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Pechpilz

Need some help with WZ-131/ general vision control and scout gameplay [Replays inside]

Question

The WZ-131 (and the 59-16 before it, grinded them when we had the community-choosen event on the EU server) is my first serious attempt to re-learn vision control and scouting since i started playing again this year.

While my understanding of the ingame mechanics has improved a lot, i still feel like i'm very useless on many maps and in a lot of situations, and therefore are unable to even attempt to carry the game - i simply do not have a idea what i could do to improve our odds of winning.

While for example malinovka is very easy to carry (this map is propably the only reason for my 55%WR @200 games), i'm absolutly lost on maps like Abbey, generally town maps and the new maps (Sacred Valley/ Severogorsk).  Sometimes i can still deal a lot of damage even on those maps, but thats usualy in games that we would have won even without me.

 

To give you some idea of how i play, i uploaded my 10 latest WZ-131 games+ "commentary" on what i think i did good or wrong.

 

It would be very nice if some of you could watch one or multiple replays and give me some feedback, to be more specific:

i) general map tactics - bushes and firinglanes i obviously didn't use, bad positioning etc etc

ii) more general things like situational awareness and tactical thinking, especially where its lacking

iii) really anything that comes in your mind to improve my gameplay :)

 

(Warning: I have currently neither sixth sense (5% missing, rest of the crew is 95% camo) nor premium, so all XP values are raw)

Equipment is rammer, camo net and optics.

Replay 1)

Cliff, Victory, 900XP, Survived

One of those games where i didn't do particulary good or anything special - we would have won without me, and i don't think i could have done anything if they had overrun either flank. Cliff is one of those maps where i don't really know how to be helpfull - in the middle area i get turned into scrap very fast, both flanks are slugfests for heavys and TDs and the lighthouse is not very usefull in my opinion. I never felt like i had any great influence on a battle on this map in a light tank.

 

Replay 2)

Ruinberg, Loss, 450XP, Dead

Another map where i don't really have a clue what to do. Since my chances in the city are really low, i went to the little village and tried to spot some people and get a few shots off. Works out fine until i yolo straigth in front of a SU152 and get a away very close.  After my retreat i get cornered by a T71 and can't do much until i get killed and we loose. Even if the SU would not have been there, i doubt i could have had much influence on the city anymore... (Notice how much damage my team did in the afterbattle report, lol)

 

Replay 3)

Lakeville, Loss, 250XP, Dead

Yet again: Apart from the initial spots on the people going town, i have no clue how a scout can be any helpfull on this map. Since i ALLWAYS (can't remember a single time it was not so) get spotted after spotting 1 or 2 of their people i immedietly pull back but still get damaged.  Then i tried to make their T21 shoot me to scout him (he is a blue player) which works like a charm - but no one shoots him, so it was all useless again >___>

I try to help some in city, but they get wrecked just when i arrive. Decided to take the bush outside the city to maybe spot someone for our TDs in the middle - nope.

While our team in their base gets wrecked, i decide to push with the TDs - all their people left the town to defend the base and there was not much to be done. Since i couldn't help there at all i pulled back to look out for enemys and got killed by their T71 in our base... i have really no clue what i could  have done, from the beginning on.

 

Replay 4)

Ensk, Win, 700XP, Survived

Yes i had a very long streak of maps i don't like to play in lights, and this is another of them: Apart from some very carefull supportfire at the east side, i have *again* no clue how to be effective. Luckily both our flanks stomp the enemys very fast, there was not much to be done.

 

Replay 5)

Fishermans Bay, Win,  900XP, Survived

At last a map that doesn't leave me totaly clueless...  I get some initial spots and flex around in the middle for a few minutes, getting some (unimportant?) sideshots in until i decide its safe to go for arty. After i killed the arty, its nothing more than cleaning up. (Notice that apart from their green Platoons the complete enemy team was red/orange)

 

Replay 6)

Murovanka, Win, 800XP, Survived

On this map in a scout on south team i would almost allways slow-mo-active-scout the forest (works like a charm, thank you camo crew <3) and from the north try to get into the little sink at the 1 line. If the enemy has no fast mediums or high-view-range tanks, i would try to knock over the tree and spot way more effective. Doesn't work out in this game, so i just poke out and accumulate some very little spotting damage. Luckily our team cleans up very fast and there was not much to be done again... Didn't feel very usefull though :(

 

Replay 7)

Sacred Valley, Loss, 400XP, Dead

lol, no clue what to do on this map as a scout. Somtimes i manage to passivescout for minimal damage, but this time i went full balls and did some damage at the temple. Decided badly to rush the IS3 and got consequently killed. Team did very little damage though, don't know what i could have done...

 

Replay 8)

Redshire, Win, 800XP, Dead

I know this map is really great for vision-tanks, but i allways loose the vision game on redshire :sad:  Got some lucky spots for some spotting damage and got killed because i tunnel visioned on the ISU.

I don't really know how to spot enemys on this map in a spot where your allies can shoot them without suffering enourmous return fire...

 

Replay 9)

Sand River, Loss, 400XP, Survived

Yaaa this map... i can active scout enemys for hours without any support fire to actually DAMAGE them :tongue: After some useless spotting i decided to shoot the southern part of the map from the ridge, overextend twice and take a lot of damage. Then try to defend our base with my platoonmate but can't do much and run away as last player till we loose :sad:

 

 

Replay 10)

Here i wanted to insert some replay of me terribly failing on abbey (left path? all heavy and mediums, getting crushed. Middle? lots of Mediums and lights, get crushed. Right flank? i decided to spot some guys there and maybe flank over the little island later - get some spotting damage and then reverse to much fall into the water lol)

 

Instead, have one replay of me actually playing good (for my standarts atleast). Its from yesterday, while the others are all from today and played in a row.

Malinovka, Win, 1150XP,  Survived (Scout+Patrol Duty)

 

 

I hope some of you find some time to give me some helpfull tips and hints :smallsmile:

Thanks in advance!

 

 

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Watched Replay No.1.

 

First of all, take off Camo Net and replace it with Vert Stab.

This tank isn't built for bush camping like the 59 16.

 

In your replay, you potentially could have got something like 2k damage at least if you had a Vert Stab and waited just a second more on a few of your shots.

Play this tank abit more aggressively, on Cliff you went up the hill for most of the game, you should've come off the hill after about 3 min or so spotting up there.

Competent players are better off playing this tank like a T-54 with no armour, a LT capable of harassing enemies as well as spotting them would be a description for the WZ Light Tank series.

 

I cannot stress how many times I have said to others to play this like a pocket medium with excellent view range and DPM with the speed of a Light.

HEAT will make this tank a statpadding machine (how I run it lol, full HEAT as I like shooting T9 and T10 Heavies from the front), however the beauty of this and the 132 is that it doesn't actually need sprem ammo to be effective, AP works just as well when you can get around the side if a T9/10 Heavy or TD.

Vert Stab gives an edge on the potential damage you can inflict upon the enemy, Rammer to maximise damage output and Optics to provide vision for the team.

 

Just on a finishing note, remember that you can afford to aim at an enemy target for longer if he is busy and not looking at you, better to punch two shells into him than waste one and giving him time to turn around.

You missed a few shots in the replay where you could've stopped for a second or two longer just to get a satisfying damaging hit.

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I just got my WZ-131.... but something if learned from Crab and Jacg.... a light tanks is at its most useful at:

 

1) The VERY beginning. You can get there 1st, and light things that no one else can.

2) Late. Meds have lost most of their HP trading with heavies or each other. Combat scouts can SHINE by vulturing cripples and lighting major portions of the map. Often, spots open up that were not viable earlier because of the density of eyes. There are places that only have good bush cover from 1 angle... so early they are deathtraps, but late you can control and entire 1/3 to 1/2 of the map.

 

Keep those HP and run away if pressured. Light tanks don't try to hold ground. They run before people see them.

 

 

 

 

I iz pretty good in 13-90. Pretty good in Chaffe. I iz terribad in Lor40t.

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I just got my WZ-131.... but something if learned from Crab and Jacg.... a light tanks is at its most useful at:

 

1) The VERY beginning. You can get there 1st, and light things that no one else can.

2) Late. Meds have lost most of their HP trading with heavies or each other. Combat scouts can SHINE by vulturing cripples and lighting major portions of the map. Often, spots open up that were not viable earlier because of the density of eyes. There are places that only have good bush cover from 1 angle... so early they are deathtraps, but late you can control and entire 1/3 to 1/2 of the map.

 

Keep those HP and run away if pressured. Light tanks don't try to hold ground. They run before people see them.

 

 

 

 

I iz pretty good in 13-90. Pretty good in Chaffe. I iz terribad in Lor40t.

 

I have to say i'm not so sure about those first lights. Apart from some obvious maps (Malinovka) they usualy put me at a high risk of getting spotted and taking return fire, while my team is not even in position to fire at the enemys.

Also it feels bad to be not of much use in the middle of the game, since (atleast on EU) 70% of all matches turn into a pure roflstomp after the first 2-5 tanks got shot down. (-> ruthless math of world of tanks etc.)

 

Watched Replay No.1.

 

First of all, take off Camo Net and replace it with Vert Stab.

This tank isn't built for bush camping like the 59 16.

 

In your replay, you potentially could have got something like 2k damage at least if you had a Vert Stab and waited just a second more on a few of your shots.

Play this tank abit more aggressively, on Cliff you went up the hill for most of the game, you should've come off the hill after about 3 min or so spotting up there.

Competent players are better off playing this tank like a T-54 with no armour, a LT capable of harassing enemies as well as spotting them would be a description for the WZ Light Tank series.

 

I cannot stress how many times I have said to others to play this like a pocket medium with excellent view range and DPM with the speed of a Light.

HEAT will make this tank a statpadding machine (how I run it lol, full HEAT as I like shooting T9 and T10 Heavies from the front), however the beauty of this and the 132 is that it doesn't actually need sprem ammo to be effective, AP works just as well when you can get around the side if a T9/10 Heavy or TD.

Vert Stab gives an edge on the potential damage you can inflict upon the enemy, Rammer to maximise damage output and Optics to provide vision for the team.

 

Just on a finishing note, remember that you can afford to aim at an enemy target for longer if he is busy and not looking at you, better to punch two shells into him than waste one and giving him time to turn around.

You missed a few shots in the replay where you could've stopped for a second or two longer just to get a satisfying damaging hit.

 

Sidenote: I upgraded to WZ-132 and got my first set of skills (6th+camo) done, taking both vision skills+ snap shot and off-road-driving. Dumped the binocs for opctics and will replace the net with vert stab soon.

I don't really feel comfortable with aiming long at the enemy - i'm really paranoid about that because i get snapshotted by enemys from ridicolous ranges so often >.< (My T49 propably dies 50% of the games i don't survive because some KV1S snapshotted my turret from 300 meters out of the turret rotation)

Also, i really love those heat shells - since the accuracy changes, i almost allways pen (JP)E100 and other Tier 10s LFP at 300+ meters.

 

 

I think my main problem with scouts (and also some other tanks on certain maps) is that i don't really know what to actually do. Its just like allmost all tanks camp in a position that is kinda useless, but hard to scout and not shot-able by other tanks. So even if i manage to get some tanks lit (while putting my precious tank at high risk) no one can shoot at them.

And on some other maps i feel like i would rather play a medium or even a heavy in the same spot and be more effective...

 

Maps i have a lot of problems with (I get good games on the sometimes, but i don't really have a plan how i could even attempt to carry the game):

Abbey

Airfield (<- Seriously, i suck at this map to no end with all my tanks. I feel like all my enemys are just sitting in some spot where they don't actually do anything until someone pokes out to get shot. Because both teams sit on oposite sides of two big rocks, they can't even shoot the enemys if they are lit.)

Highway

Redshire (<- Sometimes enemys go full yolo and i get a lot of scouting damage + regular damage. But usualy they just camp, and if i advance over the middle ridge i run into either a medium, spotting me for all his team or a high-camo Tier 10 TD that oneshots me...)

Allmost all town maps.

 

I would still appreciate any hints or tips on how to improve any part of my gameplay, and also replays/ links to videos/streams of good light tank gameplay (Anything but malinovka, seriously this map is totaly broken if you are in a light tank)

 

For now, i will try to do more damage myself and survive longer (+ Mounting Vert Stabs)  (Even though i'm totaly spoiled by playing the Type 59 which is basicly a pocket heavy that can be deployed at medium positions lol)

Thanks for the posts so far!

 

 

 

P.S. if any EU unicorns with advanced scout expercience would care to platoon with me or such, i would be so gratefull

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All the maps you have problems with can be solved pretty easily.

 

Play like a Medium with no armour (only peek around the corner to shoot if the enemy is reloading or not looking at you) or load gold and snipe.

Flanking works as well, the trick is to always make sure your entry path to a flanking position is clear and make sure you won't take any damage until you either get spotted or have dealt a crapton of damage already then bugging out.

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