Nekommando

Yeah, sticking your barrel in hes barrel means bb arty (and no punishment).
Still, we need more hero`s like the E100 in this team

He didnt say anything, he just turned around and killed the CGC, when other arty complained he said something along the lines of: get cancer arty, and also killed the other (he also wasnt banned, hurr durr)
Due to arty, the maps are shit and shit maps + arty lead to TD hordes, this coupled with gold ammo makes heavys pointless unless they get buffed, making mediums crap (they now get shit on by arty, tds, bad maps and OP heavys) and its not heavys thats the problem, not is gold ammo helping meds, its arty fucking it, arty and nothing but arty.
Arty not only always fucked my games and ruined my glorious wins, arty ruined the entire game.
For every fucking dog that plays arty for fun, there is 1 player that left the game due to said arty, outright removing arty and giving only compensation in credits and free crews would have costed far less players as the constand arty shit does.
im 100% certain that arty is the most common reason people quit wot, its not OP / UP tanks, russian bias, bad balance, ``low tiers beiing to weak against high tiers``, or all the other tanks people complain about, if people could pick 1 single option it would be fucking arty, every single person i know irl that played wot and quit wot quit due to arty, every single person in the clan that quit, quit partly due to arty, sure they might also dislike other things, but arty is always one of the main reasons what makes wot so rage inducing once in a while.
to all arty players: FUCK YOU VERY MUCH
 

Hello all,
After 8 years of wot, i give up.
I started playing wot during the closed beta in augustus 2010 (so almost 8 years ago) and while i was often mad, the core of the game was so good, that all the small things WG did for the good or bad didnt change that much. The overall direction the game was goiing was also good so slowly the game grew more and more on me. This was the game i always wanted: tanks fighting tanks, without all the other lame ass crap** (except arty, arty was, is and will always be c****r)
All i wanted (and did) was bashing random bobs in randoms while platooning with stronk pleyers. Hence i have  been in 322 / 247/ FAME / 322 for 6 years, not for worthless cw trash, but for stronk plutons.
Over the years WG showed the amazing abibility to:
Make the worst maps in gaming history and despite rewoking some 4 times (cough *komarin* cough) still failing in making them playable Too retarded to fix the elephant in the room that killed the game as a whole (arty) Total lack of foresight when adding things you cant undo (tier 10 TDs and later on arty and light tanks) Toss in the fact the only person in the whole company with both common sense and real power was siderailed (our lord and saviour  ) And the game never mananged to live up to its full potential.
OP tanks were originaly always nerfhammered, to keep the average the average, and most ridiculous forum suggestion where ignored, and when they didnt ignore it, like gold ammo for credits, it lead to a shit show, which ofc took a year to fix (m4 sherman with 150 pen and 350 dmg anyone? etc etc etc.
However despite all of it, the game roughly stayed the same:
The real problems, gold ammo and arty got ignored OP tanks dont get fixed fast small all round improvements Yet, the past 2 years, it started to change. the core strengths of the game got slowly ditched:
The menus / garage where updated, making it a cluster fuck of chaos, instead of a clear easy to read menu for missions (which the game always had!), the menu became worthless, i simply stopped following missions, too much work / clutter Historical accuracy got ditched, leading to fantasy tanks and bs armour models new OP tanks dont get nerfed, insead old models got buffed, leading to powercreep Due to the above, all tanks slowly become the same, they all got dpm and gun depression buffs, all tanks started losing weakspots The real changes, which would have totally revived the game, sandbox, never happened, while heavy tanks got better, they did it by buffing them, not by nerfing what makes them crap in the first place (gold ammo!! and arty) Toss in the awefull map reworks, and a physics patch which makes driving TDs a pain and the game went for me downhill fast and as cherry on the top, still tons of arty to ruin your game. The game is now back to square 1: camp 2 win, and you try? you die!
It was fun the all the time i lasted, i think i never played a game longer as i played this one, but the game simply turned to shit because WG was unwilling to remove arty in 2012 and reduce dmg of gold ammo 20% in 2013. And now the player numbers slowly start to fall, ``forcing`` WG to milk the playerbase for as long as they can, ruining the game entirely (see all the new russian super tanks)
I always said the only company capable of killing wot is WG, and for me they succeeded, after playing daily/ weekly from august 2010 till jan 2018, having 6 years of non stop prem account and playing more as 50.0000 games during those years, WG managed to make me basically quit. (i do have enough credits to keep playing for ever, but i probably wont even bother)
Imo its a shame WG fucked the game up so hard, but so be it, i still got 6 months of prem left, so gonna play a bit.
ps: perhaps the gold ammo changes + inevitable rebalance that will follow 3 months later will magically improve everything, but i somehow doubt that, ever since Serb left, WG never had the balls to really change something, they always backpeddled like coward weaklings...
Wotlabs is also almost dead, so thats why i made a topic
GehakteMolen, the biggest arty hater to ever play
 
ps: something that always bothered me: unlike all the wannabe arty haters, my arty hate knows no limits** there are only 2 players who hate it as much as i do, everybody else i just pretending to hate arty.
I never defend(ed) arty from scouts rushing in nor protect them in anyway way or shape, and the only reason i dont mass tk them is due to the ban system, anyone who helps arty win a game is a traitor for the good cause: trying to ruin the game for arty. All arty deserves is curses and friendly fire, they are the scrouge of this game and the reason everything is the way it is (open maps not working , heavy tanks badly balanced, TDs they way they are and so on and on). I also never platooned with arty (for 2 players i made and exception) and never told them gg or anything other positive (i thinkg, perhaps i made a mistake) what i always did do was report them for unfair play, untill WG disabled that feature, due to unicums getting falsly reported aswell.

Pretty sure this is just a retired tank from Florida, which will drive 10mi under the speed limit in the passing lanes and curse you out for asking how their day is going

SU-100M1 IMHO is OK, you either camp bush like a cyka or you RUSH B LEFT MOUSE DONT STOP. Gun has excellent base accuracy and lightening fast aimtime so don't bother aiming down sights if you are in a "well-balanced" map.

I need advice for 101 however. Heard horror stories before, gonna buy it anyways; which gun to use stock and elite? Do I start as a SU-122-44 with shitty MM, or as a 100M1 with shitty MM? Is the elite 122mm better than the elite 100mm? Optics or GLD?

You mean spaced part? Ehm no. 90° direct into the sides tanks.gg gives you ~220-258mm. And this is totally non angled. Above the spaced you get your 200 pretty much the same as on the IS-7. Spaced armor is as blackholy as it is on all Russky Heavys. Just below the spaced there is a small area with ~200mm. A bit lower and the fun with the angling starts. Only a fool would call this a weakspot. Angle a bit and you get numbers up to 500 and more. Cool story. This side armor is flat out better than the IS-7s and it is a tier lower. 
And as usual pike noses get worse if you angle it. But hey. Even angled too hard, it still gives you 250-260mm protection without the flater shoulders the IS-7 has to deal with. Facing an enemy who is not willing to shoot gold you are safe.
Not being able to get tracked with dmg is just the cherry on top. But hey it has an overmatchable roof. Definitely balanced. 
We are discussing numbers here and not feelings. And just by the stats comparing it to other tanks we can already see a picture. And just because there are no "going ham" videos of a tank which has been released just one day ago that does not mean the tank is good to go. I don't even know why this should be an argument at all. 

https://thearmoredpatrol.com/2018/01/14/wot-insider-info-14-01-2018/
Source: Rykoszet Insider
"The WT E 100 (P) is considered as the main prize for the next personal mission season"

This. This is exactly what WoTLabs is about. Just like when you play badly, it's your own fault. The fact that you have inadequate forum etiquette is your own fault. True, we are not the most accessible forum, but we are closer to real life.
If, in my job, I get someone like you asking me questions that can easily be searched, I'll answer once or twice. The tenth time, you're bottom of my to-do-list. The fiftieth time, you'll be the main example of the person to ignore in lunch time rants with anyone whose help you might also need at some point.
Luckily, you only seem to be impulsive and lazy (and now defensive), so you strongly belong to the bracket of people that can learn from their mistakes.

It's ok I found a better forum which answered my question. I understand the culture you have here and that your numbers are dwindling. Thanks.

Close. You've got the right sub forum. Now navigate to the 2nd page of this sub forum. Locate the tank specific thread. Read or skim that thread. See if you get enough info from that. If not then post a replay where you felt lost...in that thread.

After a thread on the forums about  aimtime and how it works. I decided I wanted to figure it out exactly. All we know for now is that aim time is the time it take to reduce the aimcircle to 40% its size, dispersion is something that  say show much the circle gets bigger and accuracy is the size of the aimingcircle when fully aimed. However, we do not know  the exact relations between these 2 and how exactly they  influence the size of the aiming circle at all times.
So thats what I set out to do, finding a mathmatical description of the size of the aimingcircle. The method is simple: measure the size of the aimingcircle for different tanks and speeds in a trainingroom.   Thanks for uglycousin for giving me a second person to set up the trainingroom.
To measure the size of the circle, first I  did the test driving in the room. Then I watched the replays and paused at certain moments. I then took a screenshot of  my whole screen, makign sure I was always in 8x zoom. Then I took those screenshots into paint and measured the circle diameter in pixels.
I will now describe the process and results of my investigation. But if you dont want to read that, scroll down tot he conclusion on the bottom.
Disclaimer: the following formulas are NOT what WG uses, I made a linear  model that describes the size of the aimingcircle as close as possible. 
Aiming circle bloom

I assumed there where 3 variables that had an influence on bloom: speed, dispersion and accuray. I tried to do test in which I held 2 variables constant to  see the influence of 1.

 I started  with gathering data of 2 different dispersion numbers for which I picked 4 tanks with different accuracy and measured the size at each speedincrease of 10 untill 50 kph.
These are the raw results:



 


From that I made a graph of the dispersion in function of speed , and calculated the gradient  of the graph assuming linear increase.  Then obviously  the  aiming circle size = C*v+accuracy.

With V=speed and C being the gradient, which consist of unknown  factors. To check the linear approach was decent I plotted the model and experiment:


 
As you can see the linear approach to the speed factor isnt perfect but not massivly different, only in the middle it differs.  I am happy enough with this.

Now we need to determine what the C factor consist off. Since there are only 2 variables left, it has to consist dispersion or/and accuracy components.

 
As you can see in the data, with the same dispersion numbers, the aiming circle fort he same speed is bigger when the accuracy is bigger.  So there has to be an accuracy factor in C,  which is proportional to accuracy.   
Here you can see accuracy vs circle size:


 
As you can see, the increase isnt marginal. We can now rewrite our formula as:

Size=Acc(D*v+1)

With D an unknown factor containing dispersion in some form.  As we can see, size of aiming circle is directly proportional to accuracy. So an increase in accuracy of 25% will results in 25% better gun handling.  This is why the E50/E50M have such amazing gun handling , their dispersion isnt great , but good, but due to the very good accuracy their gun handling is much better than at first glance.  The WZ-132-1 has the exact same dispersion values, so you would think the gun handling would bet he same, but no, since it has 33% worse accuracy is will have 33% worse gun handling, which is massive! Thats more than a vstab! 

Next task is determining the factor D. The only  variable left is dispersion, so I tested different tanks with differnt dispersion at the same speed, their accuracy was different, but thats fine, sicne we can normalise for that.    These numbers showed that the factor D was proportional to the dispersion values, so D=c*dispersion, with c an unknow constant.

Now the formula looks like this:

S=Acc(c*d*v+1)

Determining c was done by plottign the experminetal result and  trying some numbers until the model best fits the experiment. I took c=0.68.

The influence of dispersion can be see in this graph:


Now we have a formula that gives a perfect description of aiming circle size in function of all variables.  Next up is determing a  the time it takes fort he circle to shrink, or the actuall aiming time for the tank.

 
Aiming time:

We know aiming time is the time it takes fort he circle to shrink by 60% its startign size.

 So we can write:
S1=S2*(4/10)^(t/T) with T=aiming time, S1 size after time t, S2= starting size.

Solving this for t we get: t=T*(log(S1/S2)/log(4/10)).

  We can now determine the time it take from any speed to reach any size we want.

To determe the time it takes to fully aim, jsut replace S1 by the accuracy of the gun. Note this time is independant of accuracy! ( which is logical, since it needs to go to  a smaller circle but also does it faster, these 2 cancel out)
Plotting this for 3 different tank in fucntion of time comming to a stop from a speed of 50 (40 for conway) we get:


 
Influence of equipment/skills etc.

Now that we have every formula we need we can quantify the influence of equipment/skills/directives/modules. To do so simply multiply the variable that gets influenced by (1-0,01*improvement in %). Dispersion values only get influenced by vstabs and the smooth ride skill.Other equipment only influences the accuracy value.

 Note that the same improvement to acc or dispersion results in a bigger improvement in size for what improves acc than what improves dispersion. Vstabs for example do not make the size of the circle shrink by 20%, they make the increase in size  less by 20%.
Lets take a look at a common dillema:vstabs vs gun laying drive, lets try this on 2 different tanks:




 
We can clearly see what the difference in vstab and gld is, vstab makes the circle smaller, so you start smaller but the decrease is still the same, gld starts at a bigger size but then starts to decrease faster, catching up tot the vstabs. In the BCs case, the time to fully aim is actually lower when equiping gld than when equiping vstabs.

Mathmaticly, gld decrease the total time to aim by 10%,  whereas vstabs decrease the total time to aim by subtracting 20% *initial size. To know wether vstabs or gld is better depends on the tank and how much you want to aim, you can determine this by pluggin in the numbers and plotting it for each vehicle, sicne i twill be different for each.
As general rules however, these apply:

·      - Bad dispersion + bad aimtime:

 Vstab better, unless you  fully aim from full speed.
·     -  Bad dispersion + good aimtime

:Vstab better, unless at high speed when fully aiming.
·       -Good dispersion + bad aimtime

:Vstabs always superior
·       -Good aimtime + good dispersion

:Vstabs always superior

 

 
Conclusion and TLDR:

·      - Accuracy has a massive  influence on aiming circle size on the move, they are proportional.

·      - Aiming circle size is proportional to speed/dispersion.

·       -To determine what gun has better actual gun handling: multply accuracy with dispersion, the lower the numbers the better the gun handling.

·     -  Size of aiming circle= Acc(0.68*d*v+1)

·      - Time to fully aim = Aiming time*(-log(0.68*d*v+1)/log(4/10))

·      - Vstabs is superior to gld in most situations.

·     -  Influencing accuracy gives a better boost than influencing dispersion values.


 
Whats next?

Next up I need to investigate how turning the turret and hull   effect dipsersion and work with the above formulas.

 I wil also try to combine this with  my previous thread where I determined shot distribution in the aiming circle, then I can plot change to hit a target vs time and determine the optimal time to shoot.

 
I hope you enjoyed the read and that i twill help you  determinign how a tank will perform. I hope that youtubers do become aware that accuracy has a massive influence over dispersion, as  currently reviews are misleading since they dont know what actually effects gun handling. Spread the word!

I played tortoise before the superheavy meta, and it was the best tank I've ever played. Not anymore, but let's see how WG rework this line (and hopefully give it a bigger gun,better armor or downtier to T8 )

Guys you all forgot how accuracy works for Soviet tanks:
THE BIGGER THE NUMBER,
THE BETTER THE ACCURACY!

 

I played tortoise before the superheavy meta, and it was the best tank I've ever played. Not anymore, but let's see how WG rework this line (and hopefully give it a bigger gun,better armor or downtier to T8 )

I played tortoise before the superheavy meta, and it was the best tank I've ever played. Not anymore, but let's see how WG rework this line (and hopefully give it a bigger gun,better armor or downtier to T8 )

like the t9 strv, the tortoise can snipe. the key difference is that it can - if need be - also brawl. the t9 strv is limited to a purely sniping role hence why I hate it and have a sub 30% winrate in it.
Sure you can situationally brawl t7s but that means shit when you need siege mode to do so.

<PTSD Intensifies>
 
For those wondering how RNGod hate us all here's the original thread 
 

Guys you all forgot how accuracy works for Soviet tanks:
THE BIGGER THE NUMBER,
THE BETTER THE ACCURACY!

 

Guys you all forgot how accuracy works for Soviet tanks:
THE BIGGER THE NUMBER,
THE BETTER THE ACCURACY!

 

<PTSD Intensifies>
 
For those wondering how RNGod hate us all here's the original thread 
 

T49 rectal-reaping squad has nothing to do with casemate; they used to frontally HE pen a pre HD E3, how's a turret gonna help .

Guys you all forgot how accuracy works for Soviet tanks:
THE BIGGER THE NUMBER,
THE BETTER THE ACCURACY!

 

<PTSD Intensifies>
 
For those wondering how RNGod hate us all here's the original thread 
 

<PTSD Intensifies>
 
For those wondering how RNGod hate us all here's the original thread 
 

T49 rectal-reaping squad has nothing to do with casemate; they used to frontally HE pen a pre HD E3, how's a turret gonna help .

Guys you all forgot how accuracy works for Soviet tanks:
THE BIGGER THE NUMBER,
THE BETTER THE ACCURACY!