Crossfader

New CV's launched

28 posts in this topic

I have had the Kaga and Saipan... both are unplayable at tier 9-10, your planes simply vanish the moment they get near any ship, I have never felt so useless in a "ship" in 4 years of playing WoWs, only good at spotting, i could have gone AFK and the battles would have played out exactly the same

The UI is bugged and the gameplay is boring and repetitive, sell them for doubloons and fast

example of bugged UI: no boost, no CV status, just a return to aircraft carrier.... this has gone though 3 PTS iteration, about 1 months worth of testing on open public, god knows how long before in private.

3Bqeh1C.jpg

basically a broken product

 

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No surprises there. Things were pointed out, things got ignored. As usual, they went through the wall with their heads first. The new gameplay was mandated from above with no alternatives.

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Well at least if you build for AA now you cant get shit on. Full AA Minotaur, which is still a viable random build, is basically a no fly zone at the moment, no DefAA required.

So i guess they "fixed" CV by making them 100% useless... so the 5% of the player who played CV is gonna stay the same, but no more sky cancer

WG achieved 50% of what they wanted, not bad i guess.

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22 minutes ago, Crossfader said:

Well at least if you build for AA now you cant get shit on. Full AA Minotaur, which is still a viable random build, is basically a no fly zone at the moment, no DefAA required.

So i guess they "fixed" CV by making them 100% useless... so the 5% of the player who played CV is gonna stay the same, but no more sky cancer

WG achieved 50% of what they wanted, not bad i guess.

People complained about the AA being too weak on the test servers, because now the carriers have infinite planes and no matter how many you shot down, the carrier would come again at full strength. And over time, your AA is going to be diminished, because nobody uses the small gun mount damage resistance mod or the tier 1 captain skill that increases module resistance (though I just do not understand why, especially the module). Also, CV-AA-gameplay is really limited, taking away a rather powerful teamplay- and CV-counterplay-component while they were at it.

Of course WG then buffed AA, because that was the easiest way to appease the voices. Works as well as it always does.

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Doubt I will sell my Kaga/Saipan just because I don't think WG will sell them again and they could get buffed in the future.

But I am inclined to play the game less though based on what I have seen.

They seem to be basically beta testing this on live and it could be many months before this gets anywhere near an acceptable level. 

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3 hours ago, tajj7 said:

Doubt I will sell my Kaga/Saipan just because I don't think WG will sell them again and they could get buffed in the future.

But I am inclined to play the game less though based on what I have seen.

They seem to be basically beta testing this on live and it could be many months before this gets anywhere near an acceptable level. 

they will sell all the tier 8 prem CV's in the future... i can guarantee it, why do you think they reworked them.

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Atlanta/Flint went from the best pound for pound AA ships in the game to almost useless.  They were specifically designed to escort CVs for AA.  We were told premium ships wouldn't be nerfed.  Well, directly or indirectly the Atlanta/Flint has been nerfed.  #1 The AA rings need to overlap.  #2 In addition to the extra flak bursts, AA Guns Modification 1 needs to have the 20% range boost.  Especially in light of the unlimited planes the CVs can now sport.

What really makes me laugh, is the fact that 90% of the fantasy Russian paper are better plane killers...

From Wikipedia -

  Quote

Quote

USS Atlanta (CL-51) of the United States Navy was the lead ship of the Atlanta class of eight light cruisers. She was the third Navy ship named after the city of Atlanta, Georgia. Designed to provide anti-aircraft protection for US naval task groups, … Atlanta, in some works, is designated CLAA-51 because of her primary armament as an anti-aircraft cruiser. Hence, all of the Atlanta-class ships are sometimes designated as CLAA. However, her entire battery of 5-inch (127 mm) guns were dual-purpose (DP) guns, and were capable of being used against both air and surface targets, able to fire anti-aircraft, high-explosive and armor-piercing shells.

They also buffed 3 or 4 Russian DDs that didn't really need it, and ignored many other ships which need buffs to due to power creep .

In 2 battles I managed 1 torp hit in the CVs, this new system was rushed and done to dumb down the game for people. 

 

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Playing DDs at high tiers is meh now. You get plane spammed, the fact that CVs now don't have to worry about plane loses or re-arming/replenishing squadrons just means they spam you over and over, so basically become perma-spotted. 

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Just noticing a few things:

Those are not F4U Corsairs, these are F6F Hellcats, Wargaming. Come on, you had the correct planes on this ship before, why the change...

gHxqaWg.jpg

Sigh... Nothing screams rushed development more than things like that...

UrZWBsK.jpg

Why exactly are we using the fastest single-piston-engine german fighter of WW2 as a torpedo- and dive-bomber on the Graf Zeppelin? I mean, the Jericho-trumpets are lovely, but if you insist that the german dive- and torpedo-bombers have to be slow, then don't use the second fastest-prop-driven german fighter plane of the war as a model, but go for what is historically appropriate and use a JU87 or a derivative, even though their tiering would be kinda wierd. But don't mix this up like this... Come on...

UlT9lYX.jpg

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O5u73op.jpg

85 planes kill, still not enough, CV's still got me

What is the point of AA if they can just keep coming, AA mino seems to be one of the best AA ships in 8.0 yet its still doesn't matter, they just respawn and keep coming, all while you lose AA and HP

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On 2/1/2019 at 10:47 PM, Madner Kami said:

Why exactly are we using the fastest single-piston-engine german fighter of WW2 as a torpedo- and dive-bomber on the Graf Zeppelin? I mean, the Jericho-trumpets are lovely, but if you insist that the german dive- and torpedo-bombers have to be slow, then don't use the second fastest-prop-driven german fighter plane of the war as a model, but go for what is historically appropriate and use a JU87 or a derivative, even though their tiering would be kinda wierd. But don't mix this up like this... Come on...

 

Oh, I get it now. The Zeppelin indeed has the slowest attack aircraft. What I missed was "attack aircraft" doesn't apply to divers and torpers as a group-description anymore, but specifically refers to the rocket planes. They are the slowest on tier and WG is using the Ta 152 for the divers and the torpers, because they are by far the fastest divers and torpers of the tier and even the fastest planes in the tier at all, when boosting. They've switched that around from every other carrier. Nice, so no rocket hunting DDs early on in the Zeppelin. Interesting prospect, especially when doing a torp run.

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Oh dear. The Graf Zeppelin is so going to either get nerfed or never to be sold again. The combination of having planes that run at 260knots and being able to boost for 22s gives a really nasty potential for early spotting and damage application. Having a flock of torp bombers running amok in your spawnzone 30s in is no joke.

Also, I love doing dive bomb attacks in that thing, I wish the divers were more survivable, not just on Zeppelin, but every carrier. You spend far too long getting into dropping range and within core AA-DPS zone, especially with any sort of AP-bomber due to your natural target choice. You rarely get more than one attack out of a squad.

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Played the tier 6 Ryujo today.... its seems both OP and underpowered at the same time, very weird to can my head around

-AP bombs seem near useless

-Torps are easy to aim and land, but do little damage, only rely on Dot flooding

-He rockets seem very hit or miss

The AA is also very on or off, either i can fly around and do full drops or they all instantly get crippled/die, there is no in between.

 

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6 hours ago, Crossfader said:

The AA is also very on or off, either i can fly around and do full drops or they all instantly get crippled/die, there is no in between.

 

Avoid flying into the black clouds (FlaK-explosions from long- and mid-range AA). Those are the main reason for loosing plane-health. Outside of those explosions it's "only" damage over time, which is far more endurable unless you are in overlapping AA-circles or doing dive bombing in the core zone. The worst possible combination are ships covering each other with their long- and mid-range range FlaK (about 5km to each other).

The more I think about it, the more useless dive bombers are. The US gets HE dive bombers, which you can reasonably use against DDs, but AP dive-bombers (Enterprise, Zeppelin and IJN CVs except Kaga) force you into the worst possible position (through long- and mid-range AA and into short range AA) over the worst possible targets (cruisers and battleships which are loaded with AA) and into the longest attack-cycle (spending a large amount of time in the short-range AA bleeds health like you wouldn't believe). It's straight up impossible to get more than one attack out before you either loose all your planes or have to recall them as they are too low on health to survive another attack. I had several instances of attacking lone battleships in my Zeppelin yesterday, particuarly remembering an attack on a Duke of York, where I went in under boost and swerving at 260knots, attacked one time and was left with one plane after boosting out of the AA-zone to setup another attack. This is flat out stupid.

Rockets are completely useless against battleships, unless you want to set fires. Rocket-attacks on cruisers are circumstantial and actually pretty decent to raze AA-defenses of lone and already damaged ships, but beyond that, they are pretty much your only sensible vector for attacks on DDs. Torpedoes are by far the most important vector for any sort of attack.

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7 hours ago, Madner Kami said:

Avoid flying into the black clouds

sometimes the clouds dont even render and the squad just dies.... and when you line up for a torpedo run, you simply cant dodge.

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1 hour ago, Crossfader said:

sometimes the clouds dont even render and the squad just dies.... and when you line up for a torpedo run, you simply cant dodge.

Haven't had that yet happen to me, to be honest, though I wouldn't be surprised if it does, because the AA effects manage to slow down even my computer (GTX 1080 Ti, 64GB RAM, Ryzen 7 1800X) when things get thick. And well, you can still dodge, you "just" reset your aim. A thing that many people miss though is, that you can also apply "airbrakes" to your planes, slowing them down. That gives you some time when trying to react to AA-explosions, but I get what you are saying and remember many encounters with unspotted Atlantas throwing 6+ explosions right in front of me.

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On 2/1/2019 at 9:47 PM, Madner Kami said:

Just noticing a few things:

Those are not F4U Corsairs, these are F6F Hellcats, Wargaming. Come on, you had the correct planes on this ship before, why the change...

gHxqaWg.jpg

Sigh... Nothing screams rushed development more than things like that...

UrZWBsK.jpg

Why exactly are we using the fastest single-piston-engine german fighter of WW2 as a torpedo- and dive-bomber on the Graf Zeppelin? I mean, the Jericho-trumpets are lovely, but if you insist that the german dive- and torpedo-bombers have to be slow, then don't use the second fastest-prop-driven german fighter plane of the war as a model, but go for what is historically appropriate and use a JU87 or a derivative, even though their tiering would be kinda wierd. But don't mix this up like this... Come on...

UlT9lYX.jpg

Yeh its an odd one, especially as the TA-152 was a high altitude interceptor specifically designed IIRC to target high altitude bombers.

Whats weird is they could have just used late variants of the Fw-190 as plenty of those were converted into ground attack aircraft and essentially replaced the Ju-87s in that role.

Or they could have used the duck.

Or done what they seem to have done with RN carriers and have horizontal bombers. 

 

On 2/2/2019 at 2:46 AM, Crossfader said:

O5u73op.jpg

85 planes kill, still not enough, CV's still got me

What is the point of AA if they can just keep coming, AA mino seems to be one of the best AA ships in 8.0 yet its still doesn't matter, they just respawn and keep coming, all while you lose AA and HP

That is the main issue with them, that and the constant readiness of planes for the endless spam.

Have you watched I-chases Hakuryu vid? He is literally putting 12 torps in the water every 30s pretty much. 

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10 hours ago, tajj7 said:

Have you watched I-chases Hakuryu vid? He is literally putting 12 torps in the water every 30s pretty much. 

yeah i did, its retarded, you dont need data from a live server to knows its broken.........

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17 hours ago, tajj7 said:

That is the main issue with them, that and the constant readiness of planes for the endless spam.

Have you watched I-chases Hakuryu vid? He is literally putting 12 torps in the water every 30s pretty much. 

"Them". I strongly urge everyone to not argue about CVs at large, when it's specific setups that are a problem. Hakuryu can do that and this needs to be adressed. No other carrier can. Graf Zeppelin can zoom around at 260 knots for 20s, no other carrier can do that. (Ironically enough, the only thing that makes Graf Zeppeiin's dive bombers at least semi-useful is it's ability to zoom through the DPS-zones for a drop *and* make it out alive for maybe a second go around, something which no other carrier really can and something that really needs to be adressed soon, because torpedo bombers are basically the only useful attack group, which falls right back again onto the Hakuryu-issue in it's own way.)

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The thing that gets me is you know when you start the battle right you start to load your weapons. Right so why do CV's get to launch squads off their fight decks? where is the bringing of aircraft onto deck from the hanger then launched? Didn't all aircraft need to warm their engines before taking off? I remember specifically the Graf Zeppelin was intended to have an oil warming system to avoid this.

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3 hours ago, LeoAegisMaximus said:

The thing that gets me is you know when you start the battle right you start to load your weapons. Right so why do CV's get to launch squads off their fight decks? where is the bringing of aircraft onto deck from the hanger then launched? Didn't all aircraft need to warm their engines before taking off? I remember specifically the Graf Zeppelin was intended to have an oil warming system to avoid this.

Yeah and BB's needed several hours to get their boilers up to working pressure... i dont think using IRL arguments is a good idea.

The problem is WG concept of CV's be "action" focused means you can have long down times, so if you load into the game and have to wait 30-40 seconds before yo get to do anything, well that goes against their core concept.

The concept is probably never going to work, but they seem hell bent on trying real hard to deepthroat it into the player base.

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10 hours ago, Crossfader said:

Yeah and BB's needed several hours to get their boilers up to working pressure... i dont think using IRL arguments is a good idea.

Less IRL argument: other classes have to load their guns/torps (30 seconds-1 minute+) at the start, cvs don't have to wait.

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On 2/5/2019 at 8:16 AM, Madner Kami said:

"Them". I strongly urge everyone to not argue about CVs at large, when it's specific setups that are a problem. Hakuryu can do that and this needs to be adressed. No other carrier can. Graf Zeppelin can zoom around at 260 knots for 20s, no other carrier can do that. (Ironically enough, the only thing that makes Graf Zeppeiin's dive bombers at least semi-useful is it's ability to zoom through the DPS-zones for a drop *and* make it out alive for maybe a second go around, something which no other carrier really can and something that really needs to be adressed soon, because torpedo bombers are basically the only useful attack group, which falls right back again onto the Hakuryu-issue in it's own way.)

The F key issue is all of them.

The speed issue is generally all of them.

The spam ability, is generally all of them.

There are then particular issues with particular CVs but as a whole their are issues with the whole class and how it has been implemented. 

 

20 hours ago, LeoAegisMaximus said:

The thing that gets me is you know when you start the battle right you start to load your weapons. Right so why do CV's get to launch squads off their fight decks? where is the bringing of aircraft onto deck from the hanger then launched? Didn't all aircraft need to warm their engines before taking off? I remember specifically the Graf Zeppelin was intended to have an oil warming system to avoid this.

Yeh that is part of the problem with the spotting issue for DDs, coupled with the speed they are spotting half the team within the first 20s, and obviously instantly attacking, which other classes simply are not able to do.

Adding some sort of cooldown/cycling/readying of planes would help I think. 

20 hours ago, Crossfader said:

Yeah and BB's needed several hours to get their boilers up to working pressure... i dont think using IRL arguments is a good idea.

The problem is WG concept of CV's be "action" focused means you can have long down times, so if you load into the game and have to wait 30-40 seconds before yo get to do anything, well that goes against their core concept.

The concept is probably never going to work, but they seem hell bent on trying real hard to deepthroat it into the player base.

Yeh its the 'always' in the game concept they want, trouble is, whilst I understand that the old CV system had periods where the CV player wasn't doing much whilst they re-arm/launch squadrons it was necessary for some semblance of balance.

Also CVs are far more action packed than ships, even DDs take a good minute plus before they can get into action, BBs probably don't get to where they want to go until about 2 minutes into the game and cycle their weapons every 30s, so general WOWs play is not that action packed, its a general more relaxed game interspersed with some moments of action.

With the speed of the planes CV players are almost constantly in the action, so they have over shot so to speak and pitched it way beyond what you experience in other classes. 

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