

The lower plate is auto-bounce so who the f cares what the thickness is unless you can overmatch.

And the tank will still have 55kph top speed, 18 hp/ton, better than fast heavy ground resistances, and 20 kph reverse speed that no other TD or heavy at tier 10 has IIRC. So basically it is still as fast a medium, just a little bit more sluggish.

And 2.3s aim time for a 152mm with 907 dispersion is still excellent and at the ranges these things fights is meaningless, especially when you have 290 AP pen or 360 HEAT.

My suggestions would be -

  • Top speed 45kph
  • Reverse speed 15kph
  • hp/ton around 15
  • Aim time 2.7s
  • Cupola 200mm
  • Lower lower plate overmatchable to most tier 10 guns. 

Then it would still be more than mobile for an armoured TD (those stats still shit on an E3 or JpE100) has a tiny lower plate it needs to hide, and a cupola tier 8s can pen that it needs to wiggle. 

Actually the first and last point is enough. What's broken is not the gun, TDs should have silly OP guns! But they shouldn't have such high top speed while being almost invulnerable from the front. It's retarded. A heavy tank like the v4 would be broken af, the lack of turret doesn't make it less broken.

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  • Aim time changed from 1.92 s to 2.4 s (2.21 s in the first ST iteration)
  • Changed the engine power from 1500 to 1350 HP
  • Power-to-weight ratio changed from 20 to 18 hp/t
  • Reduced reverse speed from 22 km/h to 20 km/h
  • Increased the bloom from moving and turning from 0.115 to 0.153 (0.144 in the first ST iteration)
  • Increased the bloom from moving and turning at maximum speed from 6.33 to 7.67 (7.91 in the first ST iteration)
  • Increased the bloom when turning the hull at max speed from 2.65 to 3.38 (3.31 in the first ST iteration)

Additionally:

  • Increased the gun moving bloom from 0.096 to 0.115
  • Reduced the HP from 2100 to 2000
  • Reduced the traverse speed from 23 °/s to 22 °/s
  • Decreased the maximum speed from 55 km/h to 50 km/h
  • Reduced the gun laying speed from 31.3 °/s to 29.2 °/s

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10 hours ago, Deus__Ex__Machina said:

Reduced reverse speed from 22 km/h to 20 km/h

Yeah, no, fuck off WG. 12kph is a nerf, not 20. 

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They need to nerf either the speed or armor. They seem to be going with the speed. I agree that reverse nerf is quite insignificant however top speed -5kmh is almost right. Now there is a chance it wont be first one on the hill...

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6 hours ago, MagicalFlyingFox said:

Yeah, no, fuck off WG. 12kph is a nerf, not 20. 

Overall it is a big nerf. They still want to keep the campbreaking potential without murdering the fighting capabilities too much.

According to these changes the traverse speed will be trash because of the nerf to the nominal traverse and the pw/t so I guesstimate to be between 19-20 effective on hard.

The gun nerfs are pretty big bringing the bloom stats from way better to being worse than a 5a with Vstab, without considering that the Bobject does not have a turret. So it seems that it will not be able to snap at medium range as well as it did before.

Another thing to consider is the 5% HP reduction and with the less mobility and the ability now for even tier 8s to "pen" it, the tank's survivability should have been decreased of quite a bit. Also the worse speed makes it a little less effective at closer range than before.

Let's see if WG changes their mind on it though.

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Debatable. 20kph is still fucking huge and the armour nerfs are meh at best.

The entire premise of the tank is bullshit though. Assault tank destroyer, smh.

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4 hours ago, MagicalFlyingFox said:

 

The entire premise of the tank is bullshit though. Assault tank destroyer, smh.

I agree, I'd rather have it removed or completely reworked. But we can't expect much from WG can we?

 

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On 5/15/2018 at 12:15 PM, Vesirott said:

I mean people in the balancing department are not idiots despite how we feel about their work. These are at least somewhat intelligent people who are able to put on their own clothes and get to work and log on to a computer etc. How is it possible to communicate such utter garbage with a serious face? Like I said, I do not believe they are stupid so they must be acting stupid. Does it make us the idiots for listening and reacting to their obvious trolling/lies?

For Murazor specifically: IF you game has corridor maps, then you balance your tanks around corridor maps, not some "perfect game" type of game state. IF/when you resolve the map problem, then you rebalance your tanks around the new environment. How fucking hard is it to understand this simple truth? Now I'm like 95% sure they are just fucking with us...

It's clear you never worked in a large company if you think it's impossible for an entire department to be run by idiots. Using your logic Kodak had run its company to the ground on purpose resisting the technology of digital cameras they invented on their own, Nokia resisted going with Android. You are very naive. You are in for a harsh reality check unless you are very lucky in life or have a very specific job. Most people are either bad at their jobs or unmotivated, many competent people at big companies are not listened too if there is an incompetent person leading a team. 

 

Also if a company contineously makes the same mistakes, over and over then they are idiots. Also obj 268v4 is broken even in non corrior map meta. It's less broken but it's still 10x better than every other TD out there, better than most heavies and quite a few meds.

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20 hours ago, hazzgar said:

It's clear you never worked in a large company if you think it's impossible for an entire department to be run by idiots. Using your logic Kodak had run its company to the ground on purpose resisting the technology of digital cameras they invented on their own, Nokia resisted going with Android. You are very naive. You are in for a harsh reality check unless you are very lucky in life or have a very specific job. Most people are either bad at their jobs or unmotivated, many competent people at big companies are not listened too if there is an incompetent person leading a team. 

 

Also if a company contineously makes the same mistakes, over and over then they are idiots. Also obj 268v4 is broken even in non corrior map meta. It's less broken but it's still 10x better than every other TD out there, better than most heavies and quite a few meds

You need to take a break from posting. Thank you for telling me how large companies work and where I have worked and where I have not worked. 

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3 hours ago, Vesirott said:

You need to take a break from posting. Thank you for telling me how large companies work and where I have worked and where I have not worked. 

Just commenting on what I observe mate. If you feel offended phrase yourself more clearly. English may or may not be your second language and I do sometimes blabber myself but don't take it on me your posts are either hard to understand or suggest god knows what

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On 5/19/2018 at 11:31 PM, hazzgar said:

Also if a company contineously makes the same mistakes, over and over then they are idiots.

You are assuming that their messure of success is the same as yours. You want a balanced game that you enjoy. They want your money. Those are two very different goals that may align, but don't have to.

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2 hours ago, Madner Kami said:

You are assuming that their messure of success is the same as yours. You want a balanced game that you enjoy. They want your money. Those are two very different goals that may align, but don't have to.

That's another kind of mistake. It's short term thinking. If they will maximize short term profit over long term sustainability they will lose on profits in the long run. WoW is nowhere near its peak but it has been losing players slowly because Blizzard cares about it's players. You may not like the choices by the devs but the players are not being milked. Though that is a different pay model but unless the find the right spot between cashing in and balance they will accelerate the games demise and in a short time they might be getting x2 as much money per player but have x4 less paying players. 

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See above. What you think is right and good, doesn't necessarily work out for them. They can make money without you. Can you play Tanks without them? The game doesn't need a lot of maintenance, so it can run for a long time with minimal investment before folding and assuming that a diversified company like WarGaming thinks ahead for a long time, is an intrinsical error. They have no legacy to uphold, unlike some companies, so lack even the most basic form of obligation to it's customers. If they're gone, the people in charge will already be elsewhere.

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The only thing we can control is if we play the game and how much money we spend.

 


Don't like what WG have been doing? Stop playing and stop paying. 

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On 5/19/2018 at 9:07 PM, nabucodonsor said:

 

According to these changes the traverse speed will be trash because of the nerf to the nominal traverse and the pw/t so I guesstimate to be between 19-20 effective on hard.

 

Changes to the PW/T don't actually change the effective traverse on tanks with one engine such as Tier 10 tanks since the nominal traverse is already adjusted for engine power (normally the stock engine, but tier 10s have only one engine). The only things that would make a difference are terrain resistances and the nominal but since terrain resistances aren't changed the effective traverse is only nerfed by about a degree.

If the tier 10s had a stock engine option that remained untouched while the top engine gets nerfed, only then would you see a change in traverse.

Case in point: the 113 has the same nominal traverse and terrain resistances on all surfaces as the 5A but has 1.66 more HP/T. If engine power made a difference, it would turn faster but the effective traverses on all surfaces are identical.

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