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New Overmatch Mechanics

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http://worldoftanks.eu/en/news/pc-browser/46/supertest_9_17/

Hot on the tracks of the arrival of Swedish tanks comes a change to how ricochets function within the overmatch mechanic. Replacing the current system will be a single, simpler mechanic that takes into account both the impact angle and the shell caliber. This will boost the combat efficiency of highly-sloped tanks, including Swedish tank destroyers.

With the impact angle included into the equation, overmatch will result in more normalization and a greater ricochet angle. The latter will depend on the caliber/nominal armor thickness ratio. Formulas asides, you’ll be able to bounce high caliber shells with thin, but highly sloped armor if the impact angle is large, and be able to penetrate well-armored vehicles with shells that aren’t x3 the armor thickness, if they strike the armor at a small impact angle.

Impact angle of 90mm shells against a 50mm plate: (Green is pen, red is ricochet)

72.jpg

122mm:

74.jpg

152mm:

76.jpg

 

This is a huge buff to the swedish TDs, along with the flatter enginedecks (IS-4 enginedeck snipes while sidescraping for example) since it'll basically bounce anything well sidescraped. This also means that previously overmatchable sides (CDC, BC25t etc) can start sidescraping. This'll also help the lower tier japanese HTs with sidescraping at steeper angles without getting their sides overmatched. 

 

I personally think this'll be implemented solely because of the swedish TDs. Strv 103B might as well just become the most armoured tank in the game frontally while depressed since it's got a HEAT shield along with an almost flat angle when depressed properly meaning it'll be impossible to pen frontally. I do however like the change, Tiger II turret roof might get a bit stronger, certainly in CQC, and IS-3 not so much since the profile is lower and easy to shoot down on in the first place. 

 

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For the casual player that doesn't take the time to learn this stuff, they continue to get defeated handily, while those of us who work on perfecting side scraping just got a huge boost. I work on this skill a lot, with some surprising outcomes and I am starting to reap the benefits from it.

Honestly, this just means folks who take the time to line their tanks up correctly will do better, and those who don't will cry hacks more.

Sure, it can be frustrating for better players too because a tomato can unwittingly angle something correctly, and make it harder to defeat them, but more and more I come to enjoy the subtler aspects of this game which can allow a lone heavy to hold a corner against 4, which I did at J4 the other night in my IS3 on Fjords. They should have rushed me, but they didn't, even with this "buff" if they had rushed me they could have taken me out.

I don't really see anything changing other than I can put obscure skills to work better, and tomatoes will still founder helplessly, maybe more so. Am I missing something here?

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I have truly bad feelings about that because the main reason why they change overmatch mechanics are Swedish tanks, not general gameplay. Using big caliber guns will be less rewarding even if you know armor schemes. C'mon, 6 degrees more before autobounce? Are you serious? Both IS-3 and T-29 will be invincible in hull down position.

On the other hand light tanks will receive (first in years!) buff, although small. Also good to hear that Ob. 263 and IS-4 will be buffed with this change as well.

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1 minute ago, MacusFlash said:

I have truly bad feelings about that because the main reason why they change overmatch mechanics are Swedish tanks, not general gameplay. Using big caliber guns will be less rewarding even if you know armor schemes. C'mon, 6 degrees more before autobounce? Are you serious? Both IS-3 and T-29 will be invincible in hull down position.

On the other hand light tanks will receive (first in years!) buff, although small. Also good to hear that Ob. 263 and IS-4 will be buffed with this change as well.

But isn't this essentially doing what people have been asking for, making armor relevant again? Or is it so ridiculously out of context with reality that it will be bad for the game?

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Just now, SmirkingGerbil said:

But isn't this essentially doing what people have been asking for, making armor relevant again? Or is it so ridiculously out of context with reality that it will be bad for the game?

Overmatch isn't a main reason why pubbies complain about useless armor. Hell, most of them have no idea such thing even exists. Knowledge should be rewarded and I think that this change with such low extra degrees to autobounce will make this knowledge almost useless. 

I don't say it will be bad for gameplay because some tanks like mentioned before Ob. 263 or IS-4 will be fixed but personally I think this is bad way to do so.

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I see this as a bad change for the game. This is not an issue for the vast majority of tanks but will make a lot more tanks virtually immune to certain tank types. In fact, broken tanks will simply get better.

IS-3 is now practically immune to mediums. E5/215b has received an absurdly uncalled for buff with this change. T-10 is even stronger now. And the list just goes on.

The only plus is that the F155, bat, and leo can potentially sidescrape.

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I may be speaking too soon, but I feel like this completely defeats the purpose of the overmatch mechanic. 

On the plus side it seems like a large buff for lightly armored tanks, who likely fall prey to the overmatch mechanic on a regular basis without realizing it.

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I can't decide if this is making the skillgap larger or smaller. On the one hand lots of complete BS pens from red bobs that get lucky every once in a while basicly disappear, so abusing good positions will be more rewarding. On the other hand, you can't abuse this mechanic anymore with large caliber guns. since i tend to play tanks with 105mm max and little armour i lean towards a greater skillgap between good and bad players, interested what you guys think.

 

Oh, one thing i do know i'll postpone getting HT-12 untill 9.17 :doge:

Edited by vernl
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I await more information before passing judgement, since the graphic doesn't answer all my questions.

That said, at present it seems like the Tiger II will benefit a good bit. No more tier 6 122mm AP rounds blasting through its turret.

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It's probably an overall good change really, considering that overmatch is never mentioned in-game (I think) and there's no garage armour viewer to see where your tanks are likely to be overmatched. Having a mechanic that overrides 2 of the core mechanics, penetration and effective armour, while simultaneously forcing your players to go and seek out the explanatory information on that mechanic outside the game isn't a great situation if your target audience is casual dads. Problem is, judging from recent balance decisions, that WG will change overmatch while not giving the tanks that need them equivalent normal weakspots.

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7 minutes ago, WorldConqueror said:

 

It's probably an overall good change really, considering that overmatch is never mentioned in-game (I think) and there's no garage armour viewer to see where your tanks are likely to be overmatched. Having a mechanic that overrides 2 of the core mechanics, penetration and effective armour, while simultaneously forcing your players to go and seek out the explanatory information on that mechanic outside the game isn't a great situation if your target audience is casual dads.

 

There is no info about spotting system, bloom values or ground resistances. No offense but do you think that WG should remove them or do what they are supposed to do and add those info to game client? Same with armor viewer - it's already implemented in WoWs, there are bunch of 3rd party viewers. Why WG can't add this to WoT? 

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2 minutes ago, MacusFlash said:

There is no info about spotting system, bloom values or ground resistances. No offense but do you think that WG should remove them or do what they are supposed to do and add those info to game client? Same with armor viewer - it's already implemented in WoWs, there are bunch of 3rd party viewers. Why WG can't add this to WoT? 

Well I agree that bloom and terrain resistances should be shown in the game, and there should be an armor viewer. I wasn't dumping on overmatch as a mechanic, just the situation we have had for however many years where it is both in the game and undocumented. Though I do think this new system makes it more consistent with the effective armour concept rather than caliber vs thickness being the sole factor. Would have to see it in action before I would say it's 'better' for gameplay though.

 

And with things like bloom and terrain resistances at least they were part of known systems, they might contradict the provided stats but they don't negate mechanics. The spotting system was hinted at with view range even if the peculiarities weren't explained. And with the addition of camo values and the minimap range circles they've come a long way in making it more readily understandable. I dunno maybe I'm just somewhat more accepting of a change in this area due to my pet theory about lack of understanding overmatch leading to more complaints about prem rounds and the belief they autopen everything (because how else did they pen me when I'm hulldown in my IS-3? :kappa:).

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Can someone explain how this system works? Is it like, the higher your caliber the more normalization you'll get, but no more overmatch? Or does the maximum impact angle before you ricochet just change? Its hard for me to understand without numbers.

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Overmatching is quirky but it rewards skilled/knowledgeable players. Removing it will mostly affect those who actively make use of it. 

Not sure how this will turn out but at first glance it just strikes me as WG further dumbing down the game. 

What I really wonder about is what they're planning to do with premium rounds since they currently have different normalization and ricochet angles.

 

11 minutes ago, Rexxie said:

the higher your caliber the more normalization you'll get, but no more overmatch? 

 

Aye.

 

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44 minutes ago, Sapros said:

Aye.

Agh, that's a really rough system. Why would they do that if their goal is streamlining/making the mechanics simpler? It removes the fairly obscure overmatch system, but now pen numbers will be much less unreliable. You have to take into the account the size of your gun now too - a 122mm gun might work fine against a target, but then an 88 with the same pen can't deal with it from the same angle. How would a newbie know whats going on?

Just a weird decision, imho. Can't see how a normalization gradient would help make the mechanic more transparent. If they want to remove overmatch, they can do that. If they want to change normalization, they can. Doing both with a gradient doesn't make sense, though.

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18 minutes ago, Rexxie said:

Agh, that's a really rough system. Why would they do that if their goal is streamlining/making the mechanics simpler? It removes the fairly obscure overmatch system, but now pen numbers will be much less unreliable. You have to take into the account the size of your gun now too - a 122mm gun might work fine against a target, but then an 88 with the same pen can't deal with it from the same angle. How would a newbie know whats going on?

Just a weird decision, imho. Can't see how a normalization gradient would help make the mechanic more transparent. If they want to remove overmatch, they can do that. If they want to change normalization, they can. Doing both with a gradient doesn't make sense, though.

I agree. We will all adjust but I worry about the newer players that WG always claims to care about.

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33 minutes ago, SuperTheBoss said:

Soooo the is3 roof is now no longer a weakspot basically? Lul. WG just can't stop buffing that thing.

It isn't really anymore since they buffed it a few patches ago. You can only overmatch it if the IS-3 is for some reason angled down to you.

Usually if an IS-3 is hull down the opposite is the case though.

And in face hug situations you should still be able to pen it. I hope.

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4 minutes ago, Super_Rybak said:

It isn't really anymore since they buffed it a few patches ago. You can only overmatch it if the IS-3 is for some reason angled down to you.

Usually if an IS-3 is hull down the opposite is the case though.

And in face hug situations you should still be able to pen it. I hope.

Face hug situation? lol no, still won't penetrate unless you're a Nippon HT/E-100 with a huge angle above it.

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I also want to point out why overmatch is in the game in the first place. It wasn't implemented as some high level tactic that you can use to abuse badly armored weakspots, but as a reliability measure. People kept complaining about scouts bouncing their T30's doomstick, and 3x overmatch was brought in to make that much rarer. If cases like "CDC sidescrapes a JPE" actually becomes possible, then the old problem of frustrating bounces off paper tanks will be back again.

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