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deetz

I feel useless in most of my matches. Advice I take seems to not work a good deal of the time.

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So. I've had all sorts of advice given to me. I've read tons of guides. I know where to shoot someone, how to angle myself, how to go hull down, and understand the sight system decently well. I know what pretty much all of the tanks are, and I generally know how much they're going to damage me for. If I can, I read sela's map guides for the map I'm on and usually follow.

 

The problem is, all of this knowledge seems to just not work. It seems to be impossibly hard just to play with a winrate above 50 with a WN7 above 1000 for me. I'll use my last few matches as example.

 

Hellcat, Lakeville, South spawn, Tier 6 match.

A few tanks head to valley to engage in getting nowhere. Our best tanks head to city to fight things. I can't think of anything else to do, and have binocs + camonet + 90% camo skill, so I head down middle and sit just behind a rock. I spot one thing, take 2 bad hits, and end up with 81 health left. An AT 8 starts coming down middle so I head back to base. I sit there for a short bit as city succeeded. I then move up as the tanks that came down middle are dead. I spot a camping heavy, quickly put a shot into it, and get killed. Our team goes on to win. I feel useless, etc.

 

KV-13, Fisherman's Bay, North spawn, Tier 9 match.

I can't really think of anything else to do so I just head to mid without going to the road in that runs across the middle the other way. TDs camp west, heavies and stuff head to town. I just end up moving around uselessly (putting one shot into an AMX 12t), then running back to a rock when their Type 59 and T-54 decide to start wreaking havoc on our tanks in town. I put 2-3 shots in the side of the type 59 from a distance, then get killed from behind. We lose, I feel useless.

 

KV-1S, Lakeville, South spawn, Tier 7 match.

Our team divides pretty evenly between valley and town, and a hellcat head up middle. While heading to town, I take a hit from a Nashorn. By the time I reach town there are people doing stuff behind the big building and I can't really do much due to the enemy KV-1S and Churchill VII right ahead of me. A KV-3 and I end up peekabooming with them. The KV-1S dies, and the church becomes a one-shot. I come out with a good deal of my health left to finish him off. He sets me on fire with the first hit, I die. Our team ends up winning, I feel useless.

 

T49, Ensk, South spawn, Tier 6 match.

 Our team has two people head to field and the rest head to town. I head a bit down the 6 line to try to take shots at whatever the enemy is doing. I stay at F6 because the enemy's advance is staying around F2. I take a few shots at the Excelsior and 2 Nashorns before I get tracked by some Hellcat I didn't see and rushed by the two Nashorns, following with my death. We lose, I feel more useless than usual.

 

People might tell me to take breaks, and I do. If it's going like shit, I stop, watch an episode of Cowboy Bebop or whatever, and come right back to another 500 damage Hellcat battle.

It feels extremely hard for me just to break 1000 WN7 in a session, and just as hard to go over 50% winrate. I seriously, seriously want to get better at this game. But it seems close to impossible.

I am posting this here like this because nothing I try seems to work, and I end up not even carrying my weight most of my battles, and when I do tons of damage (more than 1.5k is a lot for me) we usually end up losing somehow.

 

This forum is presumably filled with people who have improved greatly as well as excellent players. Please, please help me. 

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I recommend posting some replays here, just pick 5 consecutive games and upload them to wotreplays.com or noobmeter.com.

Also the mentoring thread is a good place to go. 

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I recommend posting some replays here, just pick 5 consecutive games and upload them to wotreplays.com or noobmeter.com.

Also the mentoring thread is a good place to go. 

I'll put a few up tomorrow.

 

EDIT: I found a few minutes so I picked out a few completely random ones. http://www.mediafire.com/download/kk54nokpxhysgbr/Replays.rar

 

EDIT2: Also the last post in that mentoring thread has more of my replays on it from a few days ago.

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Well your 60 day averages are better than your overall stats so you're not going backwards.

 

In your KV-1S game you died a fiery death. In your T-49 game you got tracked and then blown up. Please tell me you aren't playing without consumables!

 

Also you seem to be running a lot of tier 6s for someone with only 3k games. Are your crews good? Personally I don't go past tier 5 without 100% crews, and at least some progress along repairs or camo for first skill..

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In your KV-1S game you died a fiery death. In your T-49 game you got tracked and then blown up. Please tell me you aren't playing without consumables!

 

 

I am a friend of deetz (or de3tz, whatever) and I'm pretty sure he doesn't use consumables but feel free to prove me wrong deetz/de3tz (whatever one)

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Why not?

 

Even at full price, a fire extinguisher or repair kit pays for itself if it means you land one more 122mm shot!

 

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I'll try to load some consumables before going into my next battle, hopefully to prolong my life a bit. Thanks for the small tip. Truthfully I don't know why I haven't been.

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Set aside a few hundred thousand credits for the next consumables sale and stock those babies up I say.

 

And a million or so for the next equipment sale. Rammers and Gun Laying drives for all!

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I haven't had a chance to look at your replays, but I have been (and still am) where you are.

 

I study and study and think and go over replays and watch the streams and analyze and... all the knowledge seems to be there, but somehow, things never seem to flow for me as easily as it does for truly good players. I use the strategies and spots and techniques that they show and teach, but somehow I just don't get the results they do.

 

But I'm a lot better than I was.

 

I think the key is accepting that there probably won't ever be "the moment when it clicks".

 

I hope, and work on the premise, that some day I'll look up and just be better than I thought I could be.

 

In fact, every day is that day recently. Even when I have abysmal days (like yesterday) I realize that my win rate sucked, but I was playing higher tiers than usual and did almost 400 dpg more than my over. almost half a kill per game better than my overall.

 

As long as your current (30 day) is still climbing... just chill. Keep doing what you've seen.

 

Eventually the changes that are necessary from the "text books" you've been studying will be apparent. They're tiny things. Flexing 20 seconds earlier. Choosing a bush 10 meters to the left of the one you saw on the Unicum stream. Poking the map even though most of your pubbies won't listen because 1 or 2 will and that will make the difference.

 

I mostly solo pub. My recent win rate isn't an accident, but it isn't because of my damage and kills. It's because I'm starting to see how my knowledge can change the outcome of games, even if it isn't my tank that directly makes the difference.

 

You're learning where your mere presence can influence things.

 

That kind of subtle, Obi Won Kenobi, Mr. Myagi shit takes time to nurture, but I hope and believe it's worth it.

 

Keep learning and keep doing what you see the best doing. In time, you'll figure out how that 10 meters of difference wins game.

 

At least that's what I keep telling myself. ;)

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My stats are worse than yours.... BUT one thing stood out when I read your post.

 

On the second Lakeville in the KV-1S you said you got shot heading to town.

Why?  Usually if i get shot heading to town it's because I tried to shoot something on the lake road or something that I shouldn't have. I'm now a target for the enemy. If I don't take that shot and leave it for someone else (or until I get to cover) I don't lose those extra hp.

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you're not going to improve by applying random strategies you read about on the Internet.

 

Just play to the best of your capabilities, and look back on what mistakes you made and correct them.

 

I didn't give a shit about my stats until I had like 2k WN7 lmao

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I haven't had a chance to look at your replays, but I have been (and still am) where you are.

 

I study and study and think and go over replays and watch the streams and analyze and... all the knowledge seems to be there, but somehow, things never seem to flow for me as easily as it does for truly good players. I use the strategies and spots and techniques that they show and teach, but somehow I just don't get the results they do.

 

But I'm a lot better than I was.

 

I think the key is accepting that there probably won't ever be "the moment when it clicks".

 

I hope, and work on the premise, that some day I'll look up and just be better than I thought I could be.

 

In fact, every day is that day recently. Even when I have abysmal days (like yesterday) I realize that my win rate sucked, but I was playing higher tiers than usual and did almost 400 dpg more than my over. almost half a kill per game better than my overall.

 

As long as your current (30 day) is still climbing... just chill. Keep doing what you've seen.

 

Eventually the changes that are necessary from the "text books" you've been studying will be apparent. They're tiny things. Flexing 20 seconds earlier. Choosing a bush 10 meters to the left of the one you saw on the Unicum stream. Poking the map even though most of your pubbies won't listen because 1 or 2 will and that will make the difference.

 

I mostly solo pub. My recent win rate isn't an accident, but it isn't because of my damage and kills. It's because I'm starting to see how my knowledge can change the outcome of games, even if it isn't my tank that directly makes the difference.

 

You're learning where your mere presence can influence things.

 

That kind of subtle, Obi Won Kenobi, Mr. Myagi shit takes time to nurture, but I hope and believe it's worth it.

 

Keep learning and keep doing what you see the best doing. In time, you'll figure out how that 10 meters of difference wins game.

 

At least that's what I keep telling myself. ;)

Standing ovation. I have hit a wall stat wise, my laptop just makes some shots impossible.

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Consumables are really vital. I rarely end battle without at least one used (mostly repair kit). Getting sixth sense in any of your tanks will help you in learning good and bad spots. Without it find places that have hard cover really close to hide in case of need. And don't try to be first one pushing unless you are really sure - you can observe others how they get damaged or not while supporting them.

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Eventually the changes that are necessary from the "text books" you've been studying will be apparent. They're tiny things. Flexing 20 seconds earlier. Choosing a bush 10 meters to the left of the one you saw on the Unicum stream. Poking the map even though most of your pubbies won't listen because 1 or 2 will and that will make the difference.

 

 

 

+1

 

Have begun to notice other small things recently, for example, in endgame, a tracer from previously unspotted enemy goes flying passed your tank: before it was like, panic, turn, have a look, think of options, panic, try to get off a shot before next shot comes in and kills you.   This still sometimes happens, but as games and experience are being slowly accumulated, the thought process is slowly becoming more instinctive (as soon as tracer appears you *know* it must have been the T34, you know you have X-seconds before it can fire again, and you've already turned around to head for that small dip which will give just enough cover - which you suspect you get get to in X-1 seconds.

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My stats are worse than yours.... BUT one thing stood out when I read your post.

 

On the second Lakeville in the KV-1S you said you got shot heading to town.

Why?  Usually if i get shot heading to town it's because I tried to shoot something on the lake road or something that I shouldn't have. I'm now a target for the enemy. If I don't take that shot and leave it for someone else (or until I get to cover) I don't lose those extra hp.

No, I wouldn't try that in lakeville in my 1S. I suspect they had a sneaky spotter in the bush at mid from north.

 

Also, thank all of you for the helpful replies.

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  +1 to everything Derpinator said.

 

  To which I will add a bit of my own experience:  the more you feel like you know what to do, the more frustrating it is (at least for me) when you don't do that.  I liken it to a golf swing.  When you've studied it a lot, had a lot of lessons, and the like, you pretty much know the moment you hit the ball almost everything you did wrong . . . but that doesn't mean you didn't do it. :)  It's practice, it's consistency.  It will feel like three steps forwards and two steps backwards (at least it does for me -- for example, I was about 65% solopub last weekend, and I'm about 38% this week).  Realize a lot of this is mental/psychological too:  learn from the last game, know what you did wrong, and then forget about it.

 

  

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I've taken a look at the PzIV.S review, because it's closer to the tanks I play.

 

Now, this is a pretty short run, for reasons we'll talk about later, but the first thing I noticed was you start the game by reversing, it's faster to turn around and go forwards than reverse.  You go west flank to the village, which is where I'd probably be with a medium, and you reach this point:

 

shot_036_zps55f3ff70.jpg

 

Now, it's quite hard to see because Photobucket is the enemy of resolutions, but from here you have a line of sight on that SU-100Y, but chances are good he hasn't seen you because of the other shrubbery in between you and you have a T49 forward of you as well.  If you moved forwards until you could just drop your gun on him, you'd have a shot there.  Taking early shots will make enemies seek cover and can blunt their aggression, even if you get revealed doing it because that can make them stop and shoot back, staggering their advance (as soon as you shoot back down the hill).  Instead you move diagonally to put the house between you and him, which might give you cover from him, but also means you can't shoot him.  When you have the initiative, as you do here, capitalise on it.

 

You continue to advance past that point, in a tank that's generally most comfortable at range, until this happens:

 

shot_037_zps3f1ed74f.jpg

 

SU-100Y, KV-1S, and M6 all in front of you, basically three out of four of the enemy's most dangerous guns are right in front of you and they are advancing.  At this point you should be nope.gif and out of there, I would say back along the 8 line and then around to where those hellcats are, hoping that the rest of your team on that flank dies slow enough to let you regroup with them and have a fighting chance to either hit them from the hill or push them back out of the base.  Instead you move forwards with predictable results.

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Consumables and premium ammo are a one time expense that will always be there if you don't use them.

 

First aid kit, repair kit, fire extinguisher on 90% of tanks. 

 

Always carry like ~6 premium ammo shells minimum. If youre in a tier 7 and come up against an e 75, you need some help to pen him. 

 

A guy on reddit asked for similar advice and this is what I told him. I'm by no means a great player but I think I'm ok so others can feel free to disagree with what I say, it's just my own opinion. 

 

 

I'm a very similar player level to you. Closing in on 2200 battles played and I just hit purple 60 day WN7. Some things I've learned that made me a better player.

  • learn to sidescrape in your heavy tanks (youtube it)

  • learn how camo and spotting mechanics work (read the wiki)

  • download a mod that lets you zoom out far. Every time you have 3-5 seconds downtime (reloading or whatever) look around you. Make decisions based off this information

  • Never get yourself into a situation you can't escape from. For example, on Hill in Himmelsdorf, flanking around the side of the church may seem like a good move but if people then just flank you from behind because the scrubs that were holding it fell back or all died then you're now in trouble.

  • Download xvm. Turn off win rate chance calculation. You want to know who is good and bad on either team. Red players are a part of the game that you must learn to deal with. Shepherd them like sheep and they will usually do what you ask.

  • Play fully upgraded tanks, have a good crew, have proper equipment, use proper consumables. My latest tank is a T29, I'm currently at 2/10 wins with it because I did none of the above.

  • Premium time costs money but makes the game less grindy and for me more enjoyable as a result. Its something like €20 for 5500 gold and 5000 of that will give you 2 whole months of premium time.

  • Don't be afraid to use gold ammo (buy it with credits not gold). Always carry at least 5 premium shells, if you don't use them, it dosen't cost you anything to have them sit there other than the upfront purchase.

  • Watch videos of good players. Some youtube channels I've been watching are: quickybaby, JunkersHiryu and the tanking with crab series on HerrHeinkelWulf's channel. Watch Sela's stream on twitch, watch Anfields youtube and twitch stream.

  • Hp is a resource. Conserve it early game and spend it late game. Having the ability to easily trade shots with a half hp IS-3 when you're at 1500 hp makes it easy to mop up a team in the late stages of a game.

  • Learn weakspots. Lower plate, cupola, drivers hatch. Aim every shot. Learn how to track someone (front or rear road wheel is always good) when they are in a bad position so your team can do damage to them

  • Don't try and solo a flank. If all your team lemmings to one side, either go with them or dig in in the best defensive position you can. Don't try going aggro and charge down towards them. I've held 5-6 tier 8 and 9 tanks on my own in a lower tier tank for a minute or two simply because I positioned in an area where I could take shots on them as they came to me and most players are too bad to realise when they should go aggro and end up just sitting there at 600m trying to snipe your copula with their Kv1s or whatever.

  • Survive more games by thinking the outcome of your decisions through. The tomatos on your team are not the reason your yolorush failed, you are. Reflect on your games and what went wrong, correct them, become a better player.

I could go on and on but pretty much the core of improving is actively trying to improve yourself and actually going about doing it. Reading all this is useless if you have the same mindset as you do now, in the future. Realise that you need to improve and always think about what you did wrong and how you should have acted.

Also, I have a rule that is 3 losses in a row means a 10 minute break or even be done for the night. Helps with the stress levels some times

 

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I'm sorry, this question is really vague. However, what is it that wins a match? I've just come back from another loss streak, and in most of these games I've done a good amount of damage, or just been totally crushed instantly. It's once again seeming to be impossible just to win a match.

 

I just can't understand how winning comes so easily to some people. So I would ask again. How is a match won? I mean, you can do 1k+ damage to a few tanks while your team melts in some other place and you lose anyways. But how do you put your gun in the right place, to affect the tide of the match and actually stop your team from melting?

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I'm sorry, this question is really vague. However, what is it that wins a match? I've just come back from another loss streak, and in most of these games I've done a good amount of damage, or just been totally crushed instantly. It's once again seeming to be impossible just to win a match.

 

I just can't understand how winning comes so easily to some people. So I would ask again. How is a match won? I mean, you can do 1k+ damage to a few tanks while your team melts in some other place and you lose anyways. But how do you put your gun in the right place, to affect the tide of the match and actually stop your team from melting?

There is never 1 thing that will 100% always win a match. and every match is different, so I can't so oh it's easy just xxx.

 

The best way to win a match is reading the minimap and applying your knowledge of the flow of battle etc. See that a flank is going to fall before it falls and either re-enforce it, or set yourself up to clean the scraps, stuff like that.

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Basic consumables, 6th sense, the right equipment, getting top modules for tanks and not just running down lines and even just a couple gold rounds for when you get in a tough spot should be considered mandatory for anyone asking help. Once you have that foundation you can start to build on it with game skills, map knowledge, enemy tank knowledge etc.

 

Just those few things can be game changers. 

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Basic consumables, 6th sense, the right equipment, getting top modules for tanks and not just running down lines and even just a couple gold rounds for when you get in a tough spot should be considered mandatory for anyone asking help. Once you have that foundation you can start to build on it with game skills, map knowledge, enemy tank knowledge etc.

 

Just those few things can be game changers. 

 

I've had it with tanks without this skill. It killed my stats early on (along with my suckitude) and now I'm finding that any tank that doesn't have it is just not fun.

 

Here's the bonus though: I have a couple of "trainer" tanks in each of my three main lines (US, USSR, Germany) that CAN be played without it, and that I do well in without it - this means as soon as my commander has it in these tanks, I can just pop him out into any other tank. Greatness!

 

And they all happen to be tier 5/6 or 7 ( a couple of premiums ), which make a buttload of credits.

 

I recommend not rushing up lines and playing a lot of games in your trainer tanks. If you don't have them, get them. You have fun, win games, make credits and never have to "grind" higher tier tanks... well, almost never - I'm looking at you King Tiger.

 

My "trainers":

 

US - T1 Heavy, M6, Sherman Jumbo (thank you CrabEatOff for pointing out that you should use 'forgiving' tanks for this purpose)

USSR - T-34, KV-1 and 1S, SU-85B, SU 122-44

Germany: T-25, Stug III and maybe keeping the JPIV (people hate it but I seem to do really well in it for some reason).

 

Really, the tank doesn't matter much as long as it's 4-7 and you enjoy it and do well in it.

 

I happen to love all of these tanks and my success ranges from "meh" to "way better than server average" in them, but again that's not the point. I enjoy playing them and can train crews in them without problems.

 

I highly recommend this approach.

 

I still struggle through my X2 on my 'grind' tanks (T-71, 12t, Tiger II) but most of my games are played in tanks that I just enjoy playing.

 

Cromwell - hug. :D

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And if you just take the Commander then the new one in your training tank will get double XP every game through Accelerated Crew Training as well, halving the time to grind him up to Sixth Sense as well...

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I'm sorry, this question is really vague. However, what is it that wins a match? I've just come back from another loss streak, and in most of these games I've done a good amount of damage, or just been totally crushed instantly. It's once again seeming to be impossible just to win a match.

 

I just can't understand how winning comes so easily to some people. So I would ask again. How is a match won? I mean, you can do 1k+ damage to a few tanks while your team melts in some other place and you lose anyways. But how do you put your gun in the right place, to affect the tide of the match and actually stop your team from melting?

 

Get the idea that winning is easy out of your head. It's not easy. I mean, I'm sure there's a couple of freaks out there who just picked up the game and happened to be unicums right of the bat, but most people started out as baddies and worked their way up. This game is very difficult, it requires a huge amount of knowledge, focus and decision making. I can't speak for others, but when I play this game, I always perform poorly when I'm not devoting 100% of my attention to what's going on on my screen. Whenever I'm not constantly reevaluating my position and my options on the map, I'm just begging to make a potentially costly mistake. There's a myriad of actions you can perform in WoT, and 99% of them are not the right ones.

 

 

First off, you're not going to win all of them. It's not even close to being possible. The best players on the server lose 35% of their games while soloing. It's absurd, considering how good they are, but that's the way it is.

 

Secondly, consistency is key. Even the best players have games where they just potato (or are unlucky) and end up landing 2 shots before dying. What makes them good players is that they minimize how frequently this occurs.

 

Thirdly, learn to deal with MM. The matchmaker hates everyone equally, yet some people still figure out a way to blame it for their failures. Make no mistake, even the best players will have a tough time running their Tier VIIIs in a Tier X match. No matter how much you adjust your play, at the end of the day your tank is just not as good as the tanks you're facing. That's no reason to just derp around though. Adjust your play, play more conservatively and support higher tiers. And when you do end up top tier, then you have no excuse. Good players achieve ridiculous DPG levels by dealing absurd damage whenever they're the top tanks in a battle. A game where you deal 1.6k damage in your Tier VIII when 80% of the enemy team is tier 7 and below is a bad game. You should be aiming for twice that amount to compensate for all the Tier X games in which you most likely won't be doing shit.

 

Finally, download XVM and look at what good players do. Follow them if you have the same type of tank as they do, be on the same flank if you don't so you can still see what they're up to. Don't be in their way, but try and see the things they do that you don't. Some spots are safe only in certain situations, others are safe up until a specific location. The only way to learn these things by yourself is to try them out and see when and how you die.

 

And as other people have mentioned, forget about stats. Stats are useful, but they're really only just a metric for how good you're playing. When I say "aim for 3k damage", what I'm really saying is "be in the right spot, use your tanks' strengths and make good decisions". Notice how none of them have anything to do with actually dealing damage but they will still help you achieve higher DPG.

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