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3 hours ago, hazzgar said:

Sry. To get on topic. Given how bad those stats are and how early we are. I see no reason to panic. We may complain but those tanks will fail miserably in supertest. They will buff them. The only question is how scared they are of buffing lights. I see the logic behind pleasing the "hurr durr meds to powerful since unicum scum drive them" crowd but on the other hand WG HQ looks at stats more even if they do it badly.

There's being careful and slow about buffs and then there is what they did with the AMX 13/90.

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10 hours ago, FavreFan4ever said:

Fair point, although doesn't WG usually release these stats with vehicles in their elite configuration? I forget how they do these kind of things...

I guess you only have to read half of these to get stuff back on your head.

The actual hard terrain traverse are calculated with the help of these:
Current Specific Power
Stock Specific Power
Current track traverse

(Current Specific Power / Stock Specific Power) * Traverse = Actual Hard terrain traverse
So basically its a multiplier depending on how much HP/ton you can squeeze out with the configuration.
Elite configuration is not always the lightest right ?

Now let's ignore the weight from additional equipments (Vstab... whatever)
For tanks with no module upgrade we only have to look at the mounted track traverse as its actual hard terrain traverse
then calculate the medium traverse (that's the important one) because there is no weight changes in modules and engine power so Specific power remains.

But for tanks with modules upgrade specific power will change quite a lot, not only from engine upgrades but also the weight of different modules. Therefore without the stock stats (most importantly engine power and weight), there will be no way of calculating how the traverse being beefed up.

If I remember the formula currently topped 1390 has ~54.6 deg/s on hard; ~48.9 on medium
while topped 132(with 100mil): ~55.4 on hard; ~45.9 on medium. 132 gained 2deg/s from tracks but loses HP/ton, even worse than its stock configuration and leads to actual traverse below track number.

Just out of curiosity... 54lt has ~67.9 on hard; ~59.1 on medium :serb:

Yep... at lease for the hull traverse part it should be like this.
*GrabsHelmet* :tomato:

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If these soft stats are for real WG again shows their uttr cluelesness. Yes, I get that they alsways start bad and get bettr in Supertest, but this is a lost round of testing, everyone with half a brain can tell that these tanks need better mobility and either huge dpm or stellar gun handling in order to actually do something.

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I think the general direction is good, the new Chinese tank (dat accuracy aside) looks awesome to me, high base DPM, 30 hp/ton, obviously will have good camo, 420m view range, little HP buff and a 215 pen 320 alpha gun, yes please.

Not sure why the Ru251 needed a speed nerf but there you go, but again DPM buff, HP buff and view range buff are the right ideas I think.

Same for the T49 (personally very pleased the derp has gone, think that tank is a stupid RNG machine) HP buff, DPM buff, but no view range buff?

T-54 ltw gets very slight buffs, but that is understandable considering they were thinking of nerfing it at one point.

But 1390 is completely screwed, no HP buffs, a DPM nerf, no buff for that awful pen, 2 shots from it's clip gone, no view range buff WTF?

Personally I'm not sure why anyone is complaining about the WZs pen, that is about right IMO, that's around an E50M and M46 Patton, it's fine (especially with a good premium round) for a very mobile and stealthy tank, especially as we are talking the exact same DPM, alpha and more pen than the T-54 has.  

But yeh the changes should be much nearer the Chinese tank, the RU251 is the only one with real obvious buffs and then it should get a pen buff, they should buff all those 180-190 AP pens to about 200 - 210, and they should all get 41- 420m view ranges and HP buffs in the region of 1300 - 1400. 

Just give the 1390 the FCM 50Ts or CDCs 90mm with the same 6 clip, so 212 AP pen, keep the other stats the same buff it's HP to 1250, buff it's view range to 410 and let it use a v-stab. 

 

Should just add as well, I don't get the moans, aside from the T-54 and the Bat Chat AP, not many of the tier 9 mediums are that good at actually scouting, sure they have the view range, but you are never going to out spot a 1390 or a WZ-132 in a Cent 7/1 or E50 or M46 Patton or whatever.

So taking the new Chinese tank as a level I think they should be at, you have a tank that is faster than most of the meds, accelerates better than most of the meds, turns better than most of the meds, has considerably better camo than most of the meds, has better view range than most of the meds and has comporable DPM and punch, Sure it lacks a little in penetration (but it's still got more pen than the T-54 and it's gold round is pretty similar to a Patton or E50M), so you have a faster, stealthier, more able to spot tank that can shred enemies sides and rears just as good or better than the mediums could in the same position. 

For that it trades armour, HP and pen.  Seems fair to me, if the lights hit the level of the WZ-132A then I can't see much to complain about, what do you effing want? god tanks? Cos I see no reason that hyper mobile, stealthy lights should also be matching the meds for penetration or firepower. 

 

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11 hours ago, Madner Kami said:

There's being careful and slow about buffs and then there is what they did with the AMX 13/90.

To be honest it's better they do what they did with the amx 13 90. When a tank on supertest is super underpowered they will buff it for sure since it will severly underperform during the tests. They will see clear results. If it was only slighly UP they could interpret it as small anomaly but this way you are sure they will buff it.

2 hours ago, tajj7 said:

I think the general direction is good, the new Chinese tank (dat accuracy aside) looks awesome to me, high base DPM, 30 hp/ton, obviously will have good camo, 420m view range, little HP buff and a 215 pen 320 alpha gun, yes please.

Not sure why the Ru251 needed a speed nerf but there you go, but again DPM buff, HP buff and view range buff are the right ideas I think.

Same for the T49 (personally very pleased the derp has gone, think that tank is a stupid RNG machine) HP buff, DPM buff, but no view range buff?

T-54 ltw gets very slight buffs, but that is understandable considering they were thinking of nerfing it at one point.

But 1390 is completely screwed, no HP buffs, a DPM nerf, no buff for that awful pen, 2 shots from it's clip gone, no view range buff WTF?

Personally I'm not sure why anyone is complaining about the WZs pen, that is about right IMO, that's around an E50M and M46 Patton, it's fine (especially with a good premium round) for a very mobile and stealthy tank, especially as we are talking the exact same DPM, alpha and more pen than the T-54 has.  

But yeh the changes should be much nearer the Chinese tank, the RU251 is the only one with real obvious buffs and then it should get a pen buff, they should buff all those 180-190 AP pens to about 200 - 210, and they should all get 41- 420m view ranges and HP buffs in the region of 1300 - 1400. 

Just give the 1390 the FCM 50Ts or CDCs 90mm with the same 6 clip, so 212 AP pen, keep the other stats the same buff it's HP to 1250, buff it's view range to 410 and let it use a v-stab. 

 

Should just add as well, I don't get the moans, aside from the T-54 and the Bat Chat AP, not many of the tier 9 mediums are that good at actually scouting, sure they have the view range, but you are never going to out spot a 1390 or a WZ-132 in a Cent 7/1 or E50 or M46 Patton or whatever.

So taking the new Chinese tank as a level I think they should be at, you have a tank that is faster than most of the meds, accelerates better than most of the meds, turns better than most of the meds, has considerably better camo than most of the meds, has better view range than most of the meds and has comporable DPM and punch, Sure it lacks a little in penetration (but it's still got more pen than the T-54 and it's gold round is pretty similar to a Patton or E50M), so you have a faster, stealthier, more able to spot tank that can shred enemies sides and rears just as good or better than the mediums could in the same position. 

For that it trades armour, HP and pen.  Seems fair to me, if the lights hit the level of the WZ-132A then I can't see much to complain about, what do you effing want? god tanks? Cos I see no reason that hyper mobile, stealthy lights should also be matching the meds for penetration or firepower. 

 

A working gun. No armor + low hp + long exposure don't mix well. I'm sure they will buff it but it's a problem. Stay with low armor and low hp but ffs those tanks need to be able to have minimise exposure.

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1 hour ago, hazzgar said:

To be honest it's better they do what they did with the amx 13 90. When a tank on supertest is super underpowered they will buff it for sure since it will severly underperform during the tests. They will see clear results. If it was only slighly UP they could interpret it as small anomaly but this way you are sure they will buff it.

A working gun. No armor + low hp + long exposure don't mix well. I'm sure they will buff it but it's a problem. Stay with low armor and low hp but ffs those tanks need to be able to have minimise exposure.

The LTW has amazing dispersion, leaving the 1390 aside cos that is god awful at the moment, all the others have decent to good dispersions (especially considering the speeds they can do) as far as I can see with fast aim times, they could buff them a little more for the 240-250 alpha tanks. Movement dispersions of 0.14 to 0.18 is about standard for most tier 9 mediums (Patton aside), most of these lights are around the lower end of that. 

On current stats though, leaving aside the odd accuracy, that Chinese light looks well fun to me, super fast, super stealthy, high DPM, good alpha and decent pen, decent gun handling.  If they get rest to around that standard I think they'll be more than good enough. 

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The tier 9 LWT should be same as T-54 but with less armor in return for more speed. So all they have to do is put the T-54 gun on the LWT and they are done. If it has a gun that isnt same or similar to the T9 meds, who is going to play it?

You can run a similar line of thinking on the German line. The Leo PTA has paper armor, a god-like L7 gun with 390 alpha and wonderful handling, and 65kph speed (albeit with weak acceleration). Now, what does the Ru251 gain or give up to make you want to play it rather than the PTA? 

My main area of concern, though, is what they are going to do to my beloved WZ-132 as its staying at tier 8. I am really concerned they are going to kill an amazing tank as it has to be worse than the new tier 9s.

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I somehow doub that they are going to do much about the WZ-132 at all. It was the first of the new-generation T8 scouts and while it is in no way worse than back in the day when it was introduced (ignoring physics and map-changes), it is considered to be on the weaker end of the power-spectrum of the T8 Lights and especially the T54LT powercrept it hard in regard to flanking-firepower, leaving it behind as being the superior scout with all the implications from the map-changes. Same is true for competative play. If you want a superior scout, you are either going 13/90 (assuming you have a competent player) or the WZ and the 13/90 has the advantage in a flanking combat role, due to the autoloader. The RU outpaces all of them (though it takes a bit longer to speed up) and outpummels the opposition via DPM. The 54LT is pretty much good enough in everything and occasionally bounces a round or two in brawls, to be ubiquitous in any team that needs a light tank or multiple, in particular because you do not need a specialist player to make it work reliably.

Pretty much the only way in how you would be able to beat the 54LT in the fast flanker role while driving a WZ is, to use the 85 over the 100mm on the WZ and to make that work reliable, you, yet again, need a more skilled player as you still do not have the armor, but the DPM-advantage (not to mention, that you are trading the original feature-trademark of the chinese scouts away, aka alpha). On a sidenote, I find it quite amusing how they give the 132A the feature-trademark of the line back.

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How could this have seemed ok to WG.   Like the 13 90 is supposed to now be equivalent to something like the Bat-AP? With 170 pen,  less clip dmg,  less hp, yet has the same mobility?

 Excuse me? 

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Terrain resistance and hp/ton leaked on Rita's Status Report.

https://ritastatusreport.live/2017/01/15/ru251-t49-and-amx-13-90-tier-9-stats/

https://ritastatusreport.live/2017/01/15/t-54-lightweight-tier-9-supertest-stats/

https://ritastatusreport.live/2017/01/15/wz-132a-supertest-stats/

 

WG really hates the 13 90. Worst gun, worst VR, and worst mobility to go along with the least hp.

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15 hours ago, FavreFan4ever said:

Terrain resistance and hp/ton leaked on Rita's Status Report.

https://ritastatusreport.live/2017/01/15/ru251-t49-and-amx-13-90-tier-9-stats/

https://ritastatusreport.live/2017/01/15/t-54-lightweight-tier-9-supertest-stats/

https://ritastatusreport.live/2017/01/15/wz-132a-supertest-stats/

 

WG really hates the 13 90. Worst gun, worst VR, and worst mobility to go along with the least hp.

I really doubt there's some cheating within the engine and traverse

Currently 132 only has two 580 HP engine while 1390 has a stock 250, 350 HP top engine.

Still, other stats are really really on the meh side

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Both the the blogs seem to keep messing up the T49's view range, on the official pics it has 420m. 

Basically it's early days, hopefully this is just a starting point and they'll move up from here and we'll see more buffs.  

IMO the WZ-132A is the standard they should be moving too and at the very least the other 240-250 alpha gun armed lights need their pens buffing up to the same level 210-220 AP rang, if not bigger gun handling buffs for those guns.

Which reminds me of the T92 light, which is still yet to appear, that thing on test has insane dispersion levels, they should be reflecting that in these lights, especially on the ones with a smaller gun. Lights should be the best on the move firers and maybe you then have the poor accuracy as a balancing factor discouraging them from sniping.

The 1390 is a weird one cos honestly what is the point of the 1390 and the AMX-105 at tier 10 when you have the Bat Chat AP and Bat Chat 25t which are pretty much indentical, fast paper armoured autoloaders?    

 

 

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1 hour ago, kariverson said:

HAHA what the hell? Their matchmaking remains the same but they got nerfed?!

They're obviously OP in current corridor meta.

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Also added it in the tier 10 light thread but the stats are messed up right now between the tier 9s and 10s.

T49 at tier 9 has same HP and 10m more view range than the Sheridan at 10. 

And the pen power creep is huge, pretty much all the tier 10 lights have 235 - 245 pen guns with 320 or 390 alpha damage, whilst the tier 9s have 180 - 190 pen guns with 240/250 alpha and pretty much the same DPM. 

The Rheinmetal at tier 10, and the WZ-132A are the clear stand outs at the moment, like head and shoulders above the other stats. The Rheinmetal has the most pen, is the fastest, has 20m more view range than the others, and the highest HP. The WZ then gets the HP, DPM and view rang buffs the RU and T49 get, but also gets a 215 pen 320 alpha gun to go with it, rather than 185-190 AP 90mm guns, and has the best power to weight by far at 30 hp/ton. 

Also the AMX 13-105 at tier 10 seems to have 15 hp/ton lol. 

 

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On 1/14/2017 at 0:44 PM, tajj7 said:

they should buff all those 180-190 AP pens to about 200 - 210, 

lel, WG should employee me.

It's exactly what they've done -

Quote

WZ-132A

Penetration: 220 (+5) / 248 (-17) / 50 mm

AMX 13 90

Penetration: 205 (+35) / 248 / 45 mm
Magazine reload time: 23 s (-7)
Reload time (between shells): 2,2 s (-0.3)

RU 251

HP: 1400 (+50)
Penetration: 215 (+25) / 250 / 102 mm

T-54 ltwt.

Penetration: 208 (+28) / 235 / 50 mm

T49

Penetration: 212 (+27) / 250 / 45 mm

I also like that direction for the 1390, that is a better reload than the T69 has for the same clip damage. Makes it much more 'bursty' and similar in playstyle to the T71.  Should be able to get that reload down to 21-22s, and the DPM will then sit around 2k I think rather than the woeful 1.5k they gave it initially. 

Still think it needs a view range and HP buff, but it's getting there. 

 

 

 

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The shorter reload helps distinguish it from Bat-Chats and really helps with early game positions, where often you don't have reload to shoot (hills on Mines/Tundra, crossings on Arctic Region/Sand River/Fisherman's Bay/Prokh etc.)

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