DHP

The P.43 Bis, 240 alpha ? Yes please !

31 posts in this topic

Waouh ! This tank is a god send after the tier 5. I personally free xp the 90mm which after the tier 5 debacle with its 75mm was straight out mandatory imo, and it's fairly cheap on free xp.

 

The gun, O-M-G. 240 alpha gun is really good, the two other medium that get a 90 and 88mm at this tier “only” have 220 alpha so this is actually the biggest (non derp) alpha gun on a medium platform (the other two being the Skoda T40 and the VK 30.01 P), and the enemy can feel it because you have the soft stats to back it up.

 Compared to the other two you have relatively bad dispersion at .4 compared to .38 and aim time is .1s slower but the softs stats is where this thing shine, you globally have better softs stats than the other two with 7 deg of gun depression, trust me this thing aim really fast and lands shots no problem. And since you have 2k dpm you won’t have trouble killing your enemy extremely fast.

 Mobility is a bit behind the other two with 15hp/t but you have better tank rotation and turret traverse with its decent ground resistance. Simply put, it’s no slouch.

As far has the armor goes I wasn’t able to checked on tanks.gg so I don’t have any number but it’s fairly good, there aren’t a lot of armored medium at this tier but it’s definitely in the top 3 with all the T34-85 variant. It has 80mm of armor on the turret which is flat so not very good but the hull is 80mm of slopes armor so you can bounce a lot and even more when you are using some depression. Plus the 50mm of side armor allow you not to get overmatch at every corner which is a plus.

You find the same weakness from tier 4 to 7. Shell velocity is atrocious at 700m/s (which is in line with the other gun of this class but much less then the lower caliber you can find at this tier) !

 

TL;DR : Don’t skip this tank ! Imo it’s probably one of the best tier 6 atm. Definitely a keeper.

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I loved the VK30P for the combination of alpha, mobility and armour that can bounce (turret in this case) - it's my first ever 3-mark. This one certainly sounds competitive as it seems to have a similar combination. I'll probably look to start the grind here, assuming I can scrounge up enough free XP, and my usual is to stick around at tier 6 to grind crew skills (as I didn't end up buying the premium).

Thanks for your mini-reviews. Will probably look to skip the tier 5 but may try out the tier 4 for the luz.

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1 hour ago, Balthazars said:

I loved the VK30P for the combination of alpha, mobility and armour that can bounce (turret in this case) - it's my first ever 3-mark. This one certainly sounds competitive as it seems to have a similar combination. I'll probably look to start the grind here, assuming I can scrounge up enough free XP, and my usual is to stick around at tier 6 to grind crew skills (as I didn't end up buying the premium).

Thanks for your mini-reviews. Will probably look to skip the tier 5 but may try out the tier 4 for the luz.

P43 is a bit more brawly than the 3001P though, what with more hull armour, poorer accuracy, and an absolutely horrific shell velocity

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24 minutes ago, lavawing said:

P43 is a bit more brawly than the 3001P though, what with more hull armour, poorer accuracy, and an absolutely horrific shell velocity

I prefer the 3001p since I'd rather have turret armor than hull armor. You can't go "hull up" and shoot from the hip lol. Plus the slow shell gives me cancer. VK also has better pen (especially prem) and vr so it does better when bottom. 

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^Agree.

Personally I thought it was sub-par bordering on bad.

It's IMO a 'looks good on paper' tank, that in practicality is crap.

240 alpha and that DPM on a tier 6 med does indeed look good, shame it's let down by terrible pen on both rounds, awful shell velocity on both rounds, meh gun handling and terrible mobility.

Also considering the amount of -10 gun depression tanks about these days, -7 feels bad on a tank like this.

Oh and this tank also for some reason has terrible penetration drop off, 50% higher on both rounds than most other tier 6 mediums, I'm pretty sure that at 500m some of the tier 6 mediums still have better pen on their premium rounds than this does at 200m. 

Doesn't come close to like a Rudy or T-34-85M or Cromwll IMO, plus the 30.01 P after the buffs is a much better option even if the alpha is a little lower. 

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For me, the tier 6 was reasonably effective, but not a keeper.

When near the top of the list,  it was quite good played as a heavium with its high alpha and trolly armor.

When near the bottom of the list, it had difficulty contributing. But it was not totally painful if you could find something soft to shoot at despite the sluggish speed. The camo could also be leveraged once in a while.

All in all, it was okay.

(Now the tier 7 -- that has been an excellent tank for me.) 

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It has comparable gun handling to a t-35-85.

 

One has 180 alpha and the other 240. I'm sorry but for the gun you get the handling was very very good.

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I really didn't enjoy the tier 6.  The poor mobility killed it for me.  The tier 7 on the other hand is really, really good. 

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I've kept the bis as I'm slowly grinding up the ter.  

After the bland tier 5, having that 90mm gun at tier 6 that isn't a heavy tank or tank destroyer really makes you sit up and pay attention. This thing really shits on lower tiers, and also not to be discounted by the higher tiers. Gun handling feels okay, and you can sorta accept the tradeoff for that big alpha and yet not suffer too badly for it.

The front armor is surprisingly bouncy, which just adds to its bully factor and lends some explanation as to why the Italians think this tank would've been their heavy tank. 

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On 5/26/2018 at 10:50 PM, DHP said:

It has comparable gun handling to a t-35-85.

 

One has 180 alpha and the other 240. I'm sorry but for the gun you get the handling was very very good.

Huge difference in shell velocity and better acc and aim time for t34-85

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Are you all trying to play this tank as a sniper or something? I am not sure how you are all failing to enjoy this tank.

I averaged 1.35k dpg and even that only got me 1st class despite having multiple 2.5k+ dmg games.

P.S. This tank needs 80% gold ammo and food or accuracy gives you cancer. Kind of like t-54, use gold or go home.

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On 6/12/2018 at 3:12 PM, Katoleras said:

Are you all trying to play this tank as a sniper or something? I am not sure how you are all failing to enjoy this tank.

I averaged 1.35k dpg and even that only got me 1st class despite having multiple 2.5k+ dmg games.

P.S. This tank needs 80% gold ammo and food or accuracy gives you cancer. Kind of like t-54, use gold or go home.

No. We are just not using full ACPR so when FORCED to snipe (you know you don't choose where the enemy goes) we have to cope with super slow rounds where you don't. 

 

Also no T-54, at least pre changes still worked better with 50/50 loadout without gold than this does. What is worse this is a tier6. What tier6 requires 80% gold + food? I 3 marked the type64 with a 60/40 loadout. Saying this tank requires t10 setup to be good means it's shit. 

 

PS. You have 1300 dpg over 30 battles. How is that a statistically significant sample? Not to mention 53% win rate. Mate I had amazing results in many tanks over the short run. I really did. I pulled 73% wr on the badger with 3700 dpg for 42 battles and that tank doesn't even suit my skills (I hoovered between 58 and 61 before selling the acc over large number of battles with sub 3k dpg). I would never say it's an amazeballs tank

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3 hours ago, hazzgar said:

No. We are just not using full ACPR so when FORCED to snipe (you know you don't choose where the enemy goes) we have to cope with super slow rounds where you don't. 

 

Also no T-54, at least pre changes still worked better with 50/50 loadout without gold than this does. What is worse this is a tier6. What tier6 requires 80% gold + food? I 3 marked the type64 with a 60/40 loadout. Saying this tank requires t10 setup to be good means it's shit. 

 

PS. You have 1300 dpg over 30 battles. How is that a statistically significant sample? Not to mention 53% win rate. Mate I had amazing results in many tanks over the short run. I really did. I pulled 73% wr on the badger with 3700 dpg for 42 battles and that tank doesn't even suit my skills (I hoovered between 58 and 61 before selling the acc over large number of battles with sub 3k dpg). I would never say it's an amazeballs tank

It doesn't change the fact that this tank is better than 90% of the mediums in tier 6. You are basically playing a tier 6 tank with a tier 8 medium alpha, which makes it easier to put on a fight when you are a bottom tier. And if you are a top tier, you can bully all day with that hull armor and high alpha. There is just no scenario where this tank is problematic.

Just because a tank requires gold ammo and food, doesn't mean it is a bad tank. With that logic, nobody should even touch light tanks.

Remember the E100 Brick days? Top notch heavy with 235 pen in tier 10, yet it was a top class cw tank because when you used gold, it worked like a charm. Just like this tank, or T-54. Would you consider T-54 a top notch medium if you had no access to 330 heat and had to play with 200 pen? I wouldn't. (Talking about 2014 T-54 when it was considered one of the best mediums with that 200 base pen gun)

Ammo type makes or breaks certain tanks, this happens to be one of them.

Use gold and you are a god, grind through it with 0 problems and move on.

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On 6/12/2018 at 9:12 PM, Katoleras said:

Are you all trying to play this tank as a sniper or something? I am not sure how you are all failing to enjoy this tank.

I averaged 1.35k dpg and even that only got me 1st class despite having multiple 2.5k+ dmg games.

P.S. This tank needs 80% gold ammo and food or accuracy gives you cancer. Kind of like t-54, use gold or go home.

IMO a bit absurd to run food and gold on a tier 6, but .35 acc with 2400 DPM doesnt sound half bad...

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17 hours ago, Katoleras said:

It doesn't change the fact that this tank is better than 90% of the mediums in tier 6. You are basically playing a tier 6 tank with a tier 8 medium alpha, which makes it easier to put on a fight when you are a bottom tier. And if you are a top tier, you can bully all day with that hull armor and high alpha. There is just no scenario where this tank is problematic.

Just because a tank requires gold ammo and food, doesn't mean it is a bad tank. With that logic, nobody should even touch light tanks.

Remember the E100 Brick days? Top notch heavy with 235 pen in tier 10, yet it was a top class cw tank because when you used gold, it worked like a charm. Just like this tank, or T-54. Would you consider T-54 a top notch medium if you had no access to 330 heat and had to play with 200 pen? I wouldn't. (Talking about 2014 T-54 when it was considered one of the best mediums with that 200 base pen gun)

Ammo type makes or breaks certain tanks, this happens to be one of them.

Use gold and you are a god, grind through it with 0 problems and move on.

You saying it's better than 90% doesn't mean it is better. You are basically playing an m6 that sacrifices everything for some top speed it only reaches on the downhills. And yes there is a scenario where this tank is problematic - meeting t7 and t8 tanks since the prem shell is still rather low pen and the acc is low so fighting 2nd line when fighting the big boys is a problem while your armor becomes a hindrance since it's then useless while you are as slow as a russian heavium.

 

Also I didn't say just because a tank requires gold + food it's bad. But a TIER 6 tank that requires FULL (important factor) gold is bad. In tier6 you meet people with 75-90% crews and no crew skills, less prem ammo spam and overal less skill. If you need an even bigger advantage to stomp over them then the tank is bad. I have no issues with using food and gold since I play a ton of lights. It's just it's a t6 med that only works in a tryhard setup so you can stomp people with no skill, crew and probably idiotic equipment choices.

 

PS. Cromwell Berlin also gets great results for people only because it's a prem and people run it with food + prem ammo. 

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@hazzgar you have 140 pen at tier 6. Why do you need gold ? I finished with like 1.5k dpg with like 10% gold (if even..) i did run food thought like all tier 5 tanks and above.  Tanks.gg has armor details again. Did any of you check the armor ? Someone mention M6. But did you see that it has better armor than an M6 ? One goes 50 the other 35.. Everybody has it's own opinion i guess but it's clearly in the top 3 of tier 6 tanks imo. People complain about shell velocity and i agree but it's only and issue in a few shots every few games unless completely sniping from the back. which is probably why people complain about the penetration also...

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42 minutes ago, DHP said:

@hazzgar you have 140 pen at tier 6. Why do you need gold ? I finished with like 1.5k dpg with like 10% gold (if even..) i did run food thought like all tier 5 tanks and above.  Tanks.gg has armor details again. Did any of you check the armor ? Someone mention M6. But did you see that it has better armor than an M6 ? One goes 50 the other 35.. Everybody has it's own opinion i guess but it's clearly in the top 3 of tier 6 tanks imo. People complain about shell velocity and i agree but it's only and issue in a few shots every few games unless completely sniping from the back. which is probably why people complain about the penetration also...

Why are you asking me that? I'm not the one saying you need to run this with 90% gold?

 

Also not someone. I mentioned m6. I explicitly mentioned that m6 goes 35 vs 50 for this. The problem is this reaches 50 only on long downhills while it cruises at 38 vs 33 for m6. Please read my previous posts

 

Read my post about m6 vs p43 comparison.

P43 is better in:

- 15kph better top speed

- It's smaller

- It has better hull armor

- Hull and track bloom

 

M6 is better in:

- standard pen 

- prem pen

- shell speed

- accuracy

- aim time

- Turret bloom

- gun depression

- power to weight

- quickybaby doesn't say it's a good tank

This shows p43 is a squished m6 that got some extra hull armor and size, a top speed it reaches as often as an amx 40 for a much worse gun and less gun depression. As for top3 t6 tanks - I take type64, t37, t34-85m, vk3001p, Skoda 25, Strv 74, su100 over it. I'm with circon here that the tier7 is much better. 53%wr on t6, 64% on t7.

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@hazzgar I like how you're giving me EVERY SINGLE advantage of the M6 but not all the P.43Bis advantage. 

The turret rotation and track traverse alone make this tanks twice as mobile as an M6, not even mentionning the 10kp/h (vs 20)reverse speed which makes the M6 slugish on brawling.. 

I don't even know why you started to compare this tank to an M6 ? One of the streamer you keep mentionning told you ?The P.43 goes twice as fast on the field as an M6. You can't bring an M6 to where you bring a P.43Bis.. You can't bring 240 alpha on the medium side.. Maybe you can brind a vk30.01p but not an M6 so.. I don't understand you're point of comparision. 

 

Ps: i can't disagree to the fact that the T7 is better tier for tier. But's it's also amazing so it's hard to compare. Also i think T7 has better MM than T6 (imo).

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11 hours ago, DHP said:

@hazzgar I like how you're giving me EVERY SINGLE advantage of the M6 but not all the P.43Bis advantage. 

The turret rotation and track traverse alone make this tanks twice as mobile as an M6, not even mentionning the 10kp/h (vs 20)reverse speed which makes the M6 slugish on brawling.. 

I don't even know why you started to compare this tank to an M6 ? One of the streamer you keep mentionning told you ?The P.43 goes twice as fast on the field as an M6. You can't bring an M6 to where you bring a P.43Bis.. You can't bring 240 alpha on the medium side.. Maybe you can brind a vk30.01p but not an M6 so.. I don't understand you're point of comparision. 

 

Ps: i can't disagree to the fact that the T7 is better tier for tier. But's it's also amazing so it's hard to compare. Also i think T7 has better MM than T6 (imo).

Yeah be toxic because I mentioned one streamer 2 times. Or maybe it's 5 times given how much attention you pay to who wrote what. P43 doesn't go twice as fast when the cuising speed is sub 40kph unless you are going downhill. 

I am also not impressed with 240 "on the medium side" because it's not a medium. It's a heavium labeled as a medium. It has heavium hp/t and heavium mobility. The only thing that makes it a medium is hp, designation and top speed it rarely reaches. This is why I compare it to heavies. VK3001P is noticeably more mobile. Yeah p43 is traversing fast but traverse means little when it moves slow (it works both ways - just look at the slow traversing bobject - it hardly matters and the tank is super mobile)

 

Overal stop being so butthurt about the tank. The community is split about it. Streamers are split, people here are split. It works for some, it doesn't for others. It's not some 2nd coming of christ if it's only good for a part of the community even if it works for some

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6 hours ago, sohojacques said:

How can 240 alpha with solid dpm at tier 6 be so unfun? 

Working as intended comrade?

In my opinion, most of the 240 alpha tanks at tier 6 are not fun. Either they are slow or the guns are derpy or the armor is exceptionally bad or the ROF is slow enough that the fast firing pew pew tanks wreck them.  

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@Hellsfog On paper it looks similar enough to the T-34-85M and it’s a stronk bully when occasionally top tier.

But something funky is going on with the mobility and gun handling. It literally can’t get up a hill to save itself. I think the only time it gets over 30kph is going downhill.

Got the tier 7 last night which I’m really enjoying though. Funny how little more than Vert. Stabs and a decent donk can make it very competitive a whole tier higher. So any buff to the tier 6 would make it broken OP....

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