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Panther Premium

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The only thing this persistence in you having a boss crew for a Leo has done for me is ruin my W/R and make me lose faith in humanity. Thanks.

Die in a fire.

The last thing you need is MORE prem tanks to subject me to "Your Grind".

We never grind together though on account of your west coast evening work hours and me being banned every 2 days. : \/
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This is just sad. With incoming XP buff on low tier premiums, why play this over T-25? For pref8 platoon a 50t or heck, a Tiger will work better than this. And Tiger doesn't cost you gold, looks badass and is historically significant.

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It got buffed:

on supertest, the Panther 88mm (original stats) was changed as such:

- terrain passability buffed from 0,767/0,959/1,822 to 0,575/0,767/1,438
- hull traverse buffed from 36 to 38 deg/s
- DPM increased from 2115 to 2176,4
- reload time buffed from 6,808 to 6,616
- ROF buffed from 8,813 to 9,068
- depression buffed from -2 to -5
- turret traverse buffed from 29,2 to 33,4

This looks way better, but now im startig to doubt if this will get special mm...

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It got buffed:

on supertest, the Panther 88mm (original stats) was changed as such:

- terrain passability buffed from 0,767/0,959/1,822 to 0,575/0,767/1,438

- hull traverse buffed from 36 to 38 deg/s

- DPM increased from 2115 to 2176,4

- reload time buffed from 6,808 to 6,616

- ROF buffed from 8,813 to 9,068

- depression buffed from -2 to -5

- turret traverse buffed from 29,2 to 33,4

This looks way better, but now im startig to doubt if this will get special mm...

 

FCM 50T has special MM and overall a better tank than this. 

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Monies. 

 

Premiums with pref mm will sell, one that does not have it, less so. 

 

If money were the motivating factor then they'd sell the Type 59. There's always a chance Wargaming will do something stupid because :reasons:. Don't count on preferential matchmaking because of another vehicle until you see it happen.

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Monies. 

 

Premiums with pref mm will sell, one that does not have it, less so. 

Why do you think it won't have preferred MM? Most of the premium tanks recently have not had preferred MM in super test, but have it when they are released.

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If money were the motivating factor then they'd sell the Type 59. There's always a chance Wargaming will do something stupid because :reasons:. Don't count on preferential matchmaking because of another vehicle until you see it happen.

Does wargaming ever sell Types on days like Christmas? Just wondering.

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After seeing the latest changes to the stats I went ahead and did a head on comparison of FCM vs Panther premium.  Details follow:

B8Jja2.png

Verdict:
-Superficially similar tanks that will fulfill same role, chances are if you enjoy one you'll like the other. I've made a major basic assumption that the panther will have preferred MMing like the FCM because they are so similar.

 

-Offense:

Better depression and slightly better aim time make the FCM more flexible at hill skirmishing.
Better DPM, accuracy, reload, make the panther a better sniper/win a dpm war in a 1 on 1. Will suffer on hills
Edge: Slightly to FCM, I can't help but feel the the depression advantage is worth more then the accuracy/dpm advantage.

-Speed/Scoutability:
FCM has better top speed and view range, though crap camo.  FCM can spot enemies from afar but better not be in the open itself.
-Thanks to the magic of ground resistance, panther will actually get to it's top speed slightly faster on medium ground, won't be as slow as feared and be reasonably nimble.
-Panther won't spot enemy's as well, has slightly higher stationary  stationary and moving camo. Slightly better than crap camo is still crap camo though

Edge: No one, both are large(ish) yet nimble tanks with decent view ranges.
 

-Survivability:
-FCM is larger, easier to hit, but has better hull armor and  angles that leads to some random bounces.

-Panther is smaller, harder to hit, but hull will be basically autopenned by everything it sees and turret fairs no better.
-Same health

-Panther has slightly better Camo
Edge: Again a slight edge to the FCM, it's better depression allowing it to hill skirmish more effectively and expose itself less.

Overall story:  They will play 90% similarly, but FCM slightly beats out panther for most situtations.

Will the panther be worth it?
Do you want a premium with a reliable gun that relies on gold less so you can earn more credits?
Do you like the FCM,and want another similar tank?
Do you want a decent German medium crew trainer?

If the answer to any of the above is "yes", I figure it will be a satisfactory purchase.

 

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So wait, its going to have -5 depression?

5 degrees on front, same 7 degrees on side.

still pretty sub-par for a DPM tank with shit for turret armor.

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It looks pretty serviceable but a lot still hinges on the yet to be listed gun handling stats. That accuracy will go a long way for a tank that needs to snipe a lot. Definitely won't be amazing though, such crazy fragility means many enemies will trash you if they get close... no armor, giant ammo racks, huge treads, front transmission.

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It looks pretty serviceable but a lot still hinges on the yet to be listed gun handling stats. That accuracy will go a long way for a tank that needs to snipe a lot. Definitely won't be amazing though, such crazy fragility means many enemies will trash you if they get close... no armor, giant ammo racks, huge treads, front transmission.

 

Front transmission likely won't be such an issue...

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Front transmission likely won't be such an issue...

 

It may not burn anyone but a crippled transmission/engine on a medium tanks is a real pain. 

 

The sides are prone to ammo rack when shot.

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Any hints on when this might be released?  Are we looking at next year?

 

i would guess this year, supertest is usually 1-2 patches before actuall update (and Storm just said that: - it’s possible that 0.9.5 will come this year (specifically December 14 was mentioned by Storm) so i would guess 9.5 is for now the best guess)

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After seeing the latest changes to the stats I went ahead and did a head on comparison of FCM vs Panther premium.  Details follow:

B8Jja2.png

Verdict:

-Superficially similar tanks that will fulfill same role, chances are if you enjoy one you'll like the other. I've made a major basic assumption that the panther will have preferred MMing like the FCM because they are so similar.

 

-Offense:

Better depression and slightly better aim time make the FCM more flexible at hill skirmishing.

Better DPM, accuracy, reload, make the panther a better sniper/win a dpm war in a 1 on 1. Will suffer on hills

Edge: Slightly to FCM, I can't help but feel the the depression advantage is worth more then the accuracy/dpm advantage.

-Speed/Scoutability:

FCM has better top speed and view range, though crap camo.  FCM can spot enemies from afar but better not be in the open itself.

-Thanks to the magic of ground resistance, panther will actually get to it's top speed slightly faster on medium ground, won't be as slow as feared and be reasonably nimble.

-Panther won't spot enemy's as well, has slightly higher stationary  stationary and moving camo. Slightly better than crap camo is still crap camo though

Edge: No one, both are large(ish) yet nimble tanks with decent view ranges.

 

-Survivability:

-FCM is larger, easier to hit, but has better hull armor and  angles that leads to some random bounces.

-Panther is smaller, harder to hit, but hull will be basically autopenned by everything it sees and turret fairs no better.

-Same health

-Panther has slightly better Camo

Edge: Again a slight edge to the FCM, it's better depression allowing it to hill skirmish more effectively and expose itself less.

Overall story:  They will play 90% similarly, but FCM slightly beats out panther for most situtations.

Will the panther be worth it?

Do you want a premium with a reliable gun that relies on gold less so you can earn more credits?

Do you like the FCM,and want another similar tank?

Do you want a decent German medium crew trainer?

If the answer to any of the above is "yes", I figure it will be a satisfactory purchase.

 

"Taking into consideration hp/t and terrain resistance FCM effectively has:

17.64 hp/t on hard terrain

16.02 hp/t on medium

8.01 hp/t on soft

Compared to Panther 88 that has:

22.43 hp/t on hard

16.81 hp/t on medium

8.97 hp/t on soft"

 

Quoted from Classicfrog(EU) from FTR

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"Taking into consideration hp/t and terrain resistance FCM effectively has:

17.64 hp/t on hard terrain

16.02 hp/t on medium

8.01 hp/t on soft

Compared to Panther 88 that has:

22.43 hp/t on hard

16.81 hp/t on medium

8.97 hp/t on soft"

 

Quoted from Classicfrog(EU) from FTR

 

Looks like we found different reported ground resistance values for the FCM, his effective hp/ton is *slightly* higher,  not enough to change my thoughts any though.

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I like the changes and can see it competing with the FCM. However, again, everything depends on the dispersion stats - if it's better than the FCM (which is likely, given the FCM's dispersion is bad), the Panther 88 will be a better tank, no questions asked. When you combine great .31 acc with 2.4 aimtime and good dispersion, you've got a smooth as butter premium - especially given the thing is quite mobile. After all, people love the FCM because the gun isn't derpy, and this Panther may very well make the FCM's gun look quite unhealthy. This is what I want, and it's not out of the question; it's not like a slightly better FCM can actually compete with the likes of the IS-6 & kin, so it's no balance issue.

 

A slightly less likely (but not surprising) result would be the Panther 88 getting about the same dispersion as the FCM, in which case the FCM does get a slight advantage, although both tanks will be good enough to get a recommendation.

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I think a lot of people don't consider the size of the tank...

Panther is pretty big compared to a russian medium. I'm wondering how the Depression might work with sniping because the turret isnt all the way forward unlike the 50T..

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The -5% front, -7% side gun depression isn't great, but it's still workable, given how smoothly this thing will move. That said, kind of wish it were, y'know, cheaper gold-wise. x_x

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