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Solono

Crack down on arty related rule violations.

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We'll be reasonable on that matter. You be too, and all'll be fine.

 

As Solono says, for now refrain using them as an alternative to sperging in threads, but once the novelty wears off... Just don't systematically do it.

 

I appreciate the responses from both you and Solono. I have to admit I almost never check status updates, unless I post a status, so I don't know about an issue in status updates. I'll have to check out the venting room, I dont think I've ever been in it. 

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Status updates seems to far to me. I have never once spreged about arty, and I understand its here to stay, but in most cases status updates are the venting room. I`d say 50% of all updates I see are "Dumb ass pubs" "I did XYZ DMG and still couldnt carry these tards" etc.

 

Also, I understand it makes us look "Unprofessional" but saying as a reason Minsk doesnt give a shit about what we think is a useless argument as well. Just because they wont listen to us doesnt mean we shouldn`t keep telling the truth. If there is a broken game mechanic, we should be the ones pounding it away until it goes away.

 

IMO WOTLABS is supposed to be the force of educated light in the dark uneducated pubbie masses. Im not saying I agree with all the arty sperg, but we should never have a reason for anything be "Because WG doesnt listen anyways" or "We wont changed anything anyways"

 

If all we ever talked about was stuff WG was willing to change or willing to listen about, the forums would be dead.

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I responded to a PM with this, but I thought I'd post it here also:

 

"And honestly it's not about hating arty.  I hate arty (as a game mechanic) as much as the next guy who gets clicked constantly because of his clan tags (let's face it, I'm not really good enough to get clicked based on stats).  It's about the way we conduct ourselves as people and as a subset of society.  It makes me proud when our community can welcome someone with open arms who needed as much help learning to play as KenFlorian.  It brings a tear to my eye the way our community as a whole not only was very respectful of Bun (and all the others who came out on our forum), but also rallied behind her and showed their admiration.  And there's countless other examples of exemplary human interaction here.  But you toss the word "arty" out there and suddenly half the population turns into frothing rabid dogs."

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Long overdue, thank you Solono.

 

Dlur put the case for WoTLabs perfectly in that PM. It's a community devoted to getting better at WoT and hopefully being a little better at life in general. Hate achieves nothing, except maybe indigestion.

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Status updates seems to far to me. I have never once spreged about arty, and I understand its here to stay, but in most cases status updates are the venting room. I`d say 50% of all updates I see are "Dumb ass pubs" "I did XYZ DMG and still couldnt carry these tards" etc.

 

Also, I understand it makes us look "Unprofessional" but saying as a reason Minsk doesnt give a shit about what we think is a useless argument as well. Just because they wont listen to us doesnt mean we shouldn`t keep telling the truth. If there is a broken game mechanic, we should be the ones pounding it away until it goes away.

 

IMO WOTLABS is supposed to be the force of educated light in the dark uneducated pubbie masses. Im not saying I agree with all the arty sperg, but we should never have a reason for anything be "Because WG doesnt listen anyways" or "We wont changed anything anyways"

 

If all we ever talked about was stuff WG was willing to change or willing to listen about, the forums would be dead.

 

 

You seem to misunderstand, I am not saying you cannot discuss why or how arty sucks, I am saying things like "FUCK YOU FOR PLAYING ARTY" are unacceptable to a meaningful community bent on trying to educate others about the game. As I said in the very beginning, you can continue to voice your disdain for arty as long as you keep it constructive, swearing at the heavens for vengeance or others in all caps is not one of them.

 

As far the Minsk comment, here is the full context:

 

Arty isn't going anywhere any time soon if ever, raging about it here does nothing but make us look like fools, Minsk doesn't give a damn if you hate it.

 

Raging about arty doesn't matter, which is true. I'm not telling you to not try to change things, I'm telling you that pure, emotional bile and sperging is useless because Minsk doesn't care if you spew bile, spew numbers, that is all Minsk understands, painfully so.

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You seem to misunderstand, I am not saying you cannot discuss why or how arty sucks, I am saying things like "FUCK YOU FOR PLAYING ARTY" are unacceptable to a meaningful community bent on trying to educate others about the game. As I said in the very beginning, you can continue to voice your disdain for arty as long as you keep it constructive, swearing at the heavens for vengeance or others in all caps is not one of them.

 

As far the Minsk comment, here is the full context:

 

Arty isn't going anywhere any time soon if ever, raging about it here does nothing but make us look like fools, Minsk doesn't give a damn if you hate it.

 

Raging about arty doesn't matter, which is true. I'm not telling you to not try to change things, I'm telling you that pure, emotional bile and sperging is useless because Minsk doesn't care if you spew bile, spew numbers, that is all Minsk understands, painfully so.

TL;DR: the "Fuck arty" posts and it's related memes is on vacation from wotlabs.

 

It's getting too predictable and it's borderline spammed posts to me. It's bad enough that this crap is rampant on the official forums, but why bring it here, where it's obvious that most of us hate arty?

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I disagreed when this was proposed, and it's really a slippery slope that I fear may be used to justify moderating people based on personal dislike. 

 

For example, would referring to arty as cancer now draw moderation if there's legitimate content? 

 

Or is it merely the lack of content that'll trigger it, in which case would a post like "The Is-7 is a fantastic hull down tank, except the gun mantlet will steal eat shit from HE." Unrelated note, fuck cancer etc etc."

 

 

I can understand you not wanting to be tied down to some silly wooden examples that some jackass will worm around and feel all clever, but as it stands now, what you've declared war on is useless posts, but only on the narrow pretext of arty being mentioned. 

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I disagreed when this was proposed, and it's really a slippery slope that I fear may be used to justify moderating people based on personal dislike. 

 

For example, would referring to arty as cancer now draw moderation if there's legitimate content? 

 

Or is it merely the lack of content that'll trigger it, in which case would a post like "The Is-7 is a fantastic hull down tank, except the gun mantlet will steal eat shit from HE." Unrelated note, fuck cancer etc etc."

 

 

Example 1: No, it would not. But if ALL you say is "arty is cancer", then there is a problem.

 

Example 2 is a yes, as it adds nothing to what is being said, in that instance I would remove the arty content of that post, and warn the user not to try that kind of weaseling again.

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Example 1: No, it would not. But if ALL you say is "arty is cancer", then there is a problem.

 

Example 2 is a yes, as it adds nothing to what is being said, in that instance I would remove the arty content of that post, and warn the user not to try that kind of weaseling again.

The problem I see there is that 183s and tomatos aside, where else would you catch HE in the face as an IS-7? (or maybe I might have caused confusion by not placing the statement in the context of an IS-7 or Hull down discussion scenario.)

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Folterknecht and Paaranoja send their regards.

 

 

I hate arty. I hate bitching and whining even more.

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Thanks Solono and crew. The hatred has given us a bad name.

 

So let's break this down.

 

Arty is part of the game: fact.

 

Arty will probably remain in the game, perhaps forever: opinion but supported by evidence.

 

Arty is cancer: opinion supported by many other opinions, but still just an opinion.

 

See the difference?

 

Let's figure out how to deal with it since it exists. Let's talk about how to improve it as a mechanic just in case anyone in Minsk is actually listening.

 

EVERYTHING else is questionable and as "reasonable adults" we should not be engaging in other activities related to the factual mechanic of the game.

 

tl;dr: I want to know how to beat artillery since it exists. Everything else, and everyone who supplies anything except ways to counter artillery, can go fuck themselves.

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There are plenty of legitimate, logical and factual reasons to dislike arty, so there isn't really a need to devolve into emotional mudslinging when talking about it. 

Really, the more you dislike arty, the less emotional you should try to be, since it just makes your position look weaker when you replace logical, calm dialog with emotional vitriol

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Let's figure out how to deal with it since it exists.

 

I would state that the fact that there is no reasonable tactic that can be employed that does not compromise one's ability to win the game as one of the main reasons there is so much sperg. TBH I approve of the intent of this decision even if I don't agree with its implementation.

 

I think the most likely effect of this mandate for me personally is I will just skip arty related content altogether. 

 

Clarification Edit: When I say no reasonable tactic I am referring to when being focused.

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The problem I see there is that 183s and tomatos aside, where else would you catch HE in the face as an IS-7?

 

In the context of it, the arty comment as it stands is unnecessary and detrimental to the discussion.

 

""The Is-7 is a fantastic hull down tank, except the gun mantlet will steal eat shit from HE." perfectly explains the position as is, nothing else is needed.

 

"Unrelated note, fuck cancer etc etc." is just sperging, and unnecessary to the discussion. It is not the mention of arty that is a violation, it is just the pointless, bile-laced complaining about it, that which adds nothing to the topic.

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Probably a needed rule, vilifying arty players has become the latest fad around here to the point where it is detrimental to the forum.

 

A lot of the arty haters used to play them at some point but when they found out they were unpopular they just jumped on the "fuck arty" bandwagon.

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WHAT IF..............and this is a big IF............

 

I said "fuck arty" BUT!!!!!!!!!!! I put like a winky face on the end like this ;)

 

 

Nah just kidding solono.  It makes sense what you are doing.  Trying to maintain Wotlabs' claim of intelligent discussion is very necessary.  It's what keeps us above the dreaded.....OFFICIAL FORUMS!!!!!! (insert screaming girl here)

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I hate arty. I hate bitching and whining even more.

 

 

I made this thread more or less to see how many people would circle jerk and upvote brigade. To my complete and utter surprise, only a handful of people posted actual content.

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to be honest, while I hate arty with a passion. I have to agree with this post.

 

I have been thinking about it for a while now. there are some people that attempt to make posts about artillery, they get neg bombed and flamed to death. 

 

I think threads dedicated to discussing them properly would be good. everyone hates arty, but are there threads up giving detailed information on how best to avoid them? no. Are there guides on where arty safe positions are on maps? nope. infact the closest we have had to proper discussion is Pityfools thread. 

 

 

having threads up detailing artillery pros and cons could actually help with avoiding them.

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to be honest, while I hate arty with a passion. I have to agree with this post.

 

I have been thinking about it for a while now. there are some people that attempt to make posts about artillery, they get neg bombed and flamed to death. 

 

I think threads dedicated to discussing them properly would be good. everyone hates arty, but are there threads up giving detailed information on how best to avoid them? no. Are there guides on where arty safe positions are on maps? nope. infact the closest we have had to proper discussion is Pityfools thread. 

 

 

having threads up detailing artillery pros and cons could actually help with avoiding them.

 

Artillery in its entirety should be confined to the Media section (youtube videos) and RBS articles imo. Moderate anything artillery related in any other section of the forums.

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