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Why Do People Hate On The VK 16.02 Leopard

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i loved the tank. my first tier 5 light and if you hit the right places, you can rack up the damage. not bragginf but in a tier 7 game i managed to do 1k damage, and withour gold. it is a close range tank tho. dont bother to snipe

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What are you talking about? The HEAT on the 2801 is very situational, the HE does the work most of the time.

It's probably my personal experience, I felt that my damage output was more consistent with the VK Leopard. 

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I just bought the Leopard recently and I found it to be mediocre compared to the other t5 lights particularly due to its gun. I've no problems with flanking and penetrating sides and arses but thanks to its abysmal reload time and dpm on the 3cm makes it pretty hard to deal with other lights or killing enemies you've managed to circle in a timely manner. It's not like an ELC where it can unload its full potential in a single round and drive off quick but instead have to stop for a few crucial seconds. It's not like the Chaffee where it can do sustained damage over a longer distance thanks to great accuracy and decent DPM. It's basically an uptiered Luchs with not very noticeable improvements. How do I play it?

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11 hours ago, KampfyKouch said:

 How do I play it?

You have to be stealthy and look for opportunities to unload your clip from sides or rear. Retreat and reposition between reloads. Use hard cover. And yes, it pretty much plays like a Tier V Luchs.

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Played it on a different account today.

Its just mediocre wrapped in mediocre sauce.

Gun is underpowered. Gun handling is way worse than it should be, reload is too long, accuracy is bad

Mobility isnt good. traverse is subpar, top speed is subpar, speed loss on turns is noticeable.

camo/view range is subpar.

 

The only thing it has is a 360 damage burst which it very rarely puts to good use as it needs to pen/hit 12 shots.

Luchs with the same matchmaking is better purely because it doesnt move like a medium.

 

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I just bought this tank back and moved my elite SPIC crew into it (because fuck playing high tier scouts anymore) and I'm in love with it all over again.  This tank is just pure fun to play and an amazingly good stet pedder due to nobody playing it.  1k damage will get you around 8k wn8.  :disco:

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This thing is hilarious, its not chafee good, but its extremely fun to play. Also, with binos 510 VR with a good crew means its an awesome pasive spotter, and 440 with optics help it offset the bad camo. The gun its awful at range but catching someone distracted and dropping 200-300 dmg on its ass and running away its hilarious (also you can 180 with the hand brake because its so wide you wont flip unlike the chafee)

 

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I had a great time in the Leopard , I also just used the stock gun , and found I did better than the auto-loader - with its long reload

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2 hours ago, 73north said:

 

 

I had a great time in the Leopard , I also just used the stock gun , and found I did better than the auto-loader - with its long reload

Then you must be shit. 

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I've elited mine but my commander doesn't have sixth yet so I'm not moving up to the 2801 until that happens. It's never going to carry like an elc or chaffee could, but it's always a fun match. Race to the good spots, light up the enemy, then look for opportunities to cut through the flanks and go arty hunting or punish distracted or low HP opponents.

The best is when you can get a whole clip into the engine deck of a tier 8 heavy and set them on fire. 

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Re ought it last night at 50% off because I was at 88% and wanted to three mark it.  Put my ru-251 crew in, played 10 games and got to...89%.

To be honest I wasn't having great games in it, although finding a distracted Cromwell and unloading 300hp into him to finish him off brought back memories.

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On ‎25‎/‎08‎/‎2016 at 8:29 PM, Cunicularius said:

Then you must be shit. 

your arrogance is astounding - thank you -

also for displaying such breathtaking personal and unwarranted abuse please get some personal help from a doctor and keep taking the tablets

http://www.hiddenhurt.co.uk/verbal_abuse.html

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4 hours ago, 73north said:

 

Thanks for the laugh, needed that

4 hours ago, lt_lolcat said:

It's still fun to play but it does struggle to be meaningful when bottom tier.  It's clip should be more like 15 rounds.  

Yeah, some form of dpm buff, whether that be a larger clip or shorter reload, would be nice. 

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On 25-8-2016 at 9:29 PM, Cunicularius said:

Then you must be shit. 

http://tanks.gg/wot/compare#t:leopard.c:leopard;2q00000

You might have 67 penetration and even with gold you wont pen many heavies or even mediums. But your dpm is almost twice as high. And considering that you easily miss half your shots with the 30mm. The DPM is almost 3x as high on the 50mm gun.

Fact still is: if you fight with other scouts. you will lose with the MG gun. You cant clip a chaffee and you have to reload for ~18 seconds IIRC. And when you drive in enemy artillery camp, it is the 50cm gun which will get the job done sooner. And you get to drive 70 meters away from arty and still hit them on the move. Try killing 3 arty from 70 meters at full speed, might kill one with every 3 clips. Perhaps you can do it before the timer reaches 0.

Insulting somebody while not taking this in account.. wel that is just shit

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37 minutes ago, bask185 said:

http://tanks.gg/wot/compare#t:leopard.c:leopard;2q00000

You might have 67 penetration and even with gold you wont pen many heavies or even mediums. But your dpm is almost twice as high. And considering that you easily miss half your shots with the 30mm. The DPM is almost 3x as high on the 50mm gun.

Fact still is: if you fight with other scouts. you will lose with the MG gun. You cant clip a chaffee and you have to reload for ~18 seconds IIRC. And when you drive in enemy artillery camp, it is the 50cm gun which will get the job done sooner. And you get to drive 70 meters away from arty and still hit them on the move. Try killing 3 arty from 70 meters at full speed, might kill one with every 3 clips. Perhaps you can do it before the timer reaches 0.

Insulting somebody while not taking this in account.. wel that is just shit

You ram other scouts. Than you fire.

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On 29-10-2016 at 8:10 PM, Felicius said:

You ram other scouts. Than you fire.

I once rammed an S-51 with my FCM....I can not recommand that. Point: you still need to be able to yolo rush arty if the situation arrouses

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57 minutes ago, bask185 said:

I once rammed an S-51 with my FCM....I can not recommand that. Point: you still need to be able to yolo rush arty if the situation arrouses

Arty is no scout. have never said you ram arty. S-51 has more than 50 tonnes, weight of a heavy tank. It even has some solid armor (at least before HD model). 60 mm all around is enough to eat half of 3 cm shells if angled, along with all 5 cm AP shells. You almost need gold for it with 5 cm, or a hit in gun shield.

If you ram other tanks, you need to learn how much they weight. I would recommend only ramming low and mid tier French arty, if you are empty, along with other lights (but not the VK 28). Also, if you empty a mag, and arty is still alive, you can ram a bit sideways, so you hit it with your tracks. That saves your hitpoints, and still do 50-100 dmg.

Ramming is not always full-speed banzai charge. Depending on your reload, you sometimes can have opponents with just a few hp left. Ramming them for more than necessary is wasteful.

At least ram ELC.

Generally, when you are advised to ram ppl, your tank is useless crap. Even with E-50 ramming is always a last option (due to getting tracked and exposed to fire from other players), or opponent is significantly lighter, and /or dangerous, i.e. B.C.

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2 hours ago, Felicius said:

Arty is no scout. have never said you ram arty. S-51 has more than 50 tonnes, weight of a heavy tank. It even has some solid armor (at least before HD model). 60 mm all around is enough to eat half of 3 cm shells if angled, along with all 5 cm AP shells. You almost need gold for it with 5 cm, or a hit in gun shield.

If you ram other tanks, you need to learn how much they weight. I would recommend only ramming low and mid tier French arty, if you are empty, along with other lights (but not the VK 28). Also, if you empty a mag, and arty is still alive, you can ram a bit sideways, so you hit it with your tracks. That saves your hitpoints, and still do 50-100 dmg.

Ramming is not always full-speed banzai charge. Depending on your reload, you sometimes can have opponents with just a few hp left. Ramming them for more than necessary is wasteful.

At least ram ELC.

Generally, when you are advised to ram ppl, your tank is useless crap. Even with E-50 ramming is always a last option (due to getting tracked and exposed to fire from other players), or opponent is significantly lighter, and /or dangerous, i.e. B.C.

I know how to ram mate, worry not :) Today I flipped a T29 upside down, i rammed him frontally when he was ona  rock. If you care I can provide with replay. It was so hilarious XD

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1 hour ago, lt_lolcat said:

I run with a spall liner as ramming is required with the leopard.  That's part of the reason that it's hilarious to play.

Spall liner helps very little in ramming (light one).

So, you gave up vents/optics/binos for spall?

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1 hour ago, lt_lolcat said:

I run with a spall liner as ramming is required with the leopard.  That's part of the reason that it's hilarious to play.

Spall liner is only worth if it is the super-heavy one.

You should either be running vents/optics/binocs/gld, as it can't run a rammer with the auto loader (please correct if i am wrong). The single shot gun is worse, as you lose the only thing that makes it a viable tank, the clip. With the 5cm, it is worse in every way (but its useless armor) compared to chaffee. and ramming scouts is hard unless they are dumb, as they are all far faster. I ran it with the both guns, apcr was not enough for anything with either gun, and at least the autoloader could do 240 damage to a chaffee (due to missed shots) each time, before hiding until reload.

While the leopard one is just meh in every respect, it is utter garbage compared to everything else. chaffee has a better gun, elc has a far better gun, both are more sneaky, chaffee has same vision with more camo, both are faster, and both don't have huge hulls that are an inviting target for heat/russian 122s.

if your gonna play a German scout for fun, get a vk2801, the derp is really funny, or the ru251, which is actually good.

Just my thoughts :P

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7 hours ago, garryallen said:

If your gonna play a German scout for fun, get a vk2801, the derp is really funny, or the ru251, which is actually good.

Just my thoughts :P

SP 1 C is actually the best german scout.

It is tier 7, so often gets tier 8 battles, where you can not only dominate in vision (same view range as RU), but also has same HEAT as RU (just slower), and a 3-shot autoloader, same gun depression, and MUCH, MUCH smaller target. Yea, it is slower...but not noticeably until RU reaches close to top speed, RU has a rather bad acceleration.

It punishes enemy heavies... just never dogfight meds in it, and it can be rammed to death by other scouts (like Bulldog if he is empty).

The number of times I had seen them end as top dmg in tier 8-9 is astonishing, something that never happen with RU due to mm shitting all over tier 8 lights.

And I have tons of battles in my RU, my bro had it for ages (combined like 800 battles), and he kept SP 1 C.

Seriously, that tank can carry games better than Bulldog due to smaller, but way punchier clip (250 penn vs 175 APCR - nobody uses M 41HEAT) and tighter clip perfect for hitting heavies and TDs. You are out of the game much shorter on the reload, and with M41 you often end up with half a mag and a dilemma.

VK was fun 2 years ago, but now is just an uptiered Pz. IV on steroids and bad mm. Derping is really only effective at tier 5 max, even there it struggles depending on map/mm.

7 hours ago, garryallen said:

While the leopard one is just meh in every respect, it is utter garbage compared to everything else. chaffee has a better gun, elc has a far better gun, both are more sneaky, chaffee has same vision with more camo, both are faster, and both don't have huge hulls that are an inviting target for heat/russian 122s.

This. With VK is the same - it is also a juicy target for anything, crap camo and huge with no effective armor, T37 is far better, and if even in strongholds you see VKs once in a year, where it is always top tier, you know its time is over.

It has derp+can ram, which tells you how serious that tank is meant to be.

Pleasurable grind, though (but gets boring after a hundred games), from Luchs to RU only Leo was meh.

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