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10.0 HD armor changes (mostly complete list)

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Or is it 9.11.  Fuck if I can remember.


Here's what I see so far looking off of gamemodels3d.com.  I'm just looking at armor thicknesses and slopes.  You've got the visual models to compare sizes and shit.  I don't have the time for that too.



Turret ring is 100mm thick now (120mm at the front) with 40mm of spaced armor around it.  UFP is 120mm thick now and MG and driver window weakspots are gone.  Track armor is no longer a solid blob and sticks true to where the wheels and tracks are.  Random 30mm spot on the roof for the driver's hatch went bye-bye.  LFP buffed from 25° to 30°, UFP nerfed from 32° to 30°.  Mantlet and gun don't quite cover as much as they did prior.



Beak between the autobounce plate and the LFP is now 110mm on the LFP and 65mm on the autobounce plate.  Was 115mm on both before.  Driver and MG weakspots removed, but the 60mm part on the rear hull is now 50mm.    UFP nerfed from 31° to 30°, LFP buffed from 21° to 30°.  30mm zone for engine deck now covers more, ended about when it's under the very rear of the turret.

Mantlet shape is more flat for the 85mm and there is less overlap between the mantlet and turret armor.  MG weakspot on the rear of the turret is removed on both turrets.  Turret front slope buffed from 11° to 19°.  Most periscopes removed from the hitbox on both turrets.  The stock turret front slope is buffed from 16°-11° to 19°.


I'm going over arty because I'm being thorough.  Track hitbox is more detailed, meaning it covers less area.  Handy for HESH and big HE.


Stock turret frontally is overall a little tougher, most notably that the cupolas are smaller.  Stock turret rear is thinner overall, though mostly 90mm nominal instead of 129mm-50mm.  HOWEVER, the mantlet is 201mm thick at its best going down to 60mm where there is overlap instead of being a solid 250mm.  Overmatch roof now is more like the IS-3, reaching down to the mantlet instead of being mostly around the hatches.  That spot is 30mm now instead of 40mm, so most mediums can autopen that spot too.

Flat parts of the side hull above the spaced armor and the flat part right behind where it starts is now 120mm thick instead of 80mm.  Frontal pike may be a little more angled, but the LFP remains untouched.  Notches in armor for the driver viewports are gone, but there's a small "flat" part where the two slopes join on the pike.  Turret ring is much smaller and is 250-200mm instead of 148mm.  Sloped side armor is now at 64° instead of 67°.  Track hitbox is no longer a solid blob.

The top turret mantlet overall is thinner, but it's still going to stop pretty much anything.  The armor behind it is 250mm instead of 201mm, not that it will really change anything either.  The loaders hatch is no longer sloped at all.  The turret itself is stronger, most notably that the flat parts on the front are either 270-220mm, instead of just being 201mm.  The 148mm zone on the turret side is now 201mm.  The 40mm part on the roof is more rounded now, leading to it taking up an overall smaller area.  The bump for the gunner's sight on the roof is flattened out.


Marder 38(t)

Untouched other than the fact that the 10mm circle on the rear hull is 15mm thick now like the rest of it.

Sturmpanzer I Bison

A few small parts of the hitbox got removed, but nothing that will really change anything at all.

G.Pz. Mk. VI (e)

Rear hull flattened out on the lower half and now has a lot more of it only covered by 6mm.

Pz.Kpfw. 38 (t) n.A.

View ports are now as thick as the surronding armor, not thinner.  Small 70mm thick parts on UFP removed.  Autobounce plate is now 15-10mm instead of 35-25mm.  The 15mm are where the spare tracks are.  Hull roof is 10mm thick now for the most part instead of 8mm.  The opposite happened for the stock turret.

Stock turret cupola is now 30mm instead of 30-22mm.  Front part of the "turret ring" is now 25mm instead of 30mm.  Mantlet is now 50mm thick instead of 25mm and the armor above and below it is 50mm instead of 30mm.  Spaced armor to the sides of the mantlet are now 10mm instead of 22mm.

Top turret is no longer a clusterfuck of different armor thicknesses.  The armor from the viewports on the side no longer stick out on the hitbox.  The side armor was nerfed from 25mm to 20mm though the rear was increased from 10mm to 20mm.  The turret face is now 30mm instead of 50mm.  Mantlet is 30mm instead of 25mm.


35mm zone from spare tracks on the LFP.  

VK 20.01 (D)

Spaced armor on hull roof in front of turret is removed.  Indents are added to the side hull for the suspension.  I can't get a good picture of them since there's too much in the way for me to do it.  It's fairly minor though, and the times it does do anything will be fairly rare I think.  

Pz.Kpfw. II

UFP is a solid 30mm instead of 30-55mm.  Autobounce plate loses the random 15mm hatch on it.  View ports are just as thick as the surrounding armor, not thinner.  Armor hole behind the mantlet on the top turret now aligns better with where it should be, plus it's a little thinner.  Two random 15mm thick triangles on the stock turret roof made as thin as the rest of the roof.

Tiger II

UFP is now at 51° instead of 50°.  LFP is 50° instead of 48°.  The very top part of the LFP is now 150mm too.  Side hull is now sloped at 25° instead of 26°-27°.  Rear hull is sloped at 30° instead of 26°.  Extra sloped parts on the UFP for the periscopes to look over are now slightly smaller.

Stock turret cupola is now 100mm at best with the sloped part being 60mm instead of it being a 150mm hunk.  The bump on the turret side for the cupola on the stock turret is now 90mm instead of 80mm.  Front of stock turret ring is 100mm now instead of 80mm.

Random 140mm part on the top turret's side near the turret ring is gone, though a lot of areas on the side are now 100mm thick from spare tracks.  The armor behind the mantlet now looks like a ball, with an overall smaller area being a 0 armor hole.


Pz.Kpfw. S35 739 (f)

Sideskirts and turret are now rounded more.  Armor behind the mantlets is now flat, but the hole in the armor for the MG is gone and the cannon hole is smaller.  The 46mm weakspot on the MG mantlet is weaker now.  Front plate is now a little more sloped between the flat area near the suspension and the autobounce area by the driver window.  The bumps by the hull view ports are no longer bumps, but 50mm thick now.  Tracks add an extra 5mm where they are.  Driver window and the one by it are both 22° now instead of one being 19° and the other at 29°.  Rear hull is now sloped 5° less than before on both the upper and lower halves.  

Jagdtiger 8,8 cm

Hull MG weakspot disappeared.  LFP is now 50° instead of 45°, plus the very top part of the LFP is 150mm thick.  Extra sloped parts on the UFP for the driver and radioman periscopes are less wide, though the driver one now gives you a tiny sport sloped at 75°.  Hull floor near the front is 40mm now instead of a solid 25mm.

Superstructure rear is 10° instead of 5°.  Spare tracks cover a few areas on both sides of the superstructure, though dunno how thick they're supposed to be since they're 270mm thick now.  Bump on the superstructure front is now pretty much all 150mm thick instead of half being 80mm.  Superstructure front is now at 15° instead of 11°.  Mantlet is 250mm-210mm thick instead of 240-150mm, meaning you still won't be penned there.  Superstructure roof is 45mm instead of 40mm now.  

Jagdpanther II

LFP is 35° now instead of 50°, but gets a little 100mm spot the same way the KT and JT88 did.  MG weakspot on UFP is gone and the sideskirts went from 16mm to 5mm.  35mm door on the rear hull is removed.  Side hull is at 30° instead of 32°-27°.  Hull floor near the front is 25mm instead of 30mm.

Hole behind the mantlet doesn't go as far up, but it does go further down.  The dip in the superstructure for the mantlet is now a mere 30mm that can be seen head-on.  180mm part for the gun mount on the superstructure is now 150mm, though is better sloped here than is was before, meaning it is either the same or better.  Superstructure front is sloped one degree less, but some of the 150mm part leaks over to the side now.  The 120mm thick mount for the mantlet is a better shape.  I cannot quite decide if the mantlet is better or worse now.  The thicker parts don't cover as much, but it also looks like it may have a little better coverage.  Either way, it doesn't change much.



T2 Medium Tank

View ports on top turret are no longer 10mm thinner than the rest of the turret.

M2 Medium Tank

Only the front vision slit for the driver counts as optics instead of all three.  All vision slits but one on the stock turret no longer count as optics.  Cannon breach on the top turret is much smaller.  Minor changes to angling on the top turret.  Very lower front plate is now at 2° instead of 36°.

M3 Stuart

Autobounce plate is 19.1mm instead of 16mm.  MG is no longer thicker than the autobounce plate.  Driver and radioman windows are now as thick as the UFP, not 3mm thinner.  Hull roof is 9.5mm instead of 13mm now.  16mm sloped area on the rear of the engine deck is 25.4mm now.  Track coverage of the side hull is slightly improved.  All 25mm parts on the tank are now 25.4mm, meaning that they can now autobounce 76mm guns.  Bumps on LFP for the drive wheels are now 2mm thicker.

The sloped part on the stock turret roof is 13mm instead of 16mm now.  The front plate on the cupola is 38.1mm now instead of 25mm.  Pistol ports on the turret sides are no longer 5mm thinner than the rest.  Bump behind mantlet is now 19.1mm, though the 0 armor hole seems smaller.

I can't get the top turret armor model to load, but the mantlet no longer has a 51mm zone, just the 38mm and 25mm ones.


Hull MG is now the same thickness as the front hull.  Front hull slope is worse, though the side is sloped a little better.  The upper half of the side slope is now 26.9mm instead of 32mm.  Rear hull is 31.7mm now instead of 25mm.  The space between the two hatches on the front hull is now 19mm thick instead of 32.  Same for the hatches themselves.  Tracks are no longer a single blob.  Hull side armor behind the tracks is now 33.3mm thick instead of only 25mm.

Stock turret front has a slightly inferior slope, though most of it is now 63.5mm instead of 51mm.  The 32mm spaced armor by the mantlet with nothing behind it is now 63.5mm.  Pistol ports on the turret sides are now 31.7mm like the rest of the side, not thinner.  Sloped part for the MG sticking out of the roof is now 12.7mm, not 32-25mm.  The 37mm is no longer stupidly long.

Top turret front has a better shape, plus it's 52.3mm there instead of 51mm.  The sides and mount for the mantlet are 41.2mm instead of 38mm.  The front half of the turret roof is now 19mm instead of 25mm.  Turret ring is 38.1mm instead of 32mm.  Mantlet is a lot smaller and has less area overlapping the turret face compared to what's covering the 0 armor hole.  The mantlet for the 6 pounder is still as big as it was prior though, maybe bigger.  All the bumps on the turret roof for hatches and optics have 41.2mm zones where they rise up.


Tracks on UFP add 20mm extra.  Bump between the driver and radioman hatches now blend into the UFP, but this really only means the UFP covers some spots that were just hull roof.  UFP buffed from 52° to 54°.  LFP from 47°-41° to 53°-49° with the bumps for the front wheel there going from 15°-75° to 36°-72°.  The lower half of the rear hull now is a 51mm plate at a 62° downwards slope instead of being two stepped 51mm plates.  The area where the driver wheel attaches to the hull is no longer part of the hull as it is now.  The entire side is now 76mm, instead of all of the side after the turret ring being 51mm.

Turret front is now 203.2mm instead of 178mm, though it doesn't quite cover as much.  The difference there is made up with a 139.7mm area.  The area behind the mantlet is still 178mm, though the innermost part of that area is 228.6mm.  The edges of the turret roof are no longer 102mm thick, but the area behind the periscope on the turret front is now 228.6mm.  The couploa is no longer a viable target for anything at all, though there is still a small 51mm bit poking out of the top.



Spaced armor in front of superstructure removed.  A lot of the 75mm gun is changed from gun hitbox to spaced armor.  LFP changes the same as the M3 stuart, though the autobounce plate is 15.9mm.  Superstructure rear is 25.4mm now instead of 32mm.  Vision slit for the driver no longer creates a bump.  The 32mm area no longer goes farther down the side than the superstructure does.  Superstructure floor above the tracks is 6.4mm instead of 13mm.   Sloped part of superstructure front is 14° now instead of 10°.  Tracks don't cover as much of the side.  Engine deck is 9.5mm instead of 13mm.


AMX 12t

Front hull nerfed a lot.  The 50mm zone is only the flat part with most of it being 15mm now.  It's a lot like the AMX 13 57 is now.  The flat part of the turret front is 30mm instead of 40mm, with the rest of the turret front and sides being 20mm now.  The "bubble" on the bottom of the turret covering where it goes up and down remains 40mm.  Cupola is a solid 20mm instead of the top being 10mm and the bottom being 40mm.  Sloped parts on the top of the turret are 30mm.

AMX AC mle. 46

Tracks on superstructure side add 10mm over a good chunk of it.  Spaced armor for the range finder is a lot smaller, but it is also only 40mm thick instead of 80mm for where you can still deal damage.  Tumors seems to be shaped better.  There is now more 120mm zone on the superstructure where the roof starts.  Tracks now are no longer a single blob, but the amount of side armor they cover hardly changes any.


Vickers Medium Mk. III

Cupolas on the stock turret and miniturrets are now as thin as the roof (4mm instead of 14mm).  Sideskirts cover more now, and a part of the hull is now just sideskirts like it's supposed to be.  Stowage bins on the hull by the turret are no longer part of the hitbox.  

Cupola on the top turret is now 9mm instead of mostly 14mm.


Sloped parts of the sideskirts are now 70mm of hull armor, though I'm sure they meant for them to stay 13mm.  Hull front radically changed.  Check the pic below, I'm not going to try to describe all this shit.  Bump on hull roof in front of turret flattened some and no longer has the 70mm section.  70mm step between the sloped hull roof and the rest is now 47mm.  A lot of the mantlet went from 75mm to 70mm.  Cupola now looks like a wedding cake instead of being a cylinder.  55mm part of the rear hull buffed from 24° to 30°.  20mm part of the rear hull changed from 77° to 72°.  Around the bottom edge of the turret, there's a tiny 25mm zone you can hit now.  Turret face shape changed a little.  Stock turret cupola is pretty tall now too.


Loyd Gun Carriage

A lot of the automotive parts removed from the hitbox.  Won't really change too much.


Gap behind the mantlet on the stock turret became a rectangle.  Spare tracks add an extra 5mm on the hull roof in front of the turret.  Rather minor mantlet shape change on the top turret.

Edited by TheMostComfortableTanker
noticed a matilda, KV-1, and M7 change
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Some notes for those who just want to know the big stuff:

JT88 got megabuffed. Beyond the top speed increase, my previous worries about the lower plate have been dispelled. Not only is the lower plate unchanged, but the tank actually got tougher. That lower plate is stronger (probably to the point where it's not much weaker then the UFP), the superstructure got stronger, and you can't overmatch the superstructure roof anymore. Badass. Still, this feels a little ridiculous. Is it really fair to buff the JT88 that hard?

T34 also got megabuffed. Tracks on the frontal armor now make its UFP considerably better, as well as also getting a small UFP angle increase. Beyond that, the tank is both better at hulldown and better at sidescrape - the cupola is going to be incredibly hard to hit, and that 50mm rear side armor that plagues all T29 series tanks is going to be gone.

JP2 was nerfed. The mantlet and the area around it will be much less reliable.


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So I should finally get my long sold t34 and jt88 back via support?

asuming that works, mby not the t34, but if the jt is removed from store I should be able to 

also, has cuni heard the news? He must be going ballistic  

Edited by zapyoug
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Did I just read that correctly? T34 side buffed from 51mm to 76mm?

So it can legitimately sidescrape and not be auto penned by 155mm + guns?



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According to applesauce the part of the T34's UFP that now has additional track armor is almost 200mm effective vs AP. That's pretty brutal, imagine having problems penning a T34 with your JT88.

...or IS6. They probably have plans to buff/nerf all prem tanks?

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Here's some pics I snapped for you all to feast your eyes upon before I head to bed.

T34.  Damn cats stealing our jobs!






Jagdpanther II


M7.  I missed this the first time around, but the armor behind the tracks is 33.3mm now, not 25mm.  Mantlet with the 6 pounder is a lot bigger too.



AMX 12t


AMX AC mle. 46


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So can anyone tell me is the t34 worth it after the buffs? The gun is horrible so I'm worried.

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Although it is not added yet, I would like to add (stronk word choice) that the Turan III Prototype got a very large buff. 


The sloped turret armor leading to the cupola is 35mm, from 15mm. Very large buff compounded with using the gun depression makes it the bounciest part of the tank. 

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Interesting buffs, JT88 is going to be faster and more robust, T34 seems better hull down and even usable when not hull down.

I may consider using the JT88 for once


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I assume that the T34 will walk all over the Löwe now?

Not the biggest of feats I know, but Ive found them to be pretty comparable. The Löwe being more reliable whilst the T34 gets to the fight more often.

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I assume that the T34 will walk all over the Löwe now?

Not the biggest of feats I know, but Ive found them to be pretty comparable. The Löwe being more reliable whilst the T34 gets to the fight more often.

Between the two, The T34 already outperformed the Löwe. Both are relatively soft when on open ground, both are really good at hull-down with a turret-resilience advantage to the T34, both can side-scrape with a slight armor-thickness advantage of the Löwe over the T34 and the T34 being more resilient to HE in a side-scrape, due to larger track coverage. Gun-wise, the Löwe is more accurate and reliably accurate, while the T34 wins on alpha and penetration. Both are slow, but the Löwe is quite a lot slower than the T34. In terms of dpm-based firepower, they are both equally weak.

All in all, the T34 wins due to mobility, being better at hull-downing and being forced to expose itself less to apply it's damage.With the change, it will also beat the Löwe in open terrain. Löwe is in need of a buff.

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In terms of sidescrape, the Lowe's advantage isn't exactly "slight", it's more like "humongous". The T34 has 51mm of rear side armor (71mm if the round goes through the tracks first), the Lowe has 105mm. That's pretty massive. As an example, the moment a T34 hits below autobounce, so 69 degrees, the side armor is 88mm thick against all guns 105mm and larger. 88mm! If the opponent has a 155mm or larger weapon, they will overmatch the side armor completely, making sidescrape impossible. If the round hits the front of the hull, the outcome is less grim, but still only ~175mm the moment it gets out of autobounce.

The Lowe's side armor, in the same situation, is always 230mm against any opponent. However, the real important factor here, that I don't really see anyone at all talk about when they mention sidescrape, is vertical angle. This is an INCREDIBLY important trait when it comes to side armor. The Lowe's side armor is naturally sloped at between 15 and 20 degrees, unless you shoot into the tracks. The T34's side armor is completely flat. This means the Lowe can easily reverse out of sidescrape at much harsher angles than the T34, while remaining much harder to pen. In most situations, if a T34 and a Lowe are trying to pull the same sidescrape stunt, a T34 is going to be autopen while a Lowe will be autobounce.

Yeah, sure, the T34 has more track coverage, I guess, but there are also tier 3 and 4 tanks with as much side armor as it. That's not a good thing.

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