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Casual_Boops

Opinion: WN8 should be based on base XP rather than damage and kills

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Disclaimer: This is only my opinion-- you are welcome to disagree. I don't pretend to assume that my opinion is the only correct answer.

 

The calculation for WN8 is largely based on damage and kills in a particular game, and at this point ignores spotting damage and tracking assistance. This method of measurement encourages chai sniping, because it doesn't matter if you're spotting your own damage or not-- damage is damage as far as WN8 is concerned. In this way, in my opinion, WN8 is a sub-optimal way of measuring a person's effectiveness and proficiency in battle, and it creates an incentive to farm damage rather than putting oneself in danger (for instance, it's better for your WN8 to farm damage in a light tank from the back than it is to be spotting for others, even if this leads to the loss of the game). 

 

For this reason, I think that base XP (which would ignore the effects of premium time and win/loss bonuses) should be the number that WN8 is based on for each tank (rather than damage an kills). A given tank would have a baseline base XP score that each game would be counted against and the WN8 number would be generated based on the difference between the end score and the baseline score. For instance, 1500 base XP is substantially better than, say, an average game that has something like 600 base XP, so that game would probably be somewhere around 4,000 WN8. In this way, I believe WN8 could have a more complete, holistic measure of a player's proficiency at certain tanks, and the measure would be less prone to padding. Best of all, legacy statistics have always included XP, so it could be possible to change things over to the new measuring methodology without losing data from the games that have been played since 2010. 

 

What say you, wotlabs forum?

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If you can find historic base xp without multipliers, then sure xp would make a great metric.

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User-made ratings were basically developed because WG doesn't use base xp, but mixes up base and premium xp. Had base xp (without premium and without some tank's modifier) been an available stat from the start, that would basically have been a very good metric, probably leading to much less and certainly less successful user-developed ratings.

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16 hours ago, Casual_Boops said:

I didn't realize that the API muddled together the base XP scores of premium and standard accounts. What a shame.

Furthermore WG isn't playing with open cards. WG never made it public how base xp is calculated. We know some things for example a kill in a winning game is around 50 XP, if I remember it correctly, but there are also things that make little to no sense like close range damage multiplicator. Makes sense for some heavies and TDs but for the rest ... .

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Yeah, the XP modifiers were skewed towards how close you were to the tank being damaged.  I had some of screenshots of games where a medium doing 4k damage from range would get out XP'd by a RU heavy that did 1500 damage nose to nose with the enemy.  WN8 (7?) was a lot better metric for evaluating skill in 2014-17 than it is now, but WG has never come clean on how exactly (key word being exactly) XP is determined.

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Spotting for yourself plays a significant part. I guess as part of wg modelling a risk component. Hence if people are redlining they will be missing out on a lot of xp (but not wn8...).

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Wn8 has never been a great measure of skill on it's own. It's prone to too many ways of padding like the OP pointed out. However, every metric, if viewed by itself, can be padded.

Indeed, any metric used as a measure of skill will inevitably be padded. To paraphrase Goodhart's law (used in economics) " When a measure becomes a target, it ceases to be a good measure." Any metric used to measure a system will be exploited and will cease to be a good metric because of that exploitation.

To get a decent picture of someone's skill, you want to take a look at a combination of stats that will cover each other's weaknesses.

For instance, if you take recent Wn8, recent winrate (to avoid redline campers), recent average tier (to avoid low-tier stat/winrate padders), and DPG/marks at tier 10, you have a decent picture of how good a player is.

Then, assuming you're evaluating them for Clan Wars, you would get them in a few detachments to see how they play as part of a team.

Basically, you use stats to narrow down your recruitment pool, and then use their performance in Clan Wars as a final deciding factor.

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