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A question to you Purples who got their from Blue/Green

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so recently I took a 1 Month break from WOT. now before that I was struggling with map Strategy, controlling the map etc. when I started playing about a week ago, I was doing much better than before, and it wasn't just having better shots, doing more DPG. I was instinctively using map control getting early damage, taking out the top tiers right away. and this feels strange because usually I don't think about doing these things. and I wondered if it was like this with all Purples who didn't start out as purple.

Sorry that was a bit vague

 

My question is: purples who where once Blue/Green, did it just tick in your brain about what to do? or was it a learning experience?

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I never had the epiphany. If anything, I probably got worse after playing mostly 7/42 for the past half a year.

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My breakthrough came playing the Leopard 1 line.  The tanks in that line cannot take a hit and playing them forced me to stop unnecessarily trading HP.  Although I still play aggressively, I choose my engagements and know when to retreat from a failing flank.  I believe I was still solid blue at 12,000 games.

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Was plateaued around 56.5/blue for quite a while.  Took three major things to get me past that:  1.  Indisputable proof that a solopubber could do better.  2.  A decision to put in the work necessary to improve myself.  3.  Lots of advice from better players.

 

My first attempt to "improve" was little more than focusing on OP tanks and using more gold, but I was only lying to myself.  Things got worse before they got better, as playing out of my comfort zone led to initial bad results.  Once I had worked some of the advice into my regular play style, the stats followed.  Sadly, I seem to be plateaued right on the blue/purple border again.  Mostly because I'm too busy to keep my edge, but also because I'm not adapting well to the shifting meta.  

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These were my stats 5k battles ago. 

 

D6SBoQk.png

 

I had recently acquired a T-62A, and that started my enjoyment of mediums, but also forced me to play more conservatively, trade HP effectively, and learn the maps a lot more than I had before. 

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As a very aggressive player, learning to be comfortable running away from engagements that I'm not happy with has increased my survivability while allowing me to still play aggressively, and therefore increasing the impact that I am able to have on the game.

 

As far as the engagements themselves go, watching really good player's replays/streams has helped quite a lot, basically enforcing the idea that you should always either be shooting at something or be getting into a position to shoot at something.

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learning experience mostly, i learned from each tank's characteristics, so i know with this kind of tank what i am capable of and what i should absolutely not do. also as well as observing better player and try to understand their motive

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My epiphany was courtesy of CrabEatOff. I had been gradually albeit slowly improving prior to that, but his badgering me forced me to improve. The epiphany in question was the engagement paradigm so beloved of him: camo/draw>exposure>armor>first strike>hp

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Learning steps for me (in chronological order):

 

1: Weakspots

2: Map Knowledge

3: Tank Characteristics

4: Basic Brawling skills

5: Use of crew skills/equipment/consumables/ammo types

6: Effective usage of Armour

7: Effective usage of Camo Mechanics+Vision Mechanics

8: Enlightenment of using mobility as a weapon

9: Effective use of terrain as cover 

10: Managing tank soft stats, Optimising crew and equipment for each individual tank

11: Using HP as a commodity to trade with the enemy, not for feeding to the enemy to boost their stats

 

I was about Step 6 when I left NA for SEA.

 

I also platooned alot to learn from people I knew who were better than me at the game.

 

 

Luckily I was able to get the correct mindset very early on, I was a 48%er once, but I sought to improve and learn to be not useless at the game and think:

 

'I will never be as good as him'

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My epiphany was courtesy of CrabEatOff. I had been gradually albeit slowly improving prior to that, but his badgering me forced me to improve. The epiphany in question was the engagement paradigm so beloved of him: camo/draw>exposure>armor>first strike>hp

 

Could you ellaborate more or link on that please?  By draw I assume you mean draw distance? 

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It goes like this:

 

The best advantage you can have is invisibility (being in camo or beyond max spotting range). Failing that, the next best advantage is having little exposure. Then, having armor (IMHO armor is just a subset of exposure but I digress), then being able to strike first, and finally having an HP advantage.

 

It should be noted that Crab played in a bit of a different meta where camo and vision was fundamental to even basic success.

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I think the key things that pushed me over the edge were knowing how to limit exposure and making conscious decisions about my positioning. I honestly can't recommend KraftLawrence's article, The Importance of Having a Plan, enough. In addition to the pregame countdown timer planning Kraft advocates, you need to be flexible during the game as well. Always look for an unguarded flank that you can take advantage of or a hole in your own team's defenses that needs to be plugged.

 

Regarding Crab's hierarchy: I think armor wins games in pubs. In my opinion, his hierarchy makes sense if you're playing to damage farm because it keeps you alive the longest but falls flat if you're trying to do everything you can to win a game. When you make yourself visible to the enemy, they're going to stop and shoot at you more often than not. You can abuse this! If you present a part of your tank that is relatively invulnerable (be it a stupidly strong turret over a hill, sidescraping with Stalinium side armor, or whatever), you can bait the enemy into locking on to you and making themselves useless. If you can get two or three of their heavy hitters to do this, you've given your team a huge advantage because the enemy's guns are wasting time ricocheting off of your armor and aren't killing your pubbie teammates.

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Yeah, those immeasurable factors like staying power (you don't need armor for this - the KV-5, for example, is pretty much a paper punching bag against its peers) are very important to winning games in tanks that can abuse them.

 

Still, when crab posted that it was very accurate. Things like staying power don't have much influence when every other map is a pre-change Redshire copy.

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i come from a rather heavy starcraft background, so evaluating my own play is pretty second nature to me.

 

really a pity all the people who have fps backgrounds have much better twitch reflex than me - can't compete with them there....

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I never stopped looking for ways to improve and I mostly just improved steadily over time. There is not a specific moment I can point too and go: "There. Right at this moment did I become purple in skills".

It all happened over time with steady improvements. I did find most of the improvements easy to make once I knew what to do, though. Dont know if that counts for anything :P

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I believe my situational awareness is from my fondness of RTS, and that really helps with understanding when and when not to be aggressive and/or passive.

Experience is the easiest source material accessable, and should help understand what went wrong in those moments where victory seemed possible.

Cant always win, but that doesnt mean trying aint possible.

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' When you make yourself visible to the enemy, they're going to stop and shoot at you more often than not. You can abuse this!'

 

This quality is underrated. We've all seen tanks moving to town on Lakeside stop to shoot the lone scout on the middle road. 3 or 4 barrels will move in unison toward the single target, thus giving up valuable time needed to gain a favorable position in town. Or ascending the hill in Malinovka. Have an enemy move toward town and every tank stops their push up the hill t shoot at him.

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It goes like this:

 

The best advantage you can have is invisibility (being in camo or beyond max spotting range). Failing that, the next best advantage is having little exposure. Then, having armor (IMHO armor is just a subset of exposure but I digress), then being able to strike first, and finally having an HP advantage.

 

It should be noted that Crab played in a bit of a different meta where camo and vision was fundamental to even basic success.

 

 

Regarding Crab's hierarchy: I think armor wins games in pubs. In my opinion, his hierarchy makes sense if you're playing to damage farm because it keeps you alive the longest but falls flat if you're trying to do everything you can to win a game. When you make yourself visible to the enemy, they're going to stop and shoot at you more often than not. You can abuse this! If you present a part of your tank that is relatively invulnerable (be it a stupidly strong turret over a hill, sidescraping with Stalinium side armor, or whatever), you can bait the enemy into locking on to you and making themselves useless. If you can get two or three of their heavy hitters to do this, you've given your team a huge advantage because the enemy's guns are wasting time ricocheting off of your armor and aren't killing your pubbie teammates.

 

Yeah, those immeasurable factors like staying power (you don't need armor for this - the KV-5, for example, is pretty much a paper punching bag against its peers) are very important to winning games in tanks that can abuse them.

 

Still, when crab posted that it was very accurate. Things like staying power don't have much influence when every other map is a pre-change Redshire copy.

 

SexxyRexxie coming to my defense <3.

 

CarbPork - that info is about a year old now, the tail end of the arty meta, the beginning of the TD meta, right around the big pen nerfs and well before the major map overhauls that have happened in the last year. Things were very different when arty was often the deciding factor and every map was as flat as can be, where 600m shots were lined up all over the place! As the wise Biggie said "things done changed".

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that info is about a year old now, the tail end of the arty meta, the beginning of the TD meta, right around the big pen nerfs and well before the major map overhauls that have happened in the last year. Things were very different when arty was often the deciding factor and every map was as flat as can be, where 600m shots were lined up all over the place! As the wise Biggie said "things done changed".

 

Remember they used to thump, but now they blast right?

 

I think the engagement hierarchy you endorsed is as it's core (ie for any single engagement in particular) still true. The caveat now is that the frequency of the various types of engagements has changed. Camo/vision is still very much the best way to engage an opponent if it is available. The problem is that map and meta changes have made it less available. Instead of being able to force the engagement in your favor that way on almost every map, you are funneled into short range areas where it is no longer an opinion. So now, ideal tank selection is revolved around those that can invisi-tank when presented the opportunity but do not suffer in exposure/armor engagements. Aka bow down to the T-62a/Obj140 overlords.

 

If I get off my ass, I'll present my slight revisions to the hierarchy in a RBS article or something.

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I think it is a mix of things. If you have played the game enough, explored the maps etc., there are certainly things you can put into practice that can instantly change your gameplay. One is knowing when to run away. Not because it's always going to win you the game, but because you'll be able to do more damage, and get better stats. And when you put yourself in a position to do more damage, you'll be surprised in what you'll be able to do.

 

For myself, I can play around the 3.5-4k level on days that I feel like it, but I simply don't have as much fun being patient. I play below deep purple because I have fun getting right into the action at the very start, and seeing how long I can survive being the focal point of the other team. But it's very important to practice patience at times, and know where it can get you. Another main thing is to always conserve your hp. You may think that it makes sense for you to lose half your hp to kill that T21, but the reality is that purples win alot of late games because their full hp tank rolls into the middle of a bunch of 1shots and 1shots them. You'd be surprised by how many green/blue games you can have, to be saved by that one 12k game, just because you were patient long enough.

 

Bottom line is that there will be sharp rises in your gameplay, and there will be plateaus. Just always be willing to try new things out, and be willing to learn from the players around you.

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Remember they used to thump, but now they blast right?

 

I think the engagement hierarchy you endorsed is as it's core (ie for any single engagement in particular) still true. The caveat now is that the frequency of the various types of engagements has changed. Camo/vision is still very much the best way to engage an opponent if it is available. The problem is that map and meta changes have made it less available. Instead of being able to force the engagement in your favor that way on almost every map, you are funneled into short range areas where it is no longer an opinion. So now, ideal tank selection is revolved around those that can invisi-tank when presented the opportunity but do not suffer in exposure/armor engagements. Aka bow down to the T-62a/Obj140 overlords.

 

If I get off my ass, I'll present my slight revisions to the hierarchy in a RBS article or something.

 

I was gonna knock my rust off and then update that paradigm, cause I completely agree with you, and I've seen a few more things that now expand the options, within the "brawler" style of play. 

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http://forum.worldoftanks.com/index.php?/topic/190318-breaking-out-of-56-60-solopubbing-surmounting-the-plateau-updated-8-feb-2013/

 

 

Abriged.

 

1. Ability to create opportunities

- Being able to create opportunities instead of simply being very good at using opportunities differentiates purples from blues

 

2. Aggression

- Which is often done through aggressive play

 

3. Strategic Thought

- Which requires strategic throught to be able to know where the positions needed to dictate the game are.

- High blues are usually capable of reacting very well to the flow of the game, but aren't always able to create the game they want

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Still ~0.47% from true purple, but I've improved markedly since coming to wotlabs about a year ago. Putzing around for my first 4000 games I was able to squeak out 55%+ or so without spending a dime on this game (which I didn't understand put me in a solid place to start). So here I am at dark-green coming to wotlabs and here were my big takeaways/moves from the ground up:

 

1) Just figure out crew skills, proper equipment, modules, consummables and ammo loadouts.  I never shot gold, I wasted money on useless retrainings, I didn't prioritize 6th sense. I didn't carry automatic fire extinguishers (or any extinguishers for that matter). 

 

2) Learn how camo/spotting works.  This was more important when it was easier to abuse, (this discussion has taken place many times throughout the forum so I won't go into it any more). This is the beginning of figuring out how to take smart shots. 

 

3) I stopped spamming games and dedicated time just to training (my game count is fairly low, but the amount of time I have spent watching streams/reading guides etc would probably have me at around 10k if all that time had been spent in game). This was taking advantage of replay reviews on this site. I watched my own replays.  I read guides, asked questions (but do your due diligence before you post a new thread), checked out the streams of Sela & Embryonic.  But I actively watched, I thought about why they were playing the way they did given their tanks, the maps etc. ("Wow, that position is not really arty safe -stoopid newbz-, oh wait, there was no arty in this match to begin with..."). Then I brought that into my own replays.

 

4) I enlisted the help of Crab, Millard & Sela at one point or another.  I have an income, I wanted to be better at tanks and so I made the lessons happen and they were great. Crab was more of a general overview. With Millard and Sela I found it helpful to come in with specific questions. 

 

5) Even at the start I had some basic grasp of certain early positions that were valuable, but I did homework on maps I was not completely comfortable on. While early positions are helpful, that's more memorization/knee-jerk positioning than actually critically thinking in a game. This, I believe, is a big hump people have to get over. "Ok, I've won/lost this position...what now?"  Not you are really starting to get into heads up play (something I am still always thinking about). We all know we don't want to be part of the lemming train where Pubbie-Groupthink-Logic dictates a plodding advance until we've hit resistance and then we smash our heads together until one team can't get up any more. While sometimes you have to play that way, the Crab hierarchy says this is the least preferable type of play.

 

Here I am starting to ramble so I'll quit while I am ahead. But steps #1-4 were the big game changers for me that have allowed me to dwell on this mysterious 5th point I am having difficulty articulating. 

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