What Happens if you give the JPE-100 0.3 accuracy and buff the superstructure to 300mm?

[Yakumo_san 39]

Balanced? Clearly a fun tank if these ever happened, as little likely as they are...

It'd give more CW presence to something which is currently seen as a joke by most?

[PityFool 7,737]

The second biggest gun in the game cannot have the best accuracy, that's just not good balance. 300mm superstructure, is that effective or nominal? 

Personally I think the JPE is never going to be a great tank, its not meant to be... What its meant to be is a boomstick with a bit of armour for people to have some fun with in pub games, its not really meant to be a super serious pub-crushing, solo-carrying, CW staple tank.

As for a buff to the JPE, if anything it would be in the form of more DPM and gun handling if you ask me.

[Yakumo_san 39]

The second biggest gun in the game cannot have the best accuracy, that's just not good balance. 300mm superstructure, is that effective or nominal? 

Personally I think the JPE is never going to be a great tank, its not meant to be... What its meant to be is a boomstick with a bit of armour for people to have some fun with in pub games, its not really meant to be a super serious pub-crushing, solo-carrying, CW staple tank.

As for a buff to the JPE, if anything it would be in the form of more DPM and gun handling if you ask me.

The 0.3 accuracy is an old, perhaps outdated argument, but I've always felt that the inconsistency when you evolve from a cute Jagdtiger into a JPE-100... you feel alienated because the JPE half of the time doesn't play like a JT. The gun accuracy buff would at least make people think considering using it for semi-reliable fire support; as to why I consider that semi-reliable is that even at 0.3 accuracy and with better shell velocity, Tier X Mediums tend to miss often. Truly, 0.3 shouldn't be that bad of a game-breaking buff I think.

Concerning the armor, it'd be 300mm effective. It'd turn the superstructure into a not!goldPen cheese area, and if you actually wanted to pen the hulldown JPE you'd need to hit the cupola, which has always been around with 170mm ish of effective armor...

[Deusmortis 4,618]

I always thought the JPE should be a linear advance over the JT.  Fast firing, high accuracy, moderate alpha.  Basically the 263's gun on some kind of German hull.

[rojo180 800]

The reason why this is tank is viewed as being mediocre isn't because of the gun. Its the fact that it moves like a turtle, and its the size of an office building for arty. 

[no_name_cro 2,034]

I always thought the JPE should be a linear advance over the JT.  Fast firing, high accuracy, moderate alpha.  Basically the 263's gun on some kind of German hull.

Tortoise -> FV183 much?  

[waga100 353]

the corridor maps are a massive buff for the JPE as is. I don't think it should get a buff even if it does underperform though. It has a combination of pretty decent bloom and massive alpha which i think really shouldn't go together because we all know how annoying half your hp from a second of exposure is.

Frankly though its a fun tank where you don't really have to think. You waddle up to a choke point or heavy tank brawling area and you hit stuff in the face with 1000 alpha and heat if you extra can't be arsed aiming. The alpha means that it picks up some seriously high damage games out of nowhere. Well and lots shit games because it can't handle anything not right infront of it and you have to rely on teammates.

[Haswell 2,399]

What's the point of this "what-if" thread?

[Constie 1,350]

Yis buff the JPE pls. I would play it 24/7

[Patient0 794]

Gun handling on the JPE is fine. I've full traverse snapshotted leo1s trying to circle strafe me (He was stupid and drove in very wide circles). Biggest possible buff would be DPM and removal of cupola. It would then effectively replace the E3 as best rock in WoT

[Yakumo_san 39]

I always thought the JPE should be a linear advance over the JT.  Fast firing, high accuracy, moderate alpha.  Basically the 263's gun on some kind of German hull.

People of the old times have countlessly championed the "STUG" E-100 with a unified and angled frontal UFP/Superstructure, and giving it an increased RoF JT gun. For some reason having a Jagdpanther silhouette too would increase the thing's mobility. I still don't know why WG decided to put the JPE-100 in its actual form rather than go with the more popular shape ( possible more armored ), but I guess I can't really complain since I have 2,400 games in the JPE.

Gun handling on the JPE is fine. I've full traverse snapshotted leo1s trying to circle strafe me (He was stupid and drove in very wide circles). Biggest possible buff would be DPM and removal of cupola. It would then effectively replace the E3 as best rock in WoT

The Superstructure, even angled, has trouble with HEAT. It can bounce most medium HEAT shells on a 50/50 basis, but it's nowhere near the E3's armored profile. The JPE-100 would need more than just the cupola removal if it were to become a good hulldown vehicle; right now; it's an average one at best.

the corridor maps are a massive buff for the JPE as is. I don't think it should get a buff even if it does underperform though. It has a combination of pretty decent bloom and massive alpha which i think really shouldn't go together because we all know how annoying half your hp from a second of exposure is.

Frankly though its a fun tank where you don't really have to think. You waddle up to a choke point or heavy tank brawling area and you hit stuff in the face with 1000 alpha and heat if you extra can't be arsed aiming. The alpha means that it picks up some seriously high damage games out of nowhere. Well and lots shit games because it can't handle anything not right infront of it and you have to rely on teammates.

Agreed with the fun part. That's why it's my most played tank. Also, that thing is generally underperforming because every single pubbie wants one because of gun and armor, either that or the 183. Unless I'm mistaken and other tanks have bigger influx of shitters? (I'd like to think that the E-hundo shitter syndrome has toned down...)

The reason why this is tank is viewed as being mediocre isn't because of the gun. Its the fact that it moves like a turtle, and its the size of an office building for arty. 

The E3 suffers similar problems yet is often viewed in a much more favorable light. Hence why wondered if these changes, if they ever were to happen, would turn the JPE into something that might contest the E3's spot in one form or the other.

[Folterknecht 2,257]

Remove these retarded 420mm pen Noob-shells (completly) and you can have your 0.3 accuracy and 300 mm armor.

[The_direwolf 167]

I'm not a fan of high alpha, but the tank itself pretty so-so. Remove the cupola, buff the superstructure to 300mm and you could say 'fuck you' to pretty much everything. That would allow for better hull down, subsequently less movement and thus no gun buffs required.

 

Although I would prefer a buffed 128mm that's sort of like the gun on the 263, but better because its on a slower superstructure.

[sahtila 95]

JPZ100 has one big problem compared to E3: that weak front lower hull plate is really big target. Whereas E3 lower hull is also weak spot but its much smaller and very trolly, even little too much up or down and easy bounce. IMHO thats alone why E3 is felt as hard brick frontally and jpz100 less so.

Patient0 mentioned cupola, but I dont see that as problem as its small target. Also geometry, that cupola is far behind from pivot middle point of tank so that when jpz100 is rotating tank back and forth cupola moves pretty fast and hitting it is unreliable. Whereas for example E5 cupola is close above turret and also tank hull pivot point so rotating turret or hull moves cupola relatively slowly so cupola is much easier to hit.

When hull down JPZ100 has all armor it needs frontally, angling between shoots gives it very decent overall armor outside that weak frontal plate.

[Zinn 1,333]

I'm with Folter on this one, remove the shitty fucking noob cannons and you can have your JT upgrade. We don't need several forms of artileery in this game.

JPZ100 has one big problem compared to E3: that weak front lower hull plate is really big target. Whereas E3 lower hull is also weak spot but its much smaller and very trolly, even little too much up or down and easy bounce. IMHO thats alone why E3 is felt as hard brick frontally and jpz100 less so.

Patient0 mentioned cupola, but I dont see that as problem as its small target. Also geometry, that cupola is far behind from pivot middle point of tank so that when jpz100 is rotating tank back and forth cupola moves pretty fast and hitting it is unreliable. Whereas for example E5 cupola is close above turret and also tank hull pivot point so rotating turret or hull moves cupola relatively slowly so cupola is much easier to hit.

When hull down JPZ100 has all armor it needs frontally, angling between shoots gives it very decent overall armor outside that weak frontal plate.

The JPE's major weakness isn't really the lower plate, it's the upper hull that it cannot hide. If you can manage some 275-290 penetration, which many tier 9 + 10 tanks can with HEAT, you will go straight through the upper hull from the front. Even if angled almost perfectly, the JPE will not get enough armor to actually bounce more than ~300 pen against someone who knows where to aim. Furthermore, the JPE cannot shoot back while angling so you need to bait shots from the pubbies and it'll be GG against people who know what's up.

Meanwhile, an E3 can easily bounce 300+ pen HEAT and APCR because the front has some 340-400 armor while facing you directly and the 285mm zone on the cuppola is quite small and covers roughly the bottom half of it. The lower plate is still fairly weak vs tier 10s but can troll bounce a lot of 9s unlike the JPE.

[Tankthief 44]

They should buff traverse to 60 and speed to 50km as well with an 3x 1k dmg autoloader.

[Trumpetah 341]

I always thought the JPE should be a linear advance over the JT.  Fast firing, high accuracy, moderate alpha.  Basically the 263's gun on some kind of German hull.

Tortoise -> FV183 much?  

There's also

• Conway -> FV4005
• WTP4 (reliable firepower and DPM on a compact chassis) -> WTE100 (ridiculous clip combined with 55 seconds of "fuck you you're useless" reload on one of the worst platforms in the game)

There are just too many TD lines in the game that have a fun, fast DPM machine for the tier 9 and a super high alpha/clip but generally unreliable slow gimmick tank for the tier 10. There should be more tier 10 TDs that have firepower comparable to the 263's.

[Medjed 2,619]

T10 TDs needs to be removed....game was a much better place before them where you actually had to be skilled to play TDs instead of driving completely ridiculously armored/armed shitlord tanks and slap other tanks in the face for 50%+ of their HP in one shot.

What's the point of this "what-if" thread?

The point is that WoWP still sucks and you need to find a way to get over it, shitter, or i'll fkn cut u

[Dead_Baron 26]

They should buff traverse to 60 and speed to 50km as well with an 3x 1k dmg autoloader.

Oh come on, 5x autoloader at least with a 1.5s reload.

[Flaksmith 934]

I would honestly like to see it have a better version of the jagdtiger's gun and better mobility instead (think of a tier 10 JP2). Now THAT would be a true upgrade over the JT.

Edited August 28, 2015 by Flaksmith

[Buffalo444 112]

A JPE50 or JPE75 would be a much better replacement. Or maybe even both with a split, make the JPE50 a tier 9 to come from the JPanther II, then the JPE75 come from the JT, and a JPE50M come from the JPE50. Give one line mobility with slightly lower DPM, the other armor with slightly higher DPM.

Then turn the JPE into the slow ass german equivalent of and object 261. Even though I love blasting shit in my JPE, its because it hits like arty and can take a hit at the same time. Makes you feel dirty.

 

[Shade421 2,952]

The JPE100 is already on the wrong side of OP. It needs absolutely no buffs. It just requires a different play style than most good players are used to.

[AncientObliterator 65]

The JPE100 is already on the wrong side of OP. It needs absolutely no buffs. It just requires a different play style than most good players are used to.

[Rexxie 10,788]

With .3 acc and 300mm superstructure, the JPE would basically make most heavy tanks obsolete. You could give it just .3 acc though. It wouldn't really make a difference.

I think the JPE would be more interesting with a 15cm or 12.8cm than it is with a 17cm. I think the JPE would be most interesting if it didn't exist, and instead we got a German T10 TD that was enjoyable to play.

[Roku 2,028]

Agree with Rexxie. I'd like to have seen some kind of E-75 based TD, like a JgdPzIV or JP on steroids based on that hull using the JT's gun with the option of using a 15cm.