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Johnny_Wishbone

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1 hour ago, Sgt. Pepper said:

Unfortunately, the tank doesn't get 42% freaking camo on the move/stationary though.

Wotinfo still reports 42.23% with paint and 100% camo crew...YMMV  

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On 4/18/2016 at 3:39 PM, 8_Hussars said:

http://wotlabs.net/articles/draft-elc-review-guide-magical-mystery-tank/

"The equipment, likewise, is a clear-cut choice, Binocs, Gunlayer, and Rammer"

I like my Optics, Egld and Binos.

Rammer is a bad choice IMHO. The reload gets just too short. Without rammer, with BIA I go dark between shots...since the outrageous camo basically means only way to get spotted is by firing. Throw arty into equation and I generally fire once in 15 seconds (shoot, than run away to go dark, than relocate...keep in mind that if you pop out just a second after you go dark, tanks are probably preaimed on your last known location...or arty). You do not even have a turret, so cant circle to death...it would take too long due to dpm anyway. I had occasions where enemy arty would target me even if I am next to the his teammate, killing us both (even tier 8 tanks, lol!)

EGLD is a must, it takes about 4-6 seconds to aim fully when stopping to fire even from moderate speed.

Binos+ optics because this can spot both active and passive, depending on map/tier. Vents are pretty useless, bloom issues are too big to be any better off with or without vents. view range is also not that good - 40-410 m with optics are not enough for Lakeville, Prokhorovka, Malinovka, and a few maps where having binos means a won game and 4-5 k spotting dmg. Without optics it is harder to farm lover tiers (5-7) since you can move all the time and still shoot what you spot from safe distance...without optics they may spot you when firing since you will be that 30-40 m closer.

P.S. 44.83 % with BIA and food.

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currently my ELC has rammer, vents and binocs as shown in @TheMarine0341 video..

since it's greatest strenght is camo sniping, i'm thinking about swapping the rammer for GLD, the limited turret traverse means that if a tank is not TOG slow sometimes you'll have to turn your hull in order to shoot him, and the terribad aim time surely isn't helping..

vents + bia should keep the reload time low enough and vents + bia + gld should allow me to turn and shoot the target before he goes dark (moving the hull deactivates binocs)

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1 minute ago, no_name_cro said:

I ran GLD, Rammer, Binos on mine. Worked well since I 3 marked it.

i would use vents to cope with the gun handling..

i'll run a couple of tests then..

what's the average damage/spotting for 3 marks?

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1 minute ago, WhatTheSkara said:

i would use vents to cope with the gun handling..

i'll run a couple of tests then..

what's the average damage/spotting for 3 marks?

I've been shifting also, but I found GLD helps when you kemp bush to fire precise shot faster, especially after moving. About 3 marks - it's fairly easy but I'm not sure how much you need for 3 marks.

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Just now, no_name_cro said:

I've been shifting also, but I found GLD helps when you kemp bush to fire precise shot faster, especially after moving. About 3 marks - it's fairly easy but I'm not sure how much you need for 3 marks.

"fairly easy"

took me 40ish games to go from 85% to 95% on my T29 :serb: remember i am a scrub

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1 minute ago, WhatTheSkara said:

"fairly easy"

took me 40ish games to go from 85% to 95% on my T29 :serb: remember i am a scrub

When things go bad on ELC, load a shitload of APCR. :doge: 

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7 minutes ago, no_name_cro said:

When things go bad on ELC, load a shitload of APCR. :doge: 

once a guy here said "if APCR is your premium round, AP has no place in your tank" :awyeah:

EDIT: added link to signature

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Except O-Is or T150 AP is autopen when in tier 6 battles, and even in tier 7-8 I rarely load gold from start, there are always some soft idiot to farm. Towards the middle of battle opponents are generally harder to penn (heavies are more durable), so i go full gold, and then revert back to AP/HE for the cleanup of paper bush kemping tds/arty. HE is good to one shot tier 6 arty like Hummel...but be careful against some soviet arty, just hard enough not to pen it.

I also 3-marked it with my setup, now at 98%. You need about 900-1000 dmg+400-500 spots. Replay is nice, I 3 marked it on Prokhorovka, firing in tier 7 heavies from E 1 double bush. Only thing is, I carry 14 apcr, 9 is too little. 5 HE is useless, gun is too derpy and reload too long to risk it...2-3 tops, and that when you are last alive against one-two opponents like hellcats. He have not used a single HE in that 3 mark game, while 2-3 APCR more would have been handy.

Optics are worse than binos...but why not both?

I will quote Jesse_the_Scout a bit from his T67 tread. since both are esentially a mid tier camo  abusers...

Posted 26 Oct 2015 ·

After looking at numbers for a while and testing some tanks I came to think I had overrated GLD on some tanks, this being one of them. The handling and aim time are already so good GLD is kind of trivial. I dumped GLD for optics, so I'm running optics, binocs, rammer. I think the advantages of having maximum view range on the move and stationary is probably the optimal route compared to the negligible advantages of GLD or camo net. Max view while stationary allows you to defend optimally, while optics means when you're forced to advance or relocate you're more likely to see enemies and keep tabs on potential threats. I've actually gone through and double opticified a number of TDs which have good gun handling numbers since GLD just doesn't impact them much and TDs rely so heavily on vision games.

 

Now, ELC has some massive gun handling problems + limited turret, gun is derpy 0.38 fully aimed...To aim fully from full speed and no traverse it takes at least 7-8 seconds, maybe more...(someone more math literate look at the actual numbers), and even reseting the track just slightly and it is 3-4 seconds, so EGLD>rammer.

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I found the ELC to be great fun , and used gun rammer , binocs and camo net

if I would change anything , maybe fitting EGLD instead of camo net ( but at the time my crew camo training wasn't too high )

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3 hours ago, 73north said:

I would change anything , maybe fitting EGLD instead of camo net ( but at the time my crew camo training wasn't too high )

Camo net is useless. rammer is fine, but I like Optics to be an active scout - on most maps Binos are not so good as optics - Malinovka/prokh/Murovanka being one of few exeptions. Overall, I think that both Binos and Optics are more important than rammer, but if you need to take only one vision device, binos are better.

Check the numbers on tanks.gg a bit.

You need between 4-7 secouds to aim in most cases (running at half/full speed, park in a bush/250 m+in the open from enemies, than fire)

Only tanks where EGLD is more important are KV-2 and Arty. Even t49 need it less than ELC because it has full turret, so can make drive by shooting from point blank, and can mound vstab (but running Vstab+EGLD is considered the best, the 3rd choice is between vents, optics or rammer)

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I've decided that I hate this tank. It's really good but the gun handling is so awful that I die inside while playing it. I finished up the third MOE on it and nearly rage sold it but I don't need the crew for anything so it will remain in my garage and collect dust.

The extreme camo and mobility at a tier with generally poor view range means you can pull off some ridiculous carries. The vision games with this tank is the most fun part of playing it. Everything else is maddening.

I ran multiple different equipment combinations. The ELC has three major weaknesses - bad view range, truly awful gun handling, and low DPM. Thus gun rammer, GLD, Optics, Vents, and Binocs are particularly useful. I finished with GLD, Optics, and Vents. Since you spend a ton of time aiming in this tank the GLD seems like the closest to mandatory. I prefer to run Optics over Binocs because you are pretty blind on the move without Optics. I skipped a rammer because I so often was spending time moving and aiming that the extra reload speed wasn't useful all that often. I picked up vents to help with the view range (goes well with food and Optics) in addition to gun handling/accuracy bonuses. The other combination I liked was swapping out Binocs for the Vents because there are definitely times where that extra vision helps rack up the assisted damage.

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Try it in a platoon. Double (or triple) ELC's running around wreaking havoc is pretty darn fun. Might not be consistent enough to get wins, but it really gets the adrenaline pumping.

 

What kind of playstyle did you use to 3-mark? Seems like you played it like a pseudo scout/TD, based off your setup. I'm at 2 marks myself and might try to 3-mark it one day as it's my most-played tank.

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4 hours ago, FavreFan4ever said:

What kind of playstyle did you use to 3-mark? Seems like you played it like a pseudo scout/TD, based off your setup. I'm at 2 marks myself and might try to 3-mark it one day as it's my most-played tank.

In general, my highest priority is to light enemies that my team can then kill. If I can't do that then I try to camo snipe. If I can't do that then I actively engage enemies who are on relaod/distracted. The ELC isn't great at that though because the gun handling is so bad. So if I can't actually sit long enough to hit enemies and I can't do the other things and I need to be doing something, then I just GO FAST and try to be as much of a distraction as possible. Basically I try to get bad guys dead with as little risk to myself as possible. They can't kill what they can't see.

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@Joyrider216 you gonna post the replays for the people? They wanna see us GO FAST. (85% wins over 25 games,  1k dpg each). I spent some time today grinding my ELC crew credits and marks with Joyrider. I was trying to teach him some of the finer points of LT play,  so that he'll stop playing his LTs like RU meds. He's a smart cookie though and began to get the hang of such elite tactics as kemp boosh and GO FAST when he wasn't to busy boosting to various TD spots.

Background : I had about 100 games in the ELC from my shitter days (green). I didn't really know the game that well then,  but going fast with 1-2 pals was fun.  63% wins to,  even on 2 shots per game. No info on assistance, we didn't have that shit back then!  I've kept the dusty ELC for literally years now,  and even remarked last week to imoody that I'm pretty terrible in it. 

But since Joy said he was going to mark it, and me being a tryhard pedant, I put my mind to it today. With a shitty crew - 6th and partial camouflage - and a good knowledge of the spotting system,  I found binos, optics and GLD to be solid. I think that if you're a super ELC tryhard and have a good crew that can get around 440 view range without binos, then I can see dropping that for vents or a rammer. That means bia, situational awareness, vents and food for 441 view range. It'll eat all your profits, its probably worth trying just to see. At that level of crew skill it might even be worth dropping GLD for a rammer, as some more dpm definitely would help you stop pushes, which the ELC can do nicely (from a distance).

Anyways,  back to experiences rather than theorycraft. You can abuse camo like it's 2013. Patches of grass that don't cover the roadwheels of a T37 can be used as cover. In BT6-7 anything that isn't a LT is fair game for shooting as long as its 300m away.  I'm not saying anything new here, I'm just reveling in a game I remember playing and which I might have even been good at! So abuse the camo and enjoy the fact that in BT6-8  vision actually matters. Ask anyone playing the UDES how fun vision games are in BT9-10.

Here are my ELC do's and don'ts

DON'T:

Skirmish other LTs for early positions like Mines or Karelia hills. No dpm, no turret,  no gun handling and no hp. Nyet nyet nyet.

Actively zoom around with no guns behind you. Places that can't be shot don't need to be lit at a risk to your meager hp.

Select shots that in any way allow for return fire.  No trades, you have nothing to trade and need all of your hp to close out games or cover mistakes. 122s can high roll you,  you can't eat 2 from a 90 and 75s fire so fast youse gon die before you reload. And no rams.

DO:

Ambush early LT positions with your big gun. Get there early, get aimed, hit your shot and then leave.

Actively scout high yield areas early, or to break mid-game stalemates. The ability to dodge is real and a viable tool,  unlike with virtually every other LT.

Shoot from camo, shoot the distracted and finish off low hp targets. Boost,  creep,  hit, flee and repeat. When it's time to GO FAST ebrake turns, auto aim and closing distance are your milieu.

@dualmaster333 don't sell it,  play4fun bro

 

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http://www.vbaddict.net/quick/joyrider216-na-f11919024fd438d8d715c4435c1ebaad/silver/15h 

Stats proof to validate the claims. 

As Crab mentioned, I am a MT player through and through. After getting used to that sort of playstyle, breaking out into this style of go fast and camp bush equally well is fairly alien. But I think I am learning slowly :) 

Here are some replays that showcase what the ELC can do and my derpy play :doge: 

http://wotreplays.com/site/3269870#el_halluf-joyrider216-amx_elc_bis

A good look at the camo values and the abuse of the poor low tier tanks for damage farm.

http://wotreplays.com/site/3269872#sand_river-joyrider216-amx_elc_bis

More vision abuse.

http://wotreplays.com/site/3269873#fjords-joyrider216-amx_elc_bis

A simple boost to go aggro and it was safe because no artillery.

http://wotreplays.com/site/3269876#mines-joyrider216-amx_elc_bis

A little bit of a harder boost but some good pewpew play.

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I had heard they were dropping the 90 for a 75mm with 110 pen (albeit with a full 360 turret) and was about to go on a rampage, but then read they're now keeping the 90, but with adjusted pen.  Dropping it a tier (effectively) I assumed their would be a pen nerf, but 50 off the ap and ~80 off the apcr is a heck of a lot for a one tier difference.  Even with the alpha, VR, and camo being better (tier-relative), I still have to call this a significant nerf.  Thoughts?

P.S.  I love running two-man ELC platoons so feel free to msg me if you get the urge.

twcwg7l.jpg?w=768

 

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23 hours ago, ProfessorMunroe said:

I had heard they were dropping the 90 for a 75mm with 110 pen (albeit with a full 360 turret) and was about to go on a rampage, but then read they're now keeping the 90, but with adjusted pen.  Dropping it a tier (effectively) I assumed their would be a pen nerf, but 50 off the ap and ~80 off the apcr is a heck of a lot for a one tier difference.  Even with the alpha, VR, and camo being better (tier-relative), I still have to call this a significant nerf.  Thoughts?

P.S.  I love running two-man ELC platoons so feel free to msg me if you get the urge.

twcwg7l.jpg?w=768

 

It is not a mere pen nerf. It is a disaster.

The very low dpm (more nerf here, 2 sec more reload) and limited turret makes this tank WORSE against same tier tanks, than for example tier 8s. you can be very useful with just a few shots of APCR in a tier 7/8 heavy right now...

For fighting soft targets, both guns are gonna be shit. Every single tier 5 medium has better firepower, right now this is the meanest gun before tier 7.

 

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I think it will be fine.

Played well, it's a pretty OP tank.

The nerf just means you'll have to fire some gold. As is now, it's standard rounds can pen anything it faces (170 I think?)

It might be fun to switch guns on occasion for the different gameplay.

 

I've got a great crew in it now. Not a fan of any other French tank. So a bad nerf would really kill that investment for me.

 

Hope it stays as predicted..

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