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ZXrage

Lorraine 50 t

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This tank is the biggest bag of shit I've ever seen historical-wise that isnt the Waffletractor, and even that kinda made sense. The tank itself is kinda bad but at this point I've stopped caring about whatever new tier 9 premium WG is cobbling together. Reminds me of Strv K but less historically accurate.
Stats:

 
Lorraine 50 t. Initial parameters:
 
Tier: HT-9, France, special
HP: 1 900
Engine: 980 hp
Mass: 50,00 t
Maximum load: 53,00 t
Power-to-weight: 19,60 hp / t
Max speed/ reverse speed: 50 / -15 km / h
Hull turning speed: 30,00 /s
Turret turning speed: 27,10 /s
Terrain resistance values: 1,055 / 1,151 / 2,014
View range: 380 m
Radio range: 750 m

Hull armor: 155 / 60 / 40 mm
Turret armor: 300 / 80 / 40 mm

Gun: 120 mm D. 1203 P

Alpha Damage: 400 / 400 / 515
Penetration: 264 / 308 / 65 mm
Rate of fire: 4,171 rounds/minute
Damage per minute: 1 668,60
Reload time: 14,384 s
Accuracy at 100 m: 0,384
Aiming time: 2,88 s
Depression/Elevation: -10 / N/A
Shell speed: 1 067 m/s
 

Aim spread:

after firing: 2,877;
during turret rotation: 0.077;
while the vehicle is moving: 0.23;
during vehicle rotation: 0.23;
during turret rotation at maximum speed: 1.99;
at the maximum vehicle speed: 11.51;
at the maximum vehicle rotation speed: 6.90.

Camouflage Values:

stationary tank camouflage: 8.0%;
tank camouflage during motion: 4.0%;
stationary tank camouflage: 1.44%;
tank camouflage during motion: 0.72%

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WTF WG. There is the idea to make it work. No hull armor, good turret. Fast, low dpm super accurate high pen lowe like gun. 

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5 hours ago, hazzgar said:

WTF WG. There is the idea to make it work. No hull armor, good turret. Fast, low dpm super accurate high pen lowe like gun. 

155 with that slope is likely to hit 260 on flat ground

I guess it's an interesting take on the IS-7 concept, making a tank super busted but give it mega shit DPM

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22 minutes ago, lavawing said:

155 with that slope is likely to hit 260 on flat ground

I guess it's an interesting take on the IS-7 concept, making a tank super busted but give it mega shit DPM

You're right, I plugged in the numbers myself into the Lorr 40t's hull (assuming its the same hull, looks like it), and goddamn its ~260 effective dead on. Against AP it's only ~230 effective and I assume against APCR its somewhere in the middle but I severely underestimated the hull. With a dead on value like that though it's more of a low-tier bully on flat terrrain, loads of tier 9s have more than 230 pen. But if it's hulldown oh boy everyone's screwed.

What's with WG and hulldown beasts with these new rewardies? Concept 1B, Strv K, the new UDES technically even though it's squishy, and now this. Gameplay-wise its the same as Concept 1B, Strv K, even AE Phase 1, then what's the point of playing this tank if those exist and i don't have to give up my left testicle for DPM?

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6 hours ago, ZXrage said:

I've stopped caring about whatever new tier 9 premium WG is cobbling together

Take out the 9 and you've basically got my feelings. It would barely surprise me to find out that wargamming is introducing premiums at twice the rate of tech tree tanks. 

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Did WG run out of papertanks so they do this Frankenstein creations now?
The Bourrasque is a Bat12t with a fake EBR105 turret. The E75TS a Löwe turret on a less armored E75 hull.
And here they put the TCB turret, on a Lorraine 40t hull. They put a heavy turret on a light armored medum tank. To make it somewhat believeable they uparmored the Lorraine hull and called it a day.

How does this tirebased suspension handle the weight? Why didn´t they choose the AMX50b or AMX65t hull instead? Both variants would be somewhat realistic. And both were already in the game. Not like they could use this age old SD Models, but still. 

This tank makes no sense apart from looking cool. 

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6 hours ago, hall0 said:

Did WG run out of papertanks so they do this Frankenstein creations now?
The Bourrasque is a Bat12t with a fake EBR105 turret. The E75TS a Löwe turret on a less armored E75 hull.
And here they put the TCB turret, on a Lorraine 40t hull. They put a heavy turret on a light armored medum tank. To make it somewhat believeable they uparmored the Lorraine hull and called it a day.

How does this tirebased suspension handle the weight? Why didn´t they choose the AMX50b or AMX65t hull instead? Both variants would be somewhat realistic. And both were already in the game. Not like they could use this age old SD Models, but still. 

This tank makes no sense apart from looking cool. 

The TCB1 was designed for the AMX 50 120 in the first place. They could literally slap applique on the AMX 50 hull and give it this turret and it would be the same thing, but historical. 

There is no point in there being a 50 tonne Lorraine project because the whole raison d'etre of the 40t lorry is to do everything that the AMX-50 does, but be 10 tonnes lighter.

Like you, I am puzzled at why WG sees the need to invent tanks when there are real candidates with the exact same role.

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33 minutes ago, lavawing said:

historical

hysterical.

 

Ima just go to war thunder for 'historical accuracy' in a pixel tank game. At least i wont have to give a shit about winning and just shoot shit. 

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11 hours ago, MagicalFlyingFox said:

hysterical.

 

Ima just go to war thunder for 'historical accuracy' in a pixel tank game. At least i wont have to give a shit about winning and just shoot shit. 

Why so burned on tanks being historical? They've made most of their tanks close to historical unless thay had to compromise because of a lack of data (E-50 M, WT E-100 come to mind), Edelweiss and Nameless were such obvious fakes that you wouldn't mistake it to be real at all, but this is a tank that has no business being ahistorical especially since there are other real(-ish) tanks that could fill its role.

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1 hour ago, ZXrage said:

Why so burned on tanks being historical? They've made most of their tanks close to historical unless thay had to compromise because of a lack of data (E-50 M, WT E-100 come to mind), Edelweiss and Nameless were such obvious fakes that you wouldn't mistake it to be real at all, but this is a tank that has no business being ahistorical especially since there are other real(-ish) tanks that could fill its role.

268 4 and the entire line.

Maus.

All the Japanese heavies.

The literal 'Fake Tank' FT line. 

I've honestly lost track of all the tanks they literally just bumped up the armour slider or guns they bumped the pen slider to fit into arbitrary balance and still managing to make the game the clusterfuck it is.

They unlinked pen from being 'historical', then they unlinked armour from being 'historical'... You'd think with all this blatant disregard for real life, they'd actually have a balanced game by now. 

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2 hours ago, MagicalFlyingFox said:

268 4 and the entire line.

Maus.

All the Japanese heavies.

The literal 'Fake Tank' FT line. 

I've honestly lost track of all the tanks they literally just bumped up the armour slider or guns they bumped the pen slider to fit into arbitrary balance and still managing to make the game the clusterfuck it is.

They unlinked pen from being 'historical', then they unlinked armour from being 'historical'... You'd think with all this blatant disregard for real life, they'd actually have a balanced game by now. 

-268 v4 and all the tanks that precede it existed, armor notwithstanding.
-The Maus line is also historical, armor also notwithstanding.
-The Japanese heavies may or may not exist, but they have at least existed as an idea within Japanese plans.
-That's China, of course they're not giving anything away. 

Half of the things you listed have historical basis, the only iffy one is the Japanese heavies but they have existed in one way or another, at least as a design concept. I'm not the type of person to shout 'muh historical accuracy' but they have to at least make sense like E-50 M (the E series designs were originally supposed to have rear transmissions). Most of the Chinese tanks we can classify as fake but you can at least see the reasoning behind them existing (China didn't have a lot of indigenous tank designs in the Cold War). Lorraine 50 t is just plain fake when it shouldn't have to be. Same as Bourrasque.

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11 minutes ago, MagicalFlyingFox said:

You clearly have misunderstood the entire basis of my posts. 

All I picked up was you whining that we're whining the Lorraine 50 t doesn't make sense at all because Wargaming hasn't followed historical accuracy for a while now. All I'm trying to say is the shit they're trying to spew has to at least make me believe it came from someone's asshole, when it has not.

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2 hours ago, ZXrage said:

-268 v4 and all the tanks that precede it existed, armor notwithstanding.
-The Maus line is also historical, armor also notwithstanding.
-The Japanese heavies may or may not exist, but they have at least existed as an idea within Japanese plans.
-That's China, of course they're not giving anything away. 

Half of the things you listed have historical basis, the only iffy one is the Japanese heavies but they have existed in one way or another, at least as a design concept. I'm not the type of person to shout 'muh historical accuracy' but they have to at least make sense like E-50 M (the E series designs were originally supposed to have rear transmissions). Most of the Chinese tanks we can classify as fake but you can at least see the reasoning behind them existing (China didn't have a lot of indigenous tank designs in the Cold War). Lorraine 50 t is just plain fake when it shouldn't have to be. Same as Bourrasque.

 

Polish tanks. Seriously. Low tiers existed. We had good tanks leading to WW2 but everything post that were drawings. Some were drawings not even made by people who were anywhere close to making tanks in the first place.

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EBR 105.... 

 

There are other 2 other 105mm wheelies they could have used, they didnt need to fucking make one up. 

 

 

Expecting this game to even loosely abide by reality is putting your eggs in the wrong basket. 

This hill was already bulldozed years ago, no point in dying over what is long gone. 

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makes me wonder if there's some kind of national govt royalty/licencing thing still in effect because the tanks are more recent so WG has to file the serial numbers off to avoid that

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11 hours ago, MagicalFlyingFox said:

EBR 105.... 

 

There are other 2 other 105mm wheelies they could have used, they didnt need to fucking make one up. 

 

 

Expecting this game to even loosely abide by reality is putting your eggs in the wrong basket. 

This hill was already bulldozed years ago, no point in dying over what is long gone. 

There is still a big difference between bending reality to make tanks fit for the tier they sit (Maus comes to mind), adding ``what-if-tanks`` to complete a line (E50m) adding a whole line of questionable tanks, for marketing purpose (polish, chinese, japan heavys) who, in case of polish and japan atleast add something different and unique)

Or making a fake tank, for the sake of a fake tank, why pick lorraine hull and put turret, instead of amx-120 hull? its a copy paste, and 1 is sort of real, and the other is not only fake, but also makes no sense (a lorraine with bigger turret and much more armour, yet 50 tons, with wheels on tracks?)

This is just stupid, even the WTF-E100 is more real, the gun was real and they hull was real, so putting the gun on the hull and weld some sheet metal thing around for rain is more real as this lorraine 50t...

Some things are just more fake as others, and this really pushes the line, and to make it 10x worse for no reason also, the lorraine hull with more armour offers nothing an Amx-120 hull also wouldnt offer...

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I'm still waiting for them to decide what to do with all these tier 9 prems. Are they thinking bong shop or outright selling them. They can't all be rewards. And if selling will they start offering credit benefits? It is the natural progression of how to power creep the power creep 8s.

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6 hours ago, GehakteMolen said:

There is still a big difference between bending reality to make tanks fit for the tier they sit (Maus comes to mind), adding ``what-if-tanks`` to complete a line (E50m) adding a whole line of questionable tanks, for marketing purpose (polish, chinese, japan heavys) who, in case of polish and japan atleast add something different and unique)

Or making a fake tank, for the sake of a fake tank, why pick lorraine hull and put turret, instead of amx-120 hull? its a copy paste, and 1 is sort of real, and the other is not only fake, but also makes no sense (a lorraine with bigger turret and much more armour, yet 50 tons, with wheels on tracks?)

This is just stupid, even the WTF-E100 is more real, the gun was real and they hull was real, so putting the gun on the hull and weld some sheet metal thing around for rain is more real as this lorraine 50t...

Some things are just more fake as others, and this really pushes the line, and to make it 10x worse for no reason also, the lorraine hull with more armour offers nothing an Amx-120 hull also wouldnt offer...

Is it really though?
 

If we didn't have the others we wouldn't have this abomination. WG clearly have disregarded reality, this is just a natural progression of their incompetance and ignorance. Besides, don't we already have a precedent set with the bourrasque? 

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7 hours ago, arthurwellsley said:

FV101 Scorpion on service in Iraq.

Bonus if you can tell me where in the tech tree this real life UK light tank appears?

It was sure not from a lack of trying. "But the 90mm was too new!", "and here's a British document showing it was mounted just outside the (at the time) max date but inside the timeframe other vehicle modules were introduced." "But the armour's aluminum!" "And here's measurements of all the armour faces and a realistic coversion formula and figures to compare it to standard steel."

At the very least with the British light line, all the tanks actually were drawn/modeled in detail. With extras depending on what you consider "prototypes"

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