God Have Mercy On Us (WT E100 P)

[Zepherex 3,641]

I still remember the frustration of getting yolo'd by bots in waffles. Even in this new meta I still think it's too cancer.

[hazzgar 729]

On 18.01.2018 at 11:18 PM, mati_14 said:

I don't see the problem then, because we already have tanks that can do that  and its still annoying if any autoloader it does, some might not kill you, but fuck you hard enough to ruin the rest of the game for you. Yolos are problem regardless which tank does it and it's more related to XVM or how retarded are some enemies ingame than one specific tank. It reminds me the ''issues'' with old MM and people used to complain how terrible it was to face 12 tier X in with a tier 8, but that used to happen... once every 70-80 games?,  how often is a WT be able to yolo and kill you if that's your issue with it? Just like with the old MM example, it's really unlikely, annoying as fuck when it happens but really unlikely.

Not to the same extent. Sorry but a hit for 1400 or even 1850 from HE/Hesh is unreliable plus it's still below 2000hp. This thing can kill you from full hp. This thing can also engage 3 tanks late game and kill all 3 of them in 10s. No other tank can do that. Late game you just camp base an wait till the enemies come to you. If they are low hp you can pull a win

[Rexxie 10,776]

Quick reminder that pubbies averaged under 2k DPG in the Waffle! <3

[CarbonWard 3,529]

WaffenT would get creamed in the current meta.

A tank with zero camo, 5 degrees depression, literally get auto lit by any tier 9/10 LT, hit by artillery that doesn't miss.

[hazzgar 729]

2 minutes ago, CarbonWard said:

WaffenT would get creamed in the current meta.

A tank with zero camo, 5 degrees depression, literally get auto lit by any tier 9/10 LT, hit by artillery that doesn't miss.

Again we are not talking about tanks ability to win games but how toxic it is to gameplay. It has the same problems as the FV4005 (but less dep). The thing is it is still cancer to the game. Don't look at it only from the problem of the clip size because it has many advantages over the foch (in terms of making the game toxic): A turret, more pen, more accuracy, faster shell, more alpha. Yeah it will be hit at wining but it will still do lots of damage. Old waffle allowed 53% barely green scrubs do 3k dpg. 

 

Also still remember what any of us can do in this thing on a loosing game. 1 vs 4 scenario. All 1 shots. You have a fast aiming, high pen, accurate gun and a turret. You find a position where the enemies have to come to you and you can kill them all even if they all come at once. All you need is a slight hp advantage. This is not good for the game, Derps can't do that. Foch can't do that.

[CarbonWard 3,529]

2 minutes ago, hazzgar said:

Again we are not talking about tanks ability to win games but how toxic it is to gameplay. It has the same problems as the FV4005 (but less dep). The thing is it is still cancer to the game. Don't look at it only from the problem of the clip size because it has many advantages over the foch (in terms of making the game toxic): A turret, more pen, more accuracy, faster shell, more alpha. Yeah it will be hit at wining but it will still do lots of damage. Old waffle allowed 53% barely green scrubs do 3k dpg. 

 

Also still remember what any of us can do in this thing on a loosing game. 1 vs 4 scenario. All 1 shots. You have a fast aiming, high pen, accurate gun and a turret. You find a position where the enemies have to come to you and you can kill them all even if they all come at once. All you need is a slight hp advantage. This is not good for the game, Derps can't do that. Foch can't do that.

Old waffle was in a meta where VR was not particularly stacked, mediums with 490+ VR was a rarity back then, LT was underpowered and rarely played, arty would miss a fully aimed shot on a still target more often than not.

Hell, 3 years ago you could farm 4k dmg on Muro north spawn by just going to the bush on the north end of the magic forest cause pubbies were that retarded and tries to enter the forest via open high road.

Oh, and lets not forget Type 5.

Old waffle worked because the meta allowed it to work.

[mistervanni 20]

if he can send types and FVs packing as they can send us, then he is good imo...but i would never get it so pointless argument i guess

[mati_14 129]

5 hours ago, hazzgar said:

Not to the same extent. Sorry but a hit for 1400 or even 1850 from HE/Hesh is unreliable plus it's still below 2000hp. This thing can kill you from full hp. This thing can also engage 3 tanks late game and kill all 3 of them in 10s. No other tank can do that. Late game you just camp base an wait till the enemies come to you. If they are low hp you can pull a win

155 can do that, Foch B can do that, even BC might be able, but once again, everyone is putting themselves in that ideal situation for the WT it's obvious whose gonna win. I totally agree with Carbon, this would be far from OP or even broken, WT gets spotted, gets deleted, I feel Foch B > WT > 155. I just want it for the pleasure of destroying some other broken tanks with it.

[hazzgar 729]

3 hours ago, CarbonWard said:

Old waffle was in a meta where VR was not particularly stacked, mediums with 490+ VR was a rarity back then, LT was underpowered and rarely played, arty would miss a fully aimed shot on a still target more often than not.

Hell, 3 years ago you could farm 4k dmg on Muro north spawn by just going to the bush on the north end of the magic forest cause pubbies were that retarded and tries to enter the forest via open high road.

Oh, and lets not forget Type 5.

Old waffle worked because the meta allowed it to work.

You have seriously misread my post.

1. I am not saying the new waffle will be as good as the old one. Simply that it's still cancerous.

2. I was not saying it will work. Again I am saying it will be cancerous but not good like Fv4005 or arty

3. Type5 is a much better tank but I'd rather face a 1200hp type5 than a 800hp waffle in the late game.

 

Overall you miss the point. I am not saying waffle is good. You are completely missing the point. All I am saying is that it's bad for the game. It makes late game more unpredictable and it will slow down gameplay in tier10s since pubs will be afraid to peak.

 

Also remember that you cannot judge a tank only by its performance among the pubs. It's still one of the rare tanks that makes a total potato player really dangerous. 

[hazzgar 729]

15 minutes ago, mati_14 said:

155 can do that, Foch B can do that, even BC might be able, but once again, everyone is putting themselves in that ideal situation for the WT it's obvious whose gonna win. I totally agree with Carbon, this would be far from OP or even broken, WT gets spotted, gets deleted, I feel Foch B > WT > 155. I just want it for the pleasure of destroying some other broken tanks with it.

Sorry but both of them are much worse than waffle at that because they are worse at dealing damage, even if their platforms are more durability. WTF doesn't have a derpy gun, it has accuracy, shell speed and pen (foch b doesn't) and it has A TURRET so it can corner fight.

 

Also like Carbon you misunderstood my post. I NEVER said WTF would be OP. It would be broken because it would be the best tank in the game in terms of quickly delivering damage. Sorry but foch can't deliver damage because it can't corner fight and it can't snipe. I'm not saying WTF would be a better tank than Foch. Maybe it will, maybe it won't. All I am saying is it still has the most firepower in the game and is exceptional at delivering damage. You are saying I am talking about ideal scenarios but so are you. You assume you never make mistakes (and even the top of the top do) or that there is no chance some tomato won't put his WTF in a totally unexpected position (recently I have met a BC25T camping all game in A8 on redshire behind a thick bush I didn't know existed because it's so useless. It's so fun when you go from 1400 to 0 because some tomato found the weirdest place to get himself killed). Sorry but I don't want to meet waffles and you just defend it because you really want the tank so you are defending cancerous gameplay. Waffle will not work for any 55%+ player but I still don't think it should be in the game. Even for the shit reason of turning the game completely because it has changed a 2:5 into a 2:1 because it has killed all your tomatoes.

[tajj7 560]

Foch 155 and Foch B, no turret this is very crucial.

183s gun handling is so bad they need to be pre-aimed.

None of these tanks can come close to the comfort levels of the Waffle, full turret, fast aim time, very high APCR pen, great accuracy. 

Vision meta is irrelevant if you are either A. Out of render range or B. behind a huge fuck off rock you'll never be seen.

Waffles are not going to get spotted, just like most base camping JpE100s and 183s don't get spotted until they have shot. There are so many cancerous red line and base camping spots on maps that have -

1. Hard cover to hide behind. You can't get spotted through a rock unless it's proxy. 

2. Elevation. 

3. Open ground in front of them.

Waffle bot just waits behind his rock, fully loaded, until you get lit by one of his team mates, he pops out and deletes you. Unless you have 5 guns pre-aimed his way, which you won't cos he's not been spotted and most pubbies are not clever enough to work out where a not yet spotted TD is and be ready for it. He'll take 1/2 hits at best for his whole clip, where he has either deleted one tier 10 tank or probably taken 3 medium health ones out and then he'll go back and hide in his hole.

Even if you know he is there, what the fuck are you going to do, cos he's not going to move, these base camping shitters have the patience of a saint, they are quite happy to do nothing for 10 minutes if it gets them their shot.

I think people have forgotten how cancerous these things were to gameplay. the meta has not magically changed enough to impact that.

If anything IMO there are more spots for Waffles to hide than their used to be. HD maps even more. 

Anyone seen the new little base line ridges on the HD Cliff? The spots at A5 and J6, where for the north team at the moment usually Swedish TDs go boost up and for the South team there is nothing, well those have been changed, now there are little bases there, easy to drive up, one route in and have hard rock cover, with bushes to poke out from either side. A Waffle in there, more cancerous than anything in the game currently IMO. 

[hazzgar 729]

I people also forget that even though they might be able to outplay the waffle their teammates won't. It's the same logic people used here for saying Defender is not OP and broken because it's not a tank suited for high skill play. Yeah it isn't but when a total potato decimates your teamates all your skill will matter little. Wot is still a team game and if your team gets erased you won't be able to carry alone

[Sapros 348]

If you routinely got clipped by a waffle you mostly had yourself to blame. 

Games where the lone camping waffle would murder everyone at the end of the game barely ever happened, most of them died long before emptying their first clip. 

Also corner fighting in that thing didn't work out so well, the turret was so huge you'd get shot long before ever getting a chance to aim and most of the time your gun would get screwed in the process. 

This type of vehicles attracts mostly bads. Very few good players spam turds like this. Bads have little to no chance of getting one if it's a top tier mission reward. 

T10's an irredeemable shitshow anyway.

[hazzgar 729]

1 hour ago, Sapros said:

If you routinely got clipped by a waffle you mostly had yourself to blame. 

Games where the lone camping waffle would murder everyone at the end of the game barely ever happened, most of them died long before emptying their first clip. 

Also corner fighting in that thing didn't work out so well, the turret was so huge you'd get shot long before ever getting a chance to aim and most of the time your gun would get screwed in the process. 

This type of vehicles attracts mostly bads. Very few good players spam turds like this. Bads have little to no chance of getting one if it's a top tier mission reward. 

T10's an irredeemable shitshow anyway.

I like repeating myself so I will post this again. Even if the waffle won't clip you it will clip your teammates. This is a team game. If a waffle decimates your team (and it's good at that) you will also be at a disadvantage. 

[zbran 51]

My resounding memory of the waffle is "fuck! A waffle! Press 3 press 3 press 3" Once they are spotted they are fairly easy to deal with/avoid.  I think everyone got clipped out by one at some stage, but it was generally due to a poor move by yourself. 

I can't remember how long they're gone from the game. But I think it was before the World of Bowling alleys meta. I'm not sure they will do very well with the current maps bar a few where they can remain unspotted for a long time.

 

I'm of the opinion that the Mongol 4 and Mongol 5 are far more broken than the waffle.  Those tanks are just so retarded in ever way. Bullet proof armour, and a gun that can't miss.

 

WG'ing basically took arty players from some random spot at the back of the map, gave them a shit ton of armour and parked them on the front line.

 

 

 

 

[bolagnaise 406]

Waffles weren’t such a big deal from memory. Fairly easy to outplay and if you don’t want to fight it, do the unicunt thing and let someone else die to it, and then go farm him with HE on reload

[kolni 69,670,851]

I'm just going to do the even more dickish thing and platoon my waffle with 2 Type 5s that tank the hits for me before I clip shit  

[Fulcrous 2,073]

13 hours ago, Kolni said:

I'm just going to do the even more dickish thing and platoon my waffle with 2 Type 5s that tank the hits for me before I clip shit  

So basically what that one RU player does with his JPE

[EndlessAgony 129]

On 1/16/2018 at 1:34 AM, Crossfader said:

Im good

25.11.2015

Anyone here who stopped with this cancer even before that?

[CardinalMite 21]

On 23/01/2018 at 0:11 AM, zbran said:

I can't remember how long they're gone from the game. But I think it was before the World of Bowling alleys meta. I'm not sure they will do very well with the current maps bar a few where they can remain unspotted for a long time.

 

I'm of the opinion that the Mongol 4 and Mongol 5 are far more broken than the waffle.  Those tanks are just so retarded in ever way. Bullet proof armour, and a gun that can't miss.

 

WG'ing basically took arty players from some random spot at the back of the map, gave them a shit ton of armour and parked them on the front line.

 

 

 

 

It wasn’t that long ago, pretty much maps have not become significantly more world of alley ways since the WTF last trolled us all. 

Also whoever said vision has increased since then as a significant factor is incorrect. Arguably it has decreased in view range on average since TDs got view range nerfed and ironically tier 9 and 10 LTs have less view power than many pre-existing 9 and 10 mediums and heavies when they were introduced. It is true that some high tier LTs have very good camo which does help but honestly overall I think that view and scouting power is largely similar to back then. 

I am not sure the WTF would be OP so much as it is just broken and in a way that would be negative to the gameplay experience overall for most of the player base. 

 

Honestly new TDs in general beyond what we already have and especially for tiers 8-10 to my mind are largely negative to the enjoyment of the game. 

“Yay both teams have loads of TDs this match, we are going to have a fun time over the next 15 minutes with enjoyable and dynamic gameplay!” Said absolutely no one ever.

 

[tajj7 560]

On 1/21/2018 at 5:50 PM, Rexxie said:

Quick reminder that pubbies averaged under 2k DPG in the Waffle! <3

Most tier 10 arties used average under 2k damage, just saying. I'm sure it was a comfort when people got one shot from 2k health by a T92. 

[Rexxie 10,776]

I agree, that was more in a response to the "gaurunteed 3k damage" comment. Even with the waffen's ridiculous gun, pubbies were looking at something like 2 pens per clip. A free 3k might have been the case when the waffen was released, but by the time it was removed from the game the tank was dogshit at dealing damage even though that was the only thing it could feasibly hope to do. I wouldn't even want to see how pathetic it would be these days.

It should never see the light of day because the tank does nothing but make the game worse, but I dont want anyone getting the idea it would actually be playable. It'd just be the 4005 all over again.

[tajj7 560]

@Rexxie

Not playable just broken, no different from 183s, they are crap RNG wagons but still stupid for the game. 

I don't want it in the game because of that, not to mention it would be a crap tier 10 reward for new PMs because as you say it's an awkward min maxed tank. 

Hopefully the new tier 10 reward is -

1. Not the Waffle or some other min/max tank

2. Not something Russian or a Chinese knock off, too many of those tanks at tier 9/10

3. Not the Chieftain. 

T95/Chieftain would be an interesting option. 

[hazzgar 729]

2 hours ago, tajj7 said:

@Rexxie

Not playable just broken, no different from 183s, they are crap RNG wagons but still stupid for the game. 

I don't want it in the game because of that, not to mention it would be a crap tier 10 reward for new PMs because as you say it's an awkward min maxed tank. 

Hopefully the new tier 10 reward is -

1. Not the Waffle or some other min/max tank

2. Not something Russian or a Chinese knock off, too many of those tanks at tier 9/10

3. Not the Chieftain. 

T95/Chieftain would be an interesting option. 

Why not make @leggasiini happy and Jap t10 td? Or simply make the final reward a moneymaker at t8 instead of making it a t10 tank. 

[tajj7 560]

6 minutes ago, hazzgar said:

Why not make @leggasiini happy and Jap t10 td? Or simply make the final reward a moneymaker at t8 instead of making it a t10 tank. 

Not sure a completely a new line is a good idea for a tier 10 reward, no one would have a crew for it. 

Tier 8 is pretty boring and not very special as a PM reward.

A tier 9, but with higher than tier 8 credit earning, similar to the Missouri in WOWs, that would be tempting.